Posted on 05/14/2004 4:44:10 PM PDT by ambrose
Wadda you nuts? The Eyeties already have so many Muslims they will soon have to import Italian food from Boston.
Anger towards us as a group is ridiculous because the majority of us had no hand in the crimes that have been cited in this forum or in the news.
On one level I hear you. But on another I'm thinking, "Well, I wish more Muslims, many more, would stand up and condemn the things the terrorist Muslims are doing. I wish the general Muslim population would take care of this problem themselves so the rest of us don't have to."
Especially under the shadow of potential attacks this summer, we want to know what side you're on.
If Muslims everywhere took to the streets en masse decrying the actions of al Qaeda and other Muslim terrorists it'd be easier to let go of some of the anger and distrust.
Fitz said: "Extraordinary enough to buy or be given a 6 year old girl? Have sex with a little 9 year old --- there is only one thing that can explain the attraction for a 50+ year old man for a little girl that young. If you have daughters --- could you possibly turn them over to a man old enough to be her grandfather for him to pleasure himself with?"
Fitz, Fitz, Fitz. You are wrong again. There is misinformation everywhere and you have to be careful if you want to stay truthful. What you are claiming NEVER happened.
If you really want the whole truth, why not ask instead of continuing to shout false information? You've cited a lot of reasons throughout your posts to support your dislike/hate for Islam and Muslims but all of your reasons are false-but surely you are not alone. Maybe it's easier for some Americans to just believe that there is something inherently wrong with Islam because that way there is no effort involved. Blind hate, spreading false information, believing false information; it's all much easier than taking one's time to find out what's really going on.
What's wrong with typing, "I've heard XYZ. Is this true?"
You mentioned in an earlier post that there is nothing that needs to be 'explained away' as regards Jesus, Moses and Abraham, peace be upon them all.
And I am telling you that there is nothing that needs to be 'explained away' as regards Mohammed, peace and blessings be upon him.
I don't care whose Muslim friend told you what, that does not mean that everything or anything they say is sound proof that it is a part of Islam.
How do you know what I'm saying is true? I know me but you don't. I'm hoping that anything I say you would of course verify on your own. It's easy enough to get the telephone number to a mosque in your area and ask a question or many questions. I would like to politely remind you to please try to refrain from calling during prayer times.
If you're scared that someone might try to convert you, LOL, try one of the reputable websites that I mentioned. Most of them have links to email scholars and ask questions.
I'm going to tell you about what really happened regarding the marriage of our beloved Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, to Aeisha (raa). But don't take my word for it, VERIFY IT! I will try to keep this short but if you ignore any of the following then you are not interested in the whole truth.
Our Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, had one wife for the majority of his life, Khadija (raa), until she died. From the page that I referred you to on polygamy:
He had all his children, except one, from Khadijah. Thus, she and her children enjoyed the Prophet's full attention (and he theirs) for as long as she was married to him; twenty-five years. For all practical purposes, Muhammad had one wife - from the age of 25 to 50. During the remaining 13 years of his life, he married the aged widows of his friends who left many children (after their deaths). The children needed a complete home, with a fatherly figure, and the Prophet provided that. Providing a fatherly figure for orphans is the only specific circumstance in support of polygamy mentioned in the Quran (4:3). This perfect example tells us that a man must give his full attention and loyalty in marriage to his wife and children in order to raise a happy and wholesome family.
Aeisha's father, Abu Bakr (raa), was a great friend of the Prophet's, peace and blessings be upon him.
Abu Bakr had other daughters besides Aeisha (raa) but at this time in history they were all older and all were already widows. Aeisha (raa) was young and of course, a virgin. At the age of 9, she became ENGAGED to our Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him. There were no sexual relations at this time. The engagement (and later marriage) like all good things had many benefits, not just one.
This brought Abu Bakr (raa) great joy and he was honored by this as it would establish traditional family ties among them. The fact that Aeisha (raa) was young is also key. Her youth enabled her to learn how the Prophet lived until his death. This is important because it is through her that people were able to know how he lived when behind closed doors. So Aeisha was able to see and then teach others these details. As to her youth she outlived our Prophet and continued to teach others about parts of his life that no one else was privy to. She was very bright and intelligent, modest, opinionated, humble, curious and kind. She always asked the Prophet questions until she fully understood things.
For example, if someone that were anti-Muslim were to read that Muslim women should pray behind Muslim men or if there is not enough space behind them then perhaps a separate room, if you don't question this then you might make an assumption which is incorrect. You might assume upon reading this and point to this and say see they treat women as second class citizens. But if you ask why this is so you will see that it is very wise and has nothing to do with treating women badly. It's just the opposite.
Think about the way that Muslims pray. There is a position called sujud or prostration. We kneel and then put our foreheads on the ground while putting our hands a few inches from our heads. In this position, to be completely frank, your butt is in the air and facing anyone behind you. Ladies in the forum, imagine praying in a room full of people and just before the prayer you notice a man is directly behind you. How would you feel having your butt a few inches away from his face? Now turn it around. Men, imagine that you believe as we do that during this prayer you ARE speaking to God Almighty and so you want very much to stay focused. But you can't see or hear God The Merciful, focus takes strong faith and practice. Now you notice while moving from the standing position to the sujud position that the woman in front of you has a great bum. Can you truly NOT think about it, not even once? I apologize for the length but this is only one example. You mentioned getting to the root of my faith. I hope that by this example you can see that the roots are perfect.
Aeisha (raa) and the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, were married and the marriage is said to have been consumated when Aeisha was either 11 or 12. Yes, shocking to an American in this century however ask an historian and you will find that this was completely normal during this time and no one would have even batted an eyelash.
You don't have to like it or agree with it but using false information to hate or twisting the truth so that you can justify your hate to yourselves is immoral in any religion.
Now, would I allow my own daughter at the age of 11 or 12 to get married? In the 14th century? Yes. In 2004? No.
I agree with you that Muslims in the U.S. need to speak out against the terror attacks-all of them.
The issue that we're having right now is who do we turn to, to make such statements? If you can name a well known American Muslim Association for me without turning to a search engine or the Yellow Pages then I will seek them out upon learning their contact information. Nothing coming to mind? If it does then I'll be shocked, LOL.
The thing is that there are organizations out there but they aren't yet established enough to represent ALL Muslim-Americans or even the majority of us. God-willing with time and determination there will be such an organization soon. Soon enough to make a statement this summer that would satisfy the American majority? Unfortunately, I don't think that it will happen that quickly. Do I wish that it would happen that quickly? Of course I do.
I can refer you to an organization, the American Islamic Congress, which states very clearly:
"Not only should Americans accept Muslims as Americans citizens without any hatred or suspicion - but Muslim Americans have a responsibility to denounce those who speak in the name of Islam and call for the death of Americans and innocent civilians in general, including Israelis. American Muslims must confront the extremism that is propagated in the name of our religion."
This is only 1 organization, there are many that have this very same agenda. One of our biggest problems is getting these small organizations together to form one or several large ones. This is something that myself and many others are working towards.
I have a sneaking suspicion that when a terrorist attack occurs anywhere in the world, The New York Times isn't beating any of their doors down for a statement. You know what I mean?
With respect and politeness, what "side" we are on should be clear. Just think about it for a moment: If me or any of my Muslim friends or the members of my congregation or the other small congregations in my city and state were all running around "killing disbelievers" as so many anti-Muslim Americans are keen to point to as if it were truth, then certainly the 5 or 6 o'clock news would turn into a non-stop 24/7 news channel and neither you nor I would get a chance to have this chat. And boy do I wish that we were able to chat about something else! Terrorism is wrong and is not a part of Islam.
Fitz said: "And as far as that one --- Muslim friends of mine told me what "mutah" or "mutaa'" is all about. A temporary marriage --- that can last a night or two in exchange for gifts of some kind. I knew a woman from here who was in such a temporary marriage --- they would agree to a month at a time and she'd get some piece of jewelry or once -- a pen and pencil set."
Hey Fitz. Sorry, wrong again. Please tell your Muslim friends that they need to stop speaking as they don't know what they're talking about, at least from what you've told me so far.
"Temporary marriage?" Sounds like temporary insanity to me. What they are referring to is forbidden in our religion. This isn't Islamic, what you're talking about is something that some men do in order to justify to themselves their own corrupt actions. From my limited knowledge on this subject, this occurs mostly with wealthy men that want to "marry" another woman but keep it a secret from their actual wife. It's absolutely suicide in my own opinion because by doing this he's trying to convince himself that if there is a ceremony performed in secret then it's okay. WRONG! As if God Almighty did not know the true intentions of the hearts and minds of these men. These men and women are fooling themselves and no one else. Any man or woman that would choose Hell for eternity in exchange for a pen and pencil set or all the wealth in the world deserves exactly what they get.
As I said before, my knowledge on this subject is very limited. I will try to remember to get more details today from my Imam but I'm certain that this is wrong and not a part of Islam.
Hi Fitz.
I know that I answered you in private but I forgot to post it here as well.
In double-checking with the Imam of my mosque, I am correct and this so-called "temporary marriage" is NOT a part of Islam. This is a complete innovation of religion and a ticket to punishment for sure.
Muslim Woman: In case some of you may have forgotten, America is not a Christian nation.
katnip: Wishful thinking?
Hello katnip. Wishful thinking? No. As I have stated in another post, Muslims are not to expect everyone to convert to Islam. Not at all.
And this is true, America is not a Christian nation. America may have a Christian majority but it is not a Christian nation.
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