Academic slums ( Dumb Government Teachers)

http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/williams121907.php3 ^ | Dec. 19, 2007 | Walter Williams

[JamesP81]

Were we serious about efforts to improve public education, one of the first things we would do is eliminate schools of education.

Agree in the strongest possible terms. Best teacher I ever had was one of my computer science professors. He didn't have a degree in education. He did, however, have degrees in Mathematics and Computer Science. In short, he was thoroughly familiar with the material he was teaching.

[Polonius]

As a history undergrad, I didn’t pursue a secondary-ed oriented degree because those students seemed to have as many required hours taking classes about theories of education as hours studying actual history. I think an over-emphasis on educational theory rather than the subject matter they will eventually teach could be part of the reason for this problem.

[darth]

My son told one of his high school teachers that I had invented a new carbon dioxide scrubber for the Space Station. She asked “Why don’t they just open the window?”. He thought she was joking, but it turned out she did not know that there is vacuum in space.

[mysterio]

Even if competent people were allowed en masse to become teachers without jumping through the education industry’s hoops

It's pretty simple to transition to teaching. Many colleges have programs that let you take the education classes while still working at your current job. I'm looking into it now, actually.

If you take the hundred thousand smartest people in the country and make them teachers, all of a sudden a lot of airplanes won’t get flown, hearts won’t get transplanted, inventions won’t be made... the country would fall apart.

Why in the world would we need to pull 100,000 people out of industry to improve our education system? We have plenty of good teachers and a few bad ones. All those 100,000 people need to do to improve our education system is to make their kids study. If every parent got involved and made their child study and complete the coursework, our schools would improve 100 percent.

[JamesP81]

I taught at a university. I was able to see why many consider a college education necessary to fill in the gaps that were omitted in public school. Many of the kids are incapable of expressing a cogent thought or write a paragraph that is easily understood.

I had to fill in a couple of those gaps when I got to college, although mine weren't writing related. I scored in the top 1 percentile on my ACT for reading comprehension and writing. I already had a better command of the English language than most of my teachers before I got out of school. This was mostly self taught through large amounts of reading.

However, when I got to college they saw I had taken algebra in high school and gave me college credit for it then started me in calculus. I wasn't ready for college calc and ended up dropping it and taking college algebra anyway. I also flunked my discrete math class (mathematics associated with software development). To be fair to me, though, my discrete math teacher spoke poorer english than your average illegal alien, so that kind of complicated things. I re took a much harder version of discrete mathematics after I transferred to a different school and got an A in it, primarily because my professor 1) spoke English and 2) knew what the hell he was talking about.

[mysterio]

Four years? No, the transition to teaching program here at Ball State takes two semesters and one summer term. That’s not even a year. And it costs $4,500. That’s not bad at all.

[goodwithagun]

She is a space cadet herself.

[cowtowney]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a15_1194449127

Stupid in America by John Stossel

[cowtowney]

“But the one thing I never understand is: if the life of a public school teacher were as easy as people say it is, why don’t smarter people become teachers? Is it the money? Yet, I don’t hear more calls for increased pay.”

Government jobs are consistently low paying. In addition, I know of very few jobs that governments do well, especially education. The government involvement in this industry is a guaranty that it will be expensive and with poor service, despite the good intentions of many teachers. The system kills people.

[JamesP81]

Anyone who feels their skills are better than the vast majority of teachers can easily transition into the profession

Yeah, because quitting you're job, going back to school to get a Masters in education all the while not getting your house repossessed is really quite easy. All to take a 30% pay cut, be around a bunch liberal left loons all day, and be constantly threated with firing due to my Christianity. Sounds great.

[JamesP81]

When I went to college many years ago, the college I attended had a teaching degree program. The courses from that program were not interchangeable with those from any other degree program.

Same reasons I'll never teach software design. When I was a freshman in high school, I easily had ten times the knowledge of computer systems as my computer teacher had. I could've been teaching her about them. Now, I have real world experience developing software and am well compensated for it. I can't think of any reason why I'd go join a group of liberal left nutjobs who hate my religious beliefs and take a massive pay cut in the process. An education degree would do nothing for me. I'd be better off getting a degree in art, music, or creative writing. Those disciplines, at least, have some sort of cultural value. An education degree has almost no value at all for me at this point.

[-YYZ-]

On the flip side of that, by far the worst teachers I ever had were also college professors - probably brilliant in their academic work, but with poor abilities to communicate (often with accents so thick you could cut them with a knife) and get ideas across. Just having a good grasp of the subject material doesn’t necessarily qualify a person to lead a classroom of 20-35 children - some education in the subject of teaching is probably a good idea, too. At the university level at least we expect students to be self-motivated and work around their profs’ shortcomings, but at the public school level we expect teachers to have some abilities in teaching students who are not so motivated, too.

[Sloth]

Anyone who feels their skills are better than the vast majority of teachers can easily transition into the profession.

You must have a creative definition of the word "easily."

[bert]

Thought this was going to be a Harvard thread

[mysterio]

Yeah, because quitting you're job, going back to school to get a Masters in education all the while not getting your house repossessed is really quite easy.

They offer the courses at non-work times so you don't have to quit.

All to take a 30% pay cut,

Wait, I thought public school teachers were all overpaid and lazy. Which is it?

[JamesP81]

Wait, I thought public school teachers were all overpaid and lazy. Which is it?

Don't recall ever saying that, actually.

[JenB]

They can be overpaid and lazy and still making 30% less than, say, an engineer. Those concepts are hardly contradictory. Overpaid is relative to what they do, not relative to what someone else makes.

[meadsjn]

From the excerpt:

Were we serious about efforts to improve public education, one of the first things we would do is eliminate schools of education.

Williams is correct, as was Sowell 20 years ago, on this point.

Increasing teacher pay or overall public school funding will improve public education, so long as the schools of education exist. Teachers with BA/EDU degrees get MA/EDU degrees, and some of them get PhD/EDU degrees, and perpetuate the cycle of mediocrity, with the teachers unions holding the taxpayers' children for ransom for more funding.

The only way to improve public education is to eliminate 100% of the funding, return the money to parents and let them decide where to spend their education dollars. Given a choice, parents with above-average IQ children will not willingly send them to below-average IQ teachers.

[TontoKowalski]

Many states have programs designed to recruit mid-career professionals into the teaching profession. I know this because in April of this year, my wife quizzed me on when I'd be pursuing my dream of teaching. Well, I did a little research, made a few calls, took a subject-matter proficiency test, quit my job, and began teaching in August.

If your degree and background are in Math or Science, you'll have plenty of options.

[meadsjn]

Sorry, that should read:

Increasing teacher pay or overall public school funding will "NOT" improve public education ...