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Ancients Mashed Grapes Found In Greece (6,500 YA)
Discovery News ^ | 3-16-2007 | Jennifer Viegas

Posted on 03/16/2007 3:58:20 PM PDT by blam

Ancient Mashed Grapes Found in Greece

Jennifer Viegas, Discovery News

Ancient Grapes

March 16, 2007 — Either the ancient Greeks loved grape juice, or they were making wine nearly 6,500 years ago, according to a new study that describes what could be the world’s earliest evidence of crushed grapes.

If the charred 2,460 grape seeds and 300 empty grape skins were used to make wine, as the researchers suspect, the remains might have belonged to the second oldest known grape wine in the world, edged out only by a residue-covered Iranian wine jug dating to the sixth millennium B.C.

Since the Greeks influenced the Romans, who in turn influenced virtually all of Europe, it is possible that a drink made in a humble, post-framed house in eastern Macedonia influenced much of the world’s wine.

"For the Neolithic or the Bronze Age, we have no evidence for markets and a market economy," lead author Tania Valamoti told Discovery News.

"Production was on a household or communal basis," added Valamoti, who is a lecturer in the Department of Archaeology at Greece’s Aristotle University of Thessaloniki.

Valamoti and her team excavated four homes at a Neolithic site called Dikili Tash. After discovering the grape remains in one residence, they conducted charring experiments on fresh grapes, raisins and wine pressings to see what would best match the ancient seeds and skins. They determined the archaeological remains "morphologically resemble wine pressings and could not have originated from charred grapes or raisins."

Analysis of the grape remains determined they either were harvested from wild plants or originated from a very early cultivar.

Findings are published in the current journal Antiquities.

The scientists also found two-handled clay cups and jars, which they say suggest a use for decanting and consuming liquids. Charred figs were also found near the grape remnants. The presence of figs likely was not a coincidence, according to the researchers, who mentioned that juice from wild grapes often has a bitter taste. "Figs could have been added to the grape juice prior to fermentation and the sugars contained in them would have entered the juice," explained Valamoti. "Or, they could have been added to the fermented product after completion of the fermentation process. Honey could be dealt with in the same way."

The world’s oldest wine, a 9,000-year old rice wine from China, also contained honey and fruits.

The ancient Greek grapes might change wine history, as experts previously theorized grape wine-making could have first spread throughout the Middle East.

Patrick McGovern, a senior research scientist at the University of Pennsylvania, and one of the world’s leading ancient wine experts, has pointed out that "the wild grape never grew in ancient Egypt," yet evidence for wine there dates back to at least 2,700 B.C. Red wine residue was even found in King Tut’s tomb.

He and his colleagues believe wine-making became established in Egypt due to "early Bronze Age trade between Egypt and Palestine, encompassing modern Israel, the West Bank and Gaza, and Jordan."

But since the Phoenicians and the Greeks largely controlled Egyptian trade during much of the Pharaonic period, because many such individuals had settled into the Delta, it is now possible that Greeks brought wine into Egypt and into numerous other places, through Greece’s extensive trade routes.

Valamoti and her colleagues hope further studies can be conducted on the Dikili Tash pottery, to determine whether tartaric acid, a component of grapes and wine, was present in the cups.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: agriculture; godsgravesglyphs; grapes; greece; greeks; oenology; patrickmcgovern; wine; winemaking; zymurgy
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1 posted on 03/16/2007 3:58:26 PM PDT by blam
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To: SunkenCiv

GGG Ping.


2 posted on 03/16/2007 4:08:28 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

"a residue-covered Iranian wine jug dating to the sixth millennium B.C."

5500 BC? Isn't that 7500 years ago?
But how long ago were Adam and Eve?
Amazing that that jug survived the Flood.


3 posted on 03/16/2007 4:18:52 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (Le chien aboie; la caravane passe.)
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To: Vicomte13
Amazing that that jug survived the Flood.
From Noah's personal stash. ;-)
4 posted on 03/16/2007 4:20:37 PM PDT by peyton randolph (What we have done for others and the world remains and is immortal - Albert Pike)
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To: peyton randolph

Whoa, Noah was an Iranian?
Who knew?


5 posted on 03/16/2007 4:24:20 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (Le chien aboie; la caravane passe.)
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To: blam
since the Phoenicians and the Greeks largely controlled Egyptian trade during much of the Pharaonic period

Do not accept that statement.

6 posted on 03/16/2007 4:27:58 PM PDT by RightWhale (300 miles north of Big Wild Life)
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To: quantim

wine ping


7 posted on 03/16/2007 4:31:53 PM PDT by Fractal Trader
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To: Fractal Trader; NautiNurse; Amerigomag; andrew2527; AnAmericanMother; A Jovial Cad; Awgie; ...
Click to be +/- on this low volume wine ping list.

Oenology news ping.

8 posted on 03/16/2007 4:48:37 PM PDT by quantim (2008 => I'll take an imperfect winner over a perfect loser.)
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To: blam

Making alcohol: The oldest organic reaction known to man...


9 posted on 03/16/2007 5:02:47 PM PDT by Mikey_1962 (If you build it, they won't come...)
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To: blam; All; MoochPooch; Michael81Dus; Vicomte13; az_gila; Experiment 6-2-6; henkster; CT-Freeper; ...
A new pinglist, so if you're interested....

pan-Europe pinglist.*
This pinglist covers a broad range of topics relating to Europe: culture, current events, politics, science, history, arts, etc.

Warning: This could be a high volume pinglist.

Note: This pinglist covers--but not as much--Eastern Europe. There is already a moderate volume pinglist for that region.

Ping if you see a pertinent thread.

*To get on or off this list, freepmail with the subjects Europe on or Europe off .
No message is necessary.

To get on or get off this pinglist, freepmail here, with the appropriate subject.

There is also a:
John 3:16 (New King James Version): "16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
This pinglist can terminate at any time, without notice.

10 posted on 03/16/2007 5:27:20 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: blam; FairOpinion; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; 49th; ...
Thanks Blam. Wine not?

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

11 posted on 03/16/2007 11:33:06 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (I last updated my profile on Sunday, March 11, 2007. https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: SunkenCiv

How much did it take to make a cavewoman a "10".


12 posted on 03/16/2007 11:46:30 PM PDT by MARTIAL MONK
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To: blam

Hard to believe the intelligent Greeks went from wine made from grapes to wine made from pine sap (Retsina).

There must have been a dumbing down due to climate change (global freezing)for that to happen.


13 posted on 03/17/2007 9:34:01 AM PDT by wildbill
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To: wildbill
Greek Dark Ages

"The Dark Ages lasted from 1100 BC until 800 BC, or relatively to the time of Hellenic or Classical Greece. During this time the culture of Greece dwindled. Little is known of how many cultural elements were lost during the Dark Ages, but characteristic of the Dark Age, is the gradual decimation of any urbanized culture on the Greek mainland."

There was a worldwide tree-ring event at 1159BC. Maybe a serious volcano or an asteroid impact?

14 posted on 03/17/2007 10:40:54 AM PDT by blam
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To: wildbill

Take that back.

Retsina is no worse than the abomination known as mead, or berry-fermented/flavored wines.

On the other hand, resin flavor is an acquired taste. You need to start drinking it at 13, while eating octopus, sardines on the grill, cheeses, and fresh, bitter arugula. By the time you are 18, you just love it.

Sort of tastes like gasoline, only less complex.


15 posted on 03/17/2007 12:52:38 PM PDT by aristotleman (I actually hate philosophy >>this is my real name)
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To: aristotleman

On the contrary, Scotch is an acquired taste. Only real men would flavor a favorite beverage with peat.

Retsina on the other hand is for people who'll eat the bark off of trees because their pitiful landscape is so bereft of goodness.


16 posted on 03/17/2007 4:09:28 PM PDT by wildbill
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To: blam
I recently discovered some ancient mashed grapes myself, at a local restaurant.

The proprietors called it "Chardonnay." I called it swill.
17 posted on 03/17/2007 7:43:05 PM PDT by Radix (Time served in the Congress should be reason enough to disallow a person from the Presidency)
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To: aristotleman
"You need to start drinking it at 13, while eating octopus, sardines on the grill, cheeses, and fresh, bitter arugula."

Do you mean ARGULA?

Argula Salad

18 posted on 03/17/2007 7:47:30 PM PDT by blam
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To: wildbill
Pity the poor muslim tribesmen who, lacking the access and religious permission to swill any alcoholic beverages, are reduced to licking the sweat from a camel's rump in order to achieve intoxication of the level which will turn their ape-like female tent wenches into an arabic equal of the Western man's "10".
19 posted on 03/17/2007 8:01:23 PM PDT by Thumper1960 (Unleash the Dogs of War as a Minority, or perish as a party.)
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To: quantim

Please ping me. (I love wine!)


20 posted on 03/18/2007 2:35:20 PM PDT by MoochPooch (I'm a compassionate cynic.)
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