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The Truth About Mormonism
townhall.com ^ | April 15, 2012 | Stephen Smoot

Posted on 04/15/2012 9:22:28 AM PDT by Kaslin

“Being a Mormon isn't an easy path.”

Heather Beeseck, a sophomore secondary education major at Potomac State College, would know. She has been involved with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints for two years and was baptized into the faith on August 6, 2011.

The Church, according to the National Review, is the fourth largest religious organization in the United States. Its numbers expand at 2.5 percent higher rates than the Roman Catholic Church and may soon pass the United Methodist Church in size.

Matt Slick of the Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry published estimates that 800 people per day joined the faith. Just under 12 million worship in it worldwide.

Despite their growing strength of numbers, Mormons face a unique challenge of perception. Media coverage is usually the first time that non Mormons are exposed to the faith. As Beeseck explains, “Many people have never met a Latter-Day Saint. Five years ago, I hadn't. The media is all some people ever know about the church, and even once those individuals meet a Mormon, they don't always revise their opinions.”

This can be problematic, as when Lawrence O’Donnell of MSNBC claims that Mormonism was “invented” to excuse “Joseph Smith’s infidelity.” Or when the Huffington Post’s Andrea Stone implies that Mitt Romney has some power to change Church doctrine.

Tom O’Neill, vice chair of the West Virginia Republican Party, has been a Church member for 20 years and active in it for almost a quarter century. He does not see most media coverage as overtly malicious, but says that negative stories “are more often than not the products of misunderstanding.”

Beeseck agrees and states that “for or the most part, the media tries to get its facts right, or at least be believable for their audience.” She then warns that, “when they do get it wrong, the average person believes them.”

Misconceptions stem from salacious accusations about the faith, especially coverage of renegade polygamist cults. Covering these stories without mentioning that the Church does not condone polygamy leaves a false impression in the public mind. For example, Mike Taibbi narrated a segment on NBC’s Rock Center that highlighted an ancestor of Romney’s from the 1800s who fled to Mexico to escape prosecution for polygamy. For some reason, NBC considered this a relevant story to run on the eve of the New Hampshire primary.

Media coverage also tends to describe Mormons as systematically oppressing minorities, homosexuals, and women. They also imply that there are mysterious “secretive rituals.” Some outlets on the fringe of, or outside, the mainstream media do blatantly attack Mormonism. As National Review deputy editor Kevin Williamson writes “there are few if any websites dedicated to ‘unmasking’ the Presbyterian Church U.S.A., but there are dozens dedicated to Mormons.”

The Stone story, featured in the Huffington Post last February, took the Church to task over posthumous proxy baptism of Jewish victims of the Holocaust. O’Neill explains (which is necessary, because Stone does not) that the baptisms are not conversions and that recipients are not considered members of the Church. “The practice is based on a biblical understanding that baptism is a rite essential for salvation, together with the Church’s belief in the inviolate ability of a person to choose for themselves whether or not to accept and ratify, in the hereafter, the baptism performed on their behalf.” Stone did quote a Church spokesman as saying that the practice did not have official sanction.

The story also describes how Mitt Romney refused to respond to calls that he try to force the Church to halt the practice, which is akin to demanding that John F. Kennedy over a half century ago convince the Pope to allow clerical marriage.

One of the largest misconceptions is that Mormons are a single unit of voters that will automatically line up behind one of their own. Media types generally, and falsely, assume that groupthink predominates (or should predominate) over individual choices. Traditional teachings of Mormonism frown upon unthinking acceptance of a political leader. One verse from the Mormon Book of Mosiah states, “Now I say unto you, that because all men are not just it is not expedient that ye should have a king or kings to rule over you”

Beeseck speculates that many Mormons, because of the importance of free agency to their faith, may tend to support Ron Paul. She also says that fear of ramped up intolerance might drive some believers away from voting for Romney. The media often demonstrates a fatal analytical flaw in their analysis of religion, race, and gender in politics. They assume that all members of a group will, or should, vote as s single collective bloc, regardless of individual beliefs. These assumptions also reveal the most important misconception held by political types, that everyone is as obsessed with politics as they are.

The blogger “Ablayn” on MormonPerspectives.com states that even sympathetic coverage misses the mark. “In an attempt to seem evenhanded, they never reach understanding. They never talk about what Mormonism means to the heart of the believer.”

Some of the problems encountered by Mormons in media perception of their church might originate in how the Church evolved in its dealings with the public and the press. O’Neill describes how violence and legal assaults against the Mormon church in the 19th century created “a culture within the Church of introversion.” Threats of violence drove believers out of Missouri and Illinois before the Civil War. In 1903, the US Senate refused allow Reed Smoot (no known relation to the author) to take his seat for four years because he also served in the Church.

This difficult history means that, although the last half-century has seen strong attempts at outreach, the Mormon church has traditionally been turned inward. This contributes to an unintentional air of mystery seen by the general public.

Possibly some pundits have read the Mormon holy writings, which do contradict typical liberal and left wing ideologies. The writings in some cases portray excessive authority and taxation as leading to a breakdown of civil society. Another verse from Mosiah, for example, reads, “and thus they were supported in their laziness, and in their idolatry . . . by the taxes which king Noah had put upon his people; thus did the people labor exceedingly to support iniquity.”

The media often misses positive Mormon stories, such as former NBA player Shawn Bradley’s involvement in a school for troubled youth. Bishop Daniel Peterson described in the Deseret News how his work often focused on helping “people suffering the consequences of drug and alcohol abuse, mental illness, emotional problems, dysfunctional families, poverty, various chronic limitations, joblessness and despair.” Nearly 50,000 missionaries serve somewhere in the world at any given time.

A news media that deigns to preach fairness, diversity, and tolerance to Christians needs to practice the same when it comes to Christians.

O’Neill emphasizes the similarities between Mormons and other Christians. “We are not out to ‘convert the world,’ but to offer an invitation to those who are looking for something. We’re pretty normal, regular people, and we just want to help make our communities better places.”

Beeseck offered her own personal insight, saying “My faith is my life.”


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: biglove; dogabuser; magicunderwear; romneymormon; sourcetitlenoturl
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1 posted on 04/15/2012 9:22:31 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin

Every religion has a built in persecution complex.......


2 posted on 04/15/2012 9:27:43 AM PDT by Red Badger (Think logically. Act normally.................)
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To: Kaslin

I’ll take a Mormon over a communist!!!


3 posted on 04/15/2012 9:33:26 AM PDT by ontap
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To: Kaslin


"...who, being themselves but fallible and uninspired men, have assumed dominion over the faith of others, setting up their own opinions and modes of thinking as the only true and infallible, and as such endeavoring to impose them on others, hath established and maintained false religions over the greatest part of the world, and through all time;
 
...
 
 that it is time enough for the rightful purposes of civil government, for its officers to interfere when principles break out into overt acts against peace and good order; and finally, that truth is great and will prevail if left to herself, that she is the proper and sufficient antagonist to error, and has nothing to fear from the conflict, unless by human interposition disarmed of her natural weapons, free argument and debate, errors ceasing to be dangerous when it is permitted freely to contradict them. "
 
"I HAVE SWORN UPON THE ALTAR OF GOD ETERNAL HOSTILITY TO EVERY FORM OF TYRANNY OVER THE MIND OF MAN"
--The Virginia Act For Establishing Religious Freedom
--Thomas Jefferson, 1786

 

"The [my] only connection [to the Republican Party]is I'm registered as a Republican"
--Mitt RRRRRomney
 
 

4 posted on 04/15/2012 9:39:09 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Kaslin

[Heather Beeseck, a sophomore secondary education major at Potomac State College, would know. She has been involved with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints for two years and was baptized into the faith on August 6, 2011. ]

Nkay Heather.

Please tell the class all about the Mormon Doctrine of [Murder] Blood Atonement.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=Blood+atonement+mormonism&oq=Blood+atonement+mormonism

And then tell us about Planet Kolob and Jose's magic Underwear.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=frgbld&gs_nf=1&cp=12&gs_id=2&xhr=t&q=Planet+Kolob

We’ll wait.


5 posted on 04/15/2012 9:47:49 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Kaslin

“James P. Lewis, Jr. may have launched his con on a Sunday. After all, he collected the seed money for one of the longest-running Ponzi schemes in U.S. history at [the Mormon] church.”

[snip]

“To start, Lewis recruited people from his Mormon church in Southern California. But over time, his con grew legs and expanded well beyond the confines of his community. At the time of his arrest, Financial Advisory Consultants had about 3,300 clients who had invested $311 million on the promise of 40 percent returns. A select group of these investors – the wealthier individuals who were less likely to withdraw their funds from his custody – actually saw returns. “

http://www.thehallofinfamy.org/inductees.php?action=detail&artist=james_lewis

Ladder Climbing FAIL.


6 posted on 04/15/2012 9:54:51 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Kaslin

“in my Father’s house there are many mansions. “ Mr. Jesus Christ.


7 posted on 04/15/2012 9:56:07 AM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Kaslin
In 1903, the US Senate refused allow Reed Smoot (no known relation to the author) to take his seat for four years because he also served in the Church.

A misleading statement at best. Smoot was not just a member or volunteer in the Church, he was a member of the 12 Apostles.

This was the rough equivalent of having a Cardinal of the Roman Catholic Church elected to the Senate. Not surprisingly, some were concerned about such a highly placed member of a church recently involved in serious conflict with the US government being a senator.

8 posted on 04/15/2012 10:05:47 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Lurker

Amen my friend.

I’ve been a member of the LDS Church for 42 years, having joined the Church of Jesus Chrost of Latter-day Saints as a teenager when me and my fmily had been Southern Baptists.

There are certainly differences in interpretation and doctrine, there are certainly (as there are with any religion or group) those, even in ledership, who speak their mind and opinions which does not always represent the church’s official position.

I have been around and around on this with most of those here on FR who seek to deride the LDS Church endlessly and tell us what we believe and label us as a non-Christian cult.

I do not intend to revisit all of those or even contend, debate, or discuss it further here.

However, in an effort to give a counter balance to what is sure to be an onsluaght of attacks on my faith, I will, here, as a faithful LDS member... “card carrying” so to speak, and one who supported Palin, then Cain, then Sanorum and now Newt...here is my own witness for Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior.

My Witness for Christ
http://www.jeffhead.com/jlhwitness.htm

...and in terms of day to day living, here’s my journal regarding my fight with malignant bone cancer, and who I depended on in getting through it to this point, which has also been much discussed here on FR and where hundreds here have prayed for me in the name of Jesus for my health, as have I and my family, relying on His will in the end, for His will is what is roght.

My Sacral Chordoma
http://www.jeffhead.com/chordoma.htm

This is how I, and those I know who are LDS live. Folks may read about it and judge accordingly...according, as the Savior said, by the fruit.


9 posted on 04/15/2012 10:09:37 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free, never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Jeff Head
The question - Are Mormons Christians? is actually very zen. Mormons have a unique and singular definition of Christianity that only they fit. So are Mormons Christians? By their light they are the ONLY Christians.

label us as a non-Christian cult.

10 posted on 04/15/2012 10:13:08 AM PDT by DManA
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To: Colofornian; Elsie; FastCoyote; svcw; Zakeet; SkyPilot; rightazrain; Tennessee Nana; ...
Ping for original of my locked thread.

The article is STILL full of lies, and is a propaganda piece for the mormon church. Townhall should be ashamed.

11 posted on 04/15/2012 10:16:14 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I do not expect the (FR) house to fall - but I do expect it will cease to be divided-Jim Robinson)
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To: DManA; Jeff Head; greyfoxx39
By their light they are the ONLY Christians.

Judge by their works?

Polygamy

Mountain Meadows Massacre

"God directed" racism

“Believers in the doctrines of modern Christendom will reap damnation to their souls.”
- Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, see pp. 45-46

Is there little doubt where romney gets his flipflop lies from?

12 posted on 04/15/2012 10:33:09 AM PDT by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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To: greyfoxx39

Apostate Binger Ping!

Apologetic Liars Ping!

I wonder how many BIC people like me there are out there. In my own family there are, ALL of my kids and grandkids. All have left the Morg.


13 posted on 04/15/2012 10:40:22 AM PDT by Utah Binger (Southern Utah where the world comes to see America)
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To: Jeff Head

>>There are certainly differences in interpretation and doctrine,

Uhuh. Got Blood Atonement?

“That truth is great and will prevail, errors ceasing to be dangerous when it is permitted freely to contradict them”.

How does the Mormon Cult, America’s Islam, traditionaly deal with those who contradict them within the context of their militaristic purview?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Meadows_massacre

Is the con artistry/doctrine associated with Planet Kolob an “error”?

Etc etc etc.

FAIL.


14 posted on 04/15/2012 10:46:03 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Jeff Head

>>This is how I, and those I know who are LDS live.

How’s Jimmy Lewis enjoying “living” in Federal Prison?


15 posted on 04/15/2012 10:48:00 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Jeff Head

>>My Sacral Chordoma

Do you have a Reformed Egyptian version?


16 posted on 04/15/2012 10:50:34 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: LomanBill

Sorry, can’t you see how absolutely unChristian such a remark is. So you resort to making fun of, disparaging, making light of, and using such vitriol against the disabled? Against people suffering from malingnant bone caner?

Don’t get me wrong, personally, it does not hurt me...given my experiences on the hurt or pain meter, it does not register. At any rate, I know who my salvation rests in and who it is that has answered the prayers of many fathful Christians on my behalf, including many of my own faith and many good FReepers too.

But I just find it sad...actually, pretty disgusting...that you would, in an effort to try and show through these examples you have mentioned (which there are bad examples of LDS people, like there would be in any population numbering in excess of 15 million...but when compared to the vast majority of the people who live and practise the faith, such numbers pale to insignificance)...anyhow, in attempting to show “bad fruit” amongst the LDS, you resort to this?

Making fun of, dispariging the disabled and those afflicted with malignant cancer?

Well, have your laugh. I sincerely pray to God in Heaven, in Jesus name, that you and yours are never afflicted with such a diagnosis or disease. But talk about removing the beam from your own eye so you can see clearly...sheez, amazing.


17 posted on 04/15/2012 11:33:05 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free, never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Utah Binger
I wonder how many BIC people like me there are out there. In my own family there are, ALL of my kids and grandkids. All have left the Morg.

Well done!

18 posted on 04/15/2012 11:39:04 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I do not expect the (FR) house to fall - but I do expect it will cease to be divided-Jim Robinson)
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To: Jeff Head

Typical “It’s all about me” Jeff Headonism.

Wearing your affliction(s) on your sleave does not undo the factual history surrounding America’s Islam.

Have a nice (Latter) day.


19 posted on 04/15/2012 11:48:14 AM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Jeff Head; LomanBill; Colofornian; Elsie; FastCoyote; svcw; Zakeet; SkyPilot; rightazrain; ...
Making fun of, dispariging the disabled and those afflicted with malignant cancer?

What total hogwash, Jeff.

You are attempting to use your cancer to pimp for Romney and the mormon church. Dozens of FReepers have or have had cancer and are not trying to accuse those who disagree with them of "making fun of, dispariging the disabled and those afflicted with malignant cancer" in order to make political points or pimp mormonism. Shame on you.

[Spoken as a breast cancer survivor since July, 2010...and no, the mormon god had nothing to do with my survival. I owe it to God and His Son, Jesus.]

20 posted on 04/15/2012 11:51:49 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I do not expect the (FR) house to fall - but I do expect it will cease to be divided-Jim Robinson)
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To: greyfoxx39

When a supporter has to stoop to that we know what Romneys chances really are


21 posted on 04/15/2012 12:23:14 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: Jeff Head

Jeff,
I am responding to your continual posting of your “personal testimony” in
the post above.

Telling a half truth is not the same thing as telling the truth.
It is a lie with consequences.

... When you tell a half-truth about God’s nature, you make God into an idol.
... When you tell a half-truth about the Gospel, the result is eternity away from God.
... When you tell a half-truth about man, you repeat the sin of Satan.

Sadly your personal testimony, which you continually post here (apparently) in order
to portray mormonism as Christianity and yourself as a misunderstood Christian with a
few minor differences, is full of half-truths in the three categories above - and frankly
others as well.

Only you know if you are emotionally deceived enough to rationalize
the careful way you craft your explanation to justify your own choices,
or if you knowingly and selectively choose your half-truths to make
mormonism appear Christian in order to proselytize FReepers and promote
Romney.

In the end, a half-truth remains a lie and is certainly contrary to the
image I used to have of you. I gave you multiple chances to come clean,
but in every response you obfuscated and continued your carefully crafted
sales pitch. You were unable to come right out and state what you believed.
In the end, I realized you did not want to tell the whole truth. I post this
to notify others on FR that you are posting half-truths about Christianity
and about mormonism. This is a common mormon tactic taught to their “missionaries”.

I feel for you... not just because of your physical challenges, but even
more importantly and of greater consequence, you spiritual challenges.
I pray for your physical and spiritual healing. In the meantime, I will continue
to point out the problems with your post here that distorts the simplicity of
the Gospel of Grace, the nature of our ONE GOD, and the unworthiness of man to
reach God through his own efforts.

best,
ampu


22 posted on 04/15/2012 12:24:02 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ("Of two evils, choose neither." -- Charles Spurgeon)
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To: greyfoxx39

Sorry, you are apparently so wrapped up in your accusative nature and spirit that you will let such things pass...and with your approval no less. I had thought better of you.

No one is pimping anything...not cancer for sure, and not Romney in the least.

I do not support Romney. I support Newt which I made clear, and Santorum before him, and Cain, before him, and Sarah before him.

If Romeny is all that is left us for a nominee, I will vote for him against Obama, but I pray Newt can pull off a miracle and get a brokered convention to avoid that. I have made that clear here on FR.

I did try and provide a counter balance to the attacks on this thread against my faith, using my own testimony and experiences in an effort to show where our faith resides...and one of your number made fun of my malignant bone cancer to thank me for it.

Fine. You are apparently so wrapped up in your vindictiveness and angest that you are unwilling to even call out that behavior. That’s what the real shame is.

Given this latest, I’ll not repsond any more on this thread...it’s just too sickning, IMHO...and such a shame to see on FR.

I pray God’s blessings on you, to open your eyes...not really regarding the LDS church at all...but regaring your own allownces and willingness to justify such behavior.


23 posted on 04/15/2012 1:37:42 PM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free, never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Jeff Head
I’ve been a member of the LDS Church for 42 years, having joined the Church of Jesus Chrost of Latter-day Saints as a teenager when me and my fmily had been Southern Baptists.

Why did you leave the Southern Baptist Church?

Did someone tell you there was something wrong with it?

Did someone tell you that the Southern Baptist Church was not a "True Church"?

Was their doctrine in error?

Were their creeds an "abomination"?

Did your current church accept your Southern Baptist Baptism as valid?

24 posted on 04/15/2012 1:40:26 PM PDT by P-Marlowe
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To: Sherman Logan
In 1903, the US Senate refused allow Reed Smoot (no known relation to the author) to take his seat for four years because he also served in the Church.

A misleading statement at best. Smoot was not just a member or volunteer in the Church, he was a member of the 12 Apostles.

This was the rough equivalent of having a Cardinal of the Roman Catholic Church elected to the Senate. Not surprisingly, some were concerned about such a highly placed member of a church recently involved in serious conflict with the US government being a senator.

* * * *

The heart of the Reed Smoot affair was the issue of polygamy (plural marriage). Smoot was not a polygamist.

The Senate's issue with Smoot dated to the 1898 election of U.S. Representative Brigham Henry Roberts of Utah. B.H. Roberts was a polygamist, and was a polygamist at the time of his election to Congress, two years after Utah became a state based in part on the condition that polygamy would be illegal (it's illegal in the Utah Constitution, which provides that the United States must consent to any amendment of that provision).

1898, as you'll note, was eight years after LDS President Wilford Woodruff's 1890 Manifesto on polygamy and the LDS Church claimed to have ended polygamy.

However, the LDS Church quietly continued to perform a small number of polygamous marriages after 1890 Manifesto, in the U.S., Canada, and Mexico, and the 1890 Manifesto didn't break up the large number of existing polygamous relationships (which would have been extremely cruel).

Congress had refused to seat B.H. Roberts because he was a polygamist.

Smoot's 1902 election set off four years of hearings on the fact that the LDS Church continued to practice polygamy and perform polygamous marriages. The perceived issue for Smoot was whether he could take an oath to uphold the Constitution while being such a high-ranking member of the LDS Church, which was still, at the time of his election, violating the laws of the U.S. regarding polygamy, and was violating the terms of the Utah Constitution, Utah law, and the conditions under which Utah had been permitted to become a State and elect Senators. Polygamy, in the eyes of those practicing it, was the law of God and not something that the laws of man could affect.

During the Reed Smoot Hearings, LDS President Joseph F. Smith issued the Second Manifesto (the 1904 Manifesto) which established excommunication for polygamy.

But - the Reed Smoot Hearings? They were, at the core, about polygamy.

25 posted on 04/15/2012 1:49:13 PM PDT by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it)
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To: Jeff Head

I’ve been an LDS member for over 25 years now, Jeff. I appreciate your witness of Jesus Christ which I share.


26 posted on 04/15/2012 1:58:47 PM PDT by Normandy
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Comment #27 Removed by Moderator

To: Normandy

Thank you...it was freely and sincerely given.

Your handle remnds me of an experience I had on Normandy beach about six years ago when I went over there to pick up one of my sons who had just finished his mission.

We went to Nomandy Beach on the day before we flew home. I had an uncle who was killed in the air over Belgium in World War II and at the end of seeing his mission, we wanted to see Normandy.

While there a French man approached me and asked if we were Americans. I said, yes, we were and were grateful for the way that so many French people were a part of and employed in taking such marvelous care of the memorial there.

He thanked me and then said what he really wanted to ask me was if I was glad Bush’s term was almost up and wouldn’t we be glad that he, as a war monger, would soon be gone.

I stopped for a moment and it got quiet as I gathered my thoughts and controlled my emotions. I finally told him that he would not agree with my answer, and that it would be contentious, and that my son and I had come there to honor the dead Americans buried there by the tens of thousands...who died freeing his country from abject tyranny, and that I didn’t really care to talk politics with him.

He apologized, and said he understood.

As he left, I indicated to him to reflect on something... that perhaps, just perhaps, sixty years from now two people like he and I may meet over in Iraq where Americans once again were dying to help free people from another brutal tyrant and be standing at another such memorial to American sacrifice in blood for other people’s fredom. With that, I bid him Adieu.

God’s speed and blessing to you and yours. I pray we can help restore our nation to the fundamental moral and constitutional principles upon which it was founded and hope we’ll see a huge step in that direction here in November.

America at the Crossroads of History
http://www.jeffhead.com/crossroads.htm


28 posted on 04/15/2012 2:18:45 PM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free, never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: greyfoxx39

And thanks to the fine heart surgeon in Salt Lake City that performed the quad bypass on me hack in 2009. I knew he had a steady hand based on his reputation. That greater power certainly knew that it was not yet my time. He/She directed the hands of that fine young doctor.


29 posted on 04/15/2012 2:26:09 PM PDT by Utah Binger (Southern Utah where the world comes to see America)
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To: Kaslin

Please, take this apologetics crap somewhere else. We have been exposing the blasphemies and heresies of MormonISM for year at FR. These people are not ‘misunderstood’, they are misled, being duped by forces of darkness. At FR, when the facts of what the foudners and leadership of LDS inc have taught are exposed, the Momron apologists whine that the sources are not official, that the heirarchy has changed, that Christianity needed restored to the original by their ‘prophet’, that ... well, you get the gist. The LDS inc apologists do what their previous head of their ‘church’ did when cornered on Larry King Live, they lie. Oh, to be sure, they do it with such a fluid tongue and such humble rebuke, but it is lying for their religion just as their missionaries are taught to do.


30 posted on 04/15/2012 2:32:24 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: Jeff Head

Thank you. I spent some time on Normandy beaches a few years ago myself — also visited one of the large cemeteries there. It was all very beautiful, and were poignant moments as I considered all that had gone on there during WWII.

The earth and its destiny is in the Lord’s hands — ultimately His will shall prevail and Christ and His Kingdom will triumph.


31 posted on 04/15/2012 2:36:34 PM PDT by Normandy
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To: Jeff Head

Jeff, have you taken the oath of LDS inc melchizedek high riesthood? And honest answer is not what I expect from you, but you might surprise me. And if you have taken that oath(s) then you have committed blasphemy toward Jesus Christ Who is the ONLY Melchizedek High Priest and He is that Priest FOREVER, Jeff. You’re a fraud.


32 posted on 04/15/2012 2:37:45 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: LomanBill

Notice the date of the Mountain Meadow Massacre, the largest act of domestic violence on U.S. soil until the Oklahoma Bombing. That date is September 11.

Notice also how Mormon “prophet” Brigham Young ordered and carried out the destruction of the cross - the most sacred symbol of Christians - adorning the top of the cairn where the Christian victims of the Mountain Meadow Massacre were buried. That cross still has not been restored:

http://1857massacre.com/MMM/replica.htm


33 posted on 04/15/2012 2:38:09 PM PDT by NorthernCrunchyCon (Say no to RINO DORCs (Democrats Obstructing Republican Conservatives))
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To: MHGinTN

I have told you before that I have served in Bishoprics in the Church MHG. You claim to know a lot about the Church and if you do, you know the answer before you ask it.

I am a High Priest in the LDS Church. It is a lay priesthood and my oath is to Jesus Christ who leads that Priesthood. He is in fact my High Priest, just as He is for the entire earth, and the one I look to for my Salvation through His atonement.

The Priesthood is how the Church is organized, and we believe how it was organized by Christ himself. We believe all the original Apostles and other leaders were called similarly.

But, you do not believe that and these issues have been discussed at length elsewhere and ultimately devolve into LDS believers getting damned to hell, called frauds and many other names, etc., etc.

Again, as I have done in the past. God bless you for your sincere faith in Christ and any sincere and Christlike efforts you make to bring others to Him, that work is not waisted by anyone...in the end, He will draw all sincere believers to Himself and all truth.

I hope you and yours have a blessed remainder of the sabbath day,


34 posted on 04/15/2012 2:59:15 PM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free, never has been, never will be (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: NorthernCrunchyCon

It’s America’s Islam.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=mormonism+america’s+islam

Lies and myth concocted by a con-artist for coercion and profit - just like the fleece Muhamad pulled over his sheeple's eyes. 

 


35 posted on 04/15/2012 3:04:22 PM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Lurker

Very true...

Of course a totally different house belonging to a totally different father down the street is another issue...


36 posted on 04/15/2012 3:05:12 PM PDT by ejonesie22 (8/30/10, the day Truth won.)
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To: Lurker

Very true...

Of course a totally different house belonging to a totally different father down the street is another issue...


37 posted on 04/15/2012 3:05:30 PM PDT by ejonesie22 (8/30/10, the day Truth won.)
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To: Jeff Head

Huh? For a guy who says he knows the Bible, you sure do miss quote/reference it a lot. “know by fruit” as you have been told dozens of times refers to false prophets, like Joseph Smith.
Your continual reference to your own cancer is boring, and self promoting, saying this as a 25 year survivor of ovarian cancer.
psst lds have maybe 14 mil world wide, 6 mil maybe in the US and only half of them are considered active. Really Jeff if you are going to spout stats at least use some that are not so easily found out to be untrue or at the very least highly exaggerated.


38 posted on 04/15/2012 3:18:42 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Lurker; Kaslin
“in my Father’s house there are many mansions. “ Mr. Jesus Christ, unless of course you hadn't worked really really hard, because I am not sufficient to save anyone and I have to ask Joseph Smith if it's ok with him, if I give you permission to enter your own kingdom, after all that's what we mormons are working towards our own planet.
39 posted on 04/15/2012 3:31:39 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Jeff Head

>>I am a High Priest in the LDS Church.

What’s the name of the BS-Artist who’s High Priest on Planet Kolob?

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=frgbld&gs_nf=1&cp=22&gs_id=7&xhr=t&q=mormonism+planet+kolob

Is being god of Kolob a permanent position or, since it’s just a vacation planet, is it more like an anarcho-syndicalist commune where you’ll take it in turns to be a sort of Executive Supreme God Man and Officer for the week — You know, an honorary god of the cruise ship during mardi gras sort of thing...?


40 posted on 04/15/2012 3:41:35 PM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: svcw

>>after all that’s what we mormons are working towards our own planet.

But what if you’re just vacationing there, like on Kolob — who get’s to be planetary deity then?


41 posted on 04/15/2012 3:44:07 PM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Kaslin

mormonism started by Joseph Smith the adulator, pedophile, flim flam man, con artist, thief, liar, destroyer of property, eye on taking over the United States by force.....loon.
As the campaign continues mormonism will be laid bare for what it really is and it is not Christianity.


42 posted on 04/15/2012 3:44:33 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: LomanBill

I don’t know maybe those Quaker like people from the moon could set up cafe’s on every planet so if we were vacationing there would be a good place to have a meal.
Oh, and maybe they could have the exclusive dealership to sell Joseph Smith’s own home brew of beer and wine, like the stuff he sold out of his living room years ago.


43 posted on 04/15/2012 3:47:56 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Jeff Head

When you say “Jesus Christ” is your priest, jesus christ the lds one or the Biblical one - they are not the same.
The lds jesus is not sufficient for salvation, was once a man, was created and is satan’s brother.
The Biblical Jesus is eternal, sufficient for salvation, was not satan’s brother, was fully God and fully man when He gave Himself for us.
Jeff, no one can condemn you to hell, people go there of their own free will.


44 posted on 04/15/2012 3:53:29 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Jeff Head; MHGinTN; Utah Binger; svcw; P-Marlowe; colorcountry; Scoutmaster; SZonian; Zakeet; ...
I am a High Priest in the LDS Church. It is a lay priesthood and my oath is to Jesus Christ who leads that Priesthood. He is in fact my High Priest, just as He is for the entire earth, and the one I look to for my Salvation through His atonement.

The Priesthood is how the Church is organized, and we believe how it was organized by Christ himself. We believe all the original Apostles and other leaders were called similarly.

It seems that mormons continually demote God, Jesus and now the "original Apostles" down to fit the template of man made mormonism.

Note the command below regarding the oath and actions of your priesthood....He covenants to be faithful, magnify his calling, “give diligent heed to the words of eternal life,” and “live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.”

Perhaps given the oath taken to “give diligent heed to the words of eternal life,” and “live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.”, you might want to recant the accusations against me in post 23..."You are apparently so wrapped up in your vindictiveness and angest"....."you are apparently so wrapped up in your accusative nature and spirit"

Somehow, your self-promoting "look how wise and good I am" tales of your deeds and testimony ring false as “living by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.”

************************************************

Melchizedek Priesthood


Through the authority of the Melchizedek Priesthood, Church leaders guide the Church and direct the preaching of the gospel throughout the world. In the ordinances of the Melchizedek Priesthood, “the power of godliness is manifest” (D&C 84:20). This greater priesthood was given to Adam and has been on the earth whenever the Lord has revealed His gospel. It was taken from the earth during the Great Apostasy, but it was restored in 1829, when the Apostles Peter, James, and John conferred it upon Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery.

Additional Information

“There are, in the church, two priesthoods, namely, the Melchizedek and Aaronic” (D&C 107:1). The Melchizedek Priesthood, which is “after the Order of the Son of God” (D&C 107:3), is the greater of these. It “holds the right of presidency, and has power and authority over all the offices in the church” (D&C 107:8). It also holds “the keys of all the spiritual blessings of the church” (D&C 107:18). It is named after a great high priest who lived during the time of the prophet Abraham (see D&C 107:2-4; see also Alma 13:14-19).

The offices of the Melchizedek Priesthood are Apostle, Seventy, patriarch, high priest, and elder. The President of the High Priesthood is the President of the Church (see D&C 107:64-66).

Men in the Church must be worthy Melchizedek Priesthood holders in order to receive the temple endowment and be sealed to their families for eternity. They have the authority to administer to the sick and give special blessings to family members and others. With the authorization of presiding priesthood leaders, they can bestow the gift of the Holy Ghost and ordain other worthy men to offices in the Aaronic and Melchizedek Priesthoods.

When a man receives the Melchizedek Priesthood, he enters into the oath and covenant of the priesthood. He covenants to be faithful, magnify his calling, “give diligent heed to the words of eternal life,” and “live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.” Those who keep this covenant will be sanctified by the Spirit and receive “all that [the] Father hath.” (See D&C 84:33-44.)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Doctrine and Covenants

Section 84

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Kirtland, Ohio, 22 and 23 September 1832 (see History of the Church, 1:286–95). During the month of September, elders had begun to return from their missions in the eastern states and to make reports of their labors. It was while they were together in this season of joy that the following communication was received. The Prophet designated it a revelation on priesthood.
33–44, Men gain eternal life through the oath and covenant of the priesthood
33For whoso is afaithful unto the obtaining these two bpriesthoods of which I have spoken, and the cmagnifying their calling, are dsanctified by the Spirit unto the erenewing of their bodies. 34They become the asons of Moses and of Aaron and the bseed of cAbraham, and the church and kingdom, and the delect of God. 35And also all they who receive this priesthood areceive me, saith the Lord; 36For he that receiveth my servants areceiveth me; 37And he that areceiveth me receiveth my Father; 38And he that receiveth my Father receiveth my Father’s akingdom; therefore ball that my Father hath shall be given unto him. 39And this is according to the aoath and covenant which belongeth to the priesthood. 40Therefore, all those who receive the apriesthood, receive this boath and covenant of my Father, which he cannot break, neither can it be moved. 41But whoso breaketh this acovenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall bnot have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come. 42And wo unto all those who come not unto this priesthood which ye have received, which I now confirm upon you who are present this day, by mine own voice out of the heavens; and even I have given the heavenly hosts and mine angels acharge concerning you. 43And I now give unto you a commandment to beware concerning yourselves, to give adiligent bheed to the words of eternal life. 44For you shall alive by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.

Melchizedek Priesthood-LDS.org

45 posted on 04/15/2012 3:53:53 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I do not expect the (FR) house to fall - but I do expect it will cease to be divided-Jim Robinson)
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To: greyfoxx39

Since Joseph Smith believed himself to be great than Jesus Christ it makes perfect sense that mormonism would teach its men that they to can be greater than Christ or God, after all they are getting their own planet.


46 posted on 04/15/2012 3:57:24 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: svcw

Buzz off, sister.


47 posted on 04/15/2012 4:09:29 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: svcw

maybe those Quaker like people from the moon could set up cafe’s on every planet so if we were vacationing there would be a good place to have a meal.

Will they honor James P Lewis’ senior discount card when he vacations there after finishing the sentence for his Mormon Affinity-Fraud Ponzi scheme?

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=James+P+Lewis+”Senior+Discount”+mormon


48 posted on 04/15/2012 4:14:04 PM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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To: Lurker; svcw

What about svcw’s post was untrue?


49 posted on 04/15/2012 4:15:56 PM PDT by bonfire
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To: Lurker; svcw

>>Buzz off, sister.

Should she Buzz in Coach or splurge for 1st class to Planet Kolob?

How long does that flight take again?

And while we’re on the subject - is Planck’s constant the same there or will she need to reset her watch to the Kolobian/moon-Quaker “1000 year” scale?


50 posted on 04/15/2012 4:19:14 PM PDT by LomanBill (Animals! The DemocRats blew up the windmill with an Acorn!)
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