Archimedes manuscript yields secrets under X-ray gaze

PhysOrg.com ^ | 20 May 2005 | Staff

[6SJ7]

Two centuries later, with parchment harder to come by, the ink was erased with a weak acid (like lemon juice) and scraped off with a pumice stone...

I'm not sure I buy this explanation. Sounds like a lot of work to 'recycle' this bit of parchment. What, was there a shortage of goatskins suddenly? This sounds more like a rather strange 'coverup' for reasons now unknown.

[GOPJ]

Three pages of the palimpsest recently traveled to Menlo Park because SSRL staff scientist Uwe Bergmann had his own Eureka moment in 2003. From a magazine article, he learned the inks used for both the Archimedes and religious texts contained iron pigment.

"I read that and I immediately thought we should be able to read the parchment with X-rays," Bergmann said. "That's what we do at SSRL — we measure iron in proteins — extremely small concentrations of iron."

Thank you Bergmann - thanks from all of us. What a great find.

[Amelia]

Interesting stuff.

[Scenic Sounds]

That is cool! ;-)

[NicknamedBob]

"...I've never seen a NakedMathWithFeathers ping list on FR."

Please put me on your NakedMathWithFeathers ping list.

When do we meet? Do I have to bring my own feathers?

[PatrickHenry]

What a great find.

You gotta wonder what the world would have been like if the Greek and Roman civilization hadn't collapsed and work like this had never been lost. We might have been 1,000 years more advanced from where we are now.

[JasonC]

More like, an early example of the effect of poverty and "recycling" on cultural artifacts. A book then cost what an automobile costs today, the physical object.

[JasonC]

Or recurrent civil wars, mad tyrants, blood sport, a thousand bizarre superstitions, and routine public torture might have eventually digusted everybody. Don't selectively romanticize the past. The present isn't all Feynman and Einstein and the past wasn't all Archimedes and Ptolomy.

[Calvin Locke]

Any chance of getting the mpeg or mp3 of Archimedes original "Eureka!" moment?

[dsc]

"Obviously it was."

There's nothing obvious about it. We have no way of knowing what the motivation of the recycler was, or how many duplicate copies he had.

Besides, from the little description we get from this article, it doesn't appear that there was anything there that the Church would have had any interest in suppressing, anyway.

[Dimensio]

Hmm...

[PatrickHenry]

[longshadow]

We might have been 1,000 years more advanced from where we are now.

Not to mention that we would have skipped the Dark Ages.... a period of human history we could have done without....

[doc30]

Sounds like what Kansas wants to do to the very definition of science. Human nature never changes.

[PatrickHenry]

Not to mention that we would have skipped the Dark Ages.... a period of human history we could have done without....

Well, you have to look at the bright side. During that period, the old pagan religions were finally snuffed out, we got rid of a lot of witches, built cathedrals, recycled pagan manuscripts into prayer books, and shook off that ridiculous Roman fetish for fresh running water and daily baths. Not a bad time, all things considered.

[CobaltBlue]

My guess is that the culprit was a math moron and couldn't have known the value of the text.

[longshadow]

Not a bad time, all things considered.

Especially if you liked Plagues, ignorance, superstition, and a lack of personal hygiene....

[Plutarch]

Not to mention that we would have skipped the Dark Ages.... a period of human history we could have done without....

[PatrickHenry]

The Pantheon in Rome

[KC_for_Freedom]

You gotta wonder what the world would have been like if the Greek and Roman civilization hadn't collapsed and work like this had never been lost. We might have been 1,000 years more advanced from where we are now.

Things probably progressed as well as they could, what seems to stop societies in their tracks is the nutty idea that if it is in the holy book its true and all one needs and if it is not in the holy book it is not worth learning. I seem to remember this is a tenant of radical Islam today. The real question is what happened to the men who, like Newton could understand the writings of people like Archimedes during the dark ages. There must have been some in the Church, but outside the church, what did they do?