Albanians form "movement for unification"

B92 ^ | May 17, 2008 | Staff

[Bokababe]

PRIŠTINA -- A movement whose goal is the unification of "all Albanian territories" was founded in Priština today.

The organization, dubbed Movement for Unification, also appointed Avni Klinaku as president.

"The main goal of this party is the unification of Albanian territories into one country and the resolution of the social problems of the citizens of Kosovo," Klinaku told the founding assembly.

Klinaku was also the founder of the National Movement for the Liberation of Kosovo, an organization which was one of the founders of the so-called Kosovo Liberation Army, KLA.

[old-and-old]

and you conveniently forgot that video /Serb propaganda point pinged to me suggesting that Albanians came from Georgia or where ever.

You called me a “Muslim Albanian” to discount all my comments, instead of debating them so I made the offer. Start a fund raising. I have nothing against Serbs, but I don’t like what they did and especially now that quite a few nationalists are trying to smear the victims, instead of repenting. Look at the lies in your poster as a clear example. US knows they are lies, that’s why they aren’t supporting you.

Regarding the other “Serbs fought the nazis, everyone else was a Nazi” Serb propaganda we can discuss it. Open a new thread and we’ll see how much Draza and other Chetniks fought everyone but the Germans and how nice he was to the Jews (not that nice; those that weren’t sold, were killed like sheep) The First Judenrein city was Belgrade, and thanks to local cooperation.

[Bokababe]

Blah, blah, blah... have no idea what you are talking about in the first sentence.

So answer, are you Albanian or Croat by birth or ancestry? You've made a big deal out of my ancestry, so reveal yours.

I'm guessing Croat now, based on a wish to reinterpret WWII Yugoslavia's history -- just like Dio.

[old-and-old]

Once again, your empty rhetoric is faced with facts:

"Teaching of the Holocaust is incorporated into the Serbian school curriculum, and the role of the Serbian government during that period is also discussed. However, there was a tendency among some commentators to minimize and reinterpret the role of Serbian leaders during the Holocaust, casting them as victims of foreign occupiers when in fact many leaders of that time collaborated with the Nazis and began campaigns against the Jewish population even before the Nazis invaded Yugoslavia."
Serbia Country Reports on Human Rights Practices - 2006 http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2006/78837.htm

Who is trying to rewrite history to justify when they did in the 90's?

[Bokababe]

Still haven’t answered —are you Albanian or Croat by birth or ancestry? You’ve made a big deal out of my ancestry, so reveal yours.

[joan]

Draza and the Chetniks saved over 500 Allied airmen. The greatest behind enemy lines rescue. This despite the fact that the airmen were bombing Serb civilians and acting as Tito's airforce.

Britain and the U.S. had made up their mind to back Tito despite successes the Chetniks were having. The BBC was deliberately giving credit for Chetniks attacks against the Germans to Tito.

The Chetniks were purposely deprived of aid from the very beginning despite the fact that they were the ones who initiated the uprising against the Germans.

As for Belgrade - the Germans were hanging Serb civilians daily in the city center at the beginning of the war and doing this also in other Serbian cities of Pancevo and Novi Sad.

The local German Volksdeutsch were the ones who joined and cooperated with the Nazis.

[Diocletian]

No reinterpretation needed. Facts are facts.

[Diocletian]

Draza also took arms from the Germans and Draza’s Chetniks took part on the Axis side in offensives. Collaboration.

[Diocletian]

So instead of addressing the points I brought up, you divert to a personal attack. That’s all you have when facts aren’t on your side.

[joan]

How many Serb children did your Ustasha grandfather kill? How many did he and his Muslim Ustasha compatriots put in camps to starve to death?

How many Serbs did you help make homeless in Operation Storm before you came back to Canada to you spoiled bloated baboon.

[Diocletian]

And now Joan resorts to ad hominem. Oh well.

[old-and-old]

even if I said I am polish, in your own twisted logic, you’ll manage to say “Aha! The pope was Polish and he hates...” If I told you I’m from Congo, you’d find a “Marxist” connection somewhere in your mind, and of course “they hate Serbs”. So let’s focus on the facts. Instead on dealing with them you tried to discount them by calling me an “Albanian Muslim” and then chickened out when time came to back it up.

I’m a proud AMERICAN and support the US/Nato /Western world mission in the Balkans. Frankly they should have stepped in sooner. I would have loved to see the chetniks and the Karadzics and Mladics face when faced with armed men.

Regarding WWII Chetniks: they were two kinds, those who collaborated openly and those who engaged in propaganda but still collaborated. Draza didn’t kill some 500 US airmen who were liberating his country, while he was killing Jews, Muslims and Croats. Give that guy a medal!!!!!!! Draza made the mistake on being honest with the Brits: Tito, Ustase, Muslims, Croats and then the Germans were in his priorities, in this order because he wanted to create a “Pure Serb” kingdom. Draza also saved German pilots and hunted US pilots on behalf of Germans. He hunted Jews as well—to sell them to the Nazis— and chetniks were particularly known for killing Jews “in bestial ways”:

“Jewish survivors testified that the Chetniks, particularly those under [Draza...] ... ‘persecuted Jews mercilessly’ and slaughtered them ‘in a bestial way”

So where is this Serbian resistance again? Was it ZBOR? Nedic? Serbian State Guard, Serbian Volunteer Corps?

Why don’t you look in what Harlan Turner said?
‘Serbia is the only country in Europe. where the Jewish problem has been solved.’...in 1942!!!! Where was the first gas vans experimented on? Serbia. Oh, the camps were guarded and run by Serbs. The names were in Cyrillic.

Tito, known as “Ustase” to you, liberated Serbia and the rest of the country. Croats, Slovenes and Muslims made the majority of his fighters. For now I will not get into your newly minted saint (2003) and what he said about Jews or how many “Blood and Honor” groups are in Serbia. Before calling others Nazis, look in the mirror.

[Bokababe]

So, after digging up so much specific FR research on MY ancestry from a time that you weren't even a registered FReeper --and then attempt to use it against me, you still won't answer the question about your background? What kind of a weaselly little ploy is that? Are you ashamed of your ancestry or are you just a coward who can dish it out, but hides and plays "the victim" when asked to level the playing field?

There is no way that you are just "some flag-waiving American" who recites Njegos; who can post anti-Serb propaganda faster than anyone can read it; and who wants to revise WWII Yugoslav history to suit your needs.

You are just a gum-flapping Ustase propagandist -- not the first, probably not the last.

[old-and-old]

I’ll ignore the personal attacks, but I admit I was shocked that anyone in 2008 would be proud of a hate poem that incited people to slash throats of other humans just because their ancestors had changed religion 300-400 years ago.

[FormerLib]

Just showing off your history, Bonly-boy?

[Bokababe]

"...I was shocked that anyone in 2008 would be proud of a hate poem that incited people to slash throats of other humans just because their ancestors had changed religion 300-400 years ago."

LOL! You've clearly suffering from "talent envy", old mold.

Njegos was not only a Bishop and Prince. He was the Shakespeare of the Balkans; his works were translated into ten languages and he was the most famous poet of the region.

He wrote a story of 17th Century Montenegro when the Turks had made life so miserable for Montenegrin Christians that they were converting to Islam out of fear -- and nothing appeared to be able to stop this trend of conversions. So, in Njegos's story, the Christian leader agonized as to what to do because he knew that these conversions to Islam would eventually tear his country apart if they continued. Ultimately there remained only one terrible choice -- to kill the converts to Islam and make people as afraid of the results of converting to Islam, as they were of not converting. It worked.

But instead, you chose to use noted Muslim apologist, Michael Sells, criticism of The Mountain Wreath -- without even attributing the comment to him. How pathetic.

So who are you going to call "an ethnic cleansing, anti-Muslim racist" next, old mold? Alfred Lord Tennyson for his poem on Montenegro, in which he admires the Montenegrin spirit, in killing the invading Turks?

"THEY rose to where their sovereign eagle sails, They kept their faith, their freedom, on the height, Chaste, frugal, savage, arm’d by day and night Against the Turk; whose inroad nowhere scales Their headlong passes, but his footstep fails, And red with blood the Crescent reels from fight Before their dauntless hundreds, in prone flight By thousands down the crags and thro’ the vales. O smallest among peoples! rough rock-throne Of Freedom! warriors beating back the swarm Of Turkish Islam for five hundred years, Great Tsernogora! never since thine own Black ridges drew the cloud and brake the storm Has breathed a race of mightier mountaineers."Alfred Lord Tennyson, 1877

[SQUID]

Sain, D. Sago, A. Bogovic, A. Silic, A. Slavicek, M. Mihanovic and D. Bodor

Male Department, Psychiatric Hospital, Zagreb, Croatia

Then when you are done visiting them you can learn how to read and understand ideas.

[SQUID]

You’re the complete moron that started the personal attack. You certainly need help. Take a break for a while. Hate is hard work

[SQUID]

Give me a break with this holier than Thou shite and stick to the topic.

What the heck makes you so righteous to make the judgment of right and wrong when your own back yard is filled with the stench of death and disregard for law?

You think you're so righteous because you think America was fighting WWII to save the Jews? A state, by the way, founded upon a specific religion and citizenship rights are based upon being a Jew?

You think it was right of NATO to create Islamic lands out of Christian lands without any regard for international laws? How? What legal right? Where does it state this right? Show me the money.

Why will no President sign the ICC papers?

I can't wait for the facts to be rolling in so my eyes can just spin.

[Diocletian]

Explain how Croatia gained territory when the fact of the matter is that the borders have been unchanged since 1945 (when Croatia in fact lost territory).

[SQUID]

Croatia’s incessant endeavour to spread over the broadest possible geographic area found expression during the Independent State of Croatia. Dissatisfied with its size, too, the ustashas, through Slavko Kvaternik, attempted to enlarge it. In a telegram of May 14, 1941, the German envoy Siegfried Kasche transmitted to his Foreign Ministry Kvaternik’s wish to enlarge the “Croatian” territories up to the Albanian border, to include the towns of Priboj, Prijepolje and Pljevlja. Kasche supported this demand reasoning that “the Croatian troops are already stationed there”, However, Italy was against it. Count Ciano described this Kvaternik’s demand as “Croatian imperialism”. In his Diary he wrote on June 30, 1941: “Pavelić now wants the Sandžak of Novi Pazar. A senseless, unjustified demand. I have prepared a letter, signed by the Duce, whereby we reject such pretensions.” One of the key men in the team of Tito’s politicians from Croatia, Ivan Stevo Krajačić, according to the author of the book on the operations of the German Secret Service BND (Bundesnachrichtendienst), Erich Schmidt Enbohm, at the peak of Tito’s strength and unlimited power, drafted a plan on creating a “sovereign Croatia with Bosnia and Herzegovina”, within the boundaries of the former Independent State of Croatia of 1941. This is another of the undeniable proofs that there was method in greater-Croatian aspirations, particularly those regarding pretensions to Bosnia and Herzegovina. Political systems, forms of state and social set up, or men might have changed, but the Croatian policy remained consistent as regards pretensions of having Croatia’s borders along the Drina river. The shape of Croatia is compared by some to a banana or crescent. A Croatia such as this, in the conviction of many Croats, has no chance of surviving and progressing. Antun Radić explained it in the following words: “Dalmatia united with Croatia would resemble the crust of bread, and the middle part which you would cut out would be Bosnia and Herzegovina cut out from the Croatian bread. If we want to eat to satisfaction, we also need the soft middle, we need Herzeg-Bosnia.” For Antun’s brother Stjepan, Bosnia was “like the gizzard to the rest of Croatia. How can a person live if you take out his gizzard?” In the view of Frano Supilo, “Croatia without Bosnia would always be a toy in the hands of whoever ruled in today’s occupied provinces,” i.e. in Bosnia and Herzegovina. To gain a permanent economic and financial independence, Croatian politicians believe that they have to seize new territories. Hrvatski dnevnik of 1914 wrote about it as follows: “Croatia in its present size cannot survive because she needs some more provinces for its own economic build-up.” Limited to the Triune Kingdom only, the Croatian people can only have a hand-to-mouth life, but will have a full life if they have Bosnia and Herzegovina.” According to Pilar, Croatia, Slavonia and Dalmatia are the shell, and Bosnia and Herzegovina the core of Croatia. Taking up this idea about the shell and the core, the Lexicographic Institute of the FPRY from Zagreb, under the leadership of Miroslav Krleža, in the fourth volume of Encyclopedia of Yugoslavia, which appeared in 1960, in the chapter on Croatia, drew up a geographic map of that republic annexing to it Bosnia and Herzegovina, all the way to the Drina river, not omitting the smallest piece of land on the left bank of that river. When the same Institute, in the seventh volume of Encyclopedia of Yugoslavia, published in 1968, in the chapter on Serbia, attached the geographic map of that republic, it did not use the same method. It stopped Serbia upon the Drina river, hardly crossing to its left bank. Also, you don’t think that if Kosovo becomes a part ot Albania that it’s not a greater Albania plan? Would you have a problem with that? Some of the Bosnian Croat leaders have called in recent months for creating a “Greater Croatia” by joining Bosnian territory.... NY Times “It is the first step toward a Greater Croatia, absolutely,” Zarko Puhovski, a professor of political philosophy at the University of Zagreb..NY Times The parliamentary elections in January and the presidential elections the following month resulted in a loss of power by the Croatian Democratic Union (HDZ), the party with strong connections to Croats outside the country. The new centre-left government indicated that it would discontinue late President Tudjman’s plans for a Greater Croatia embracing compatriots in Bosnia-Hercegovina. I can go on and on and on.............................because it’s all through history until this very day. People can find out for themselves. I’m just telling them that it’s all there.