Pope wants new international order to keep peace

Reuters | January 1, 2004 | Claire Soares

[HAL9000]

VATICAN CITY, Jan 1 (Reuters) - The world needs a "new international order" to solve its conflicts and ensure peace, Pope John Paul said in his New Year's Day address on Thursday.

The ghosts of 2003 -- when the United States invaded Iraq without United Nations approval -- dominated the pope's first speech of 2004.

"More than ever we need a new international order which draws on the experience and results of the United Nations," the 83-year-old pontiff said at a mass in St Peter's Basilica.

"An order which is capable of finding adequate solutions to today's problems, based on the dignity of human beings, on integrating all society, on solidarity between rich and poor countries, on the sharing of resources and the extraordinary results of scientific and technological progress," he added.

Speaking at Christendom's largest church, the pope urged people not to lose hope of finding peace in the Holy Land, which the Vatican feels is vital to winning the war on terror.

"The land in which Jesus was born sadly continues to live in a dramatic condition. And in other parts of the world sparks of violence and conflict have not been extinguished either. But we need to persevere and not bow to the temptation of losing hope."

Turning to Africa, the pope paid tribute to his Burundi ambassador, Michael Courtney, killed on Monday in an ambush the army has blamed on rebels who have refused to join a peace process to end a 10-year conflict.

"(He) was tragically killed...while he was going about his mission of promoting dialogue and reconciliation. We pray for him and hope his example and sacrifice will bear the fruits of peace in Burundi and the world," the pope said.

The leader of the world's one billion Catholics, who suffers from Parkinson's disease that makes it difficult for him to talk, seemed alert and read all of his homily in a clear voice.

But it is unclear what 2004 holds for him. For the first time since his election in 1978, the pope enters the new year with no firm plans for travel, although there have been some invitations.

He was particularly weak on his last foreign trip, a visit to Slovakia in September, when aides had to read most of his addresses for him.

[Cap'n Crunch]

Sure, let every man be his own guide. Seems to me that now we have man's theocracy, and the diminishing amendments.

[Ciexyz]

SO, the Pope is saying, anyone but the USA.

[cajungirl]

What happened with him,,he is a mystery to me. He came into the FBI and I breathed a sigh of relief. Then he just disappeared, somehow maybe with the FBI files thing. Then he left. It was passing strange. And what did he lie about?

[Bluntpoint]

"Blackelk always caters these threads."

[Publius6961]

I am an innocent bystander here.

Naaaaah!
You haven't really arrived at FR until you've been folded, stapled and mutilated a few times. And forced to buy a few Nomex outfits.
Congratulations!

[EGPWS]

The world needs a "new international order" to solve its conflicts and ensure peace, Pope John Paul said in his New Year's Day address on Thursday.

I remember the good ol' days when the Pope referenced a religious need in God and his son Christ.

Nowadays he is referencing a "political" need.

I give up anymore!

[cajungirl]

Pub, I have been mutilated in a couple of hot threads but avoid the religious threads assiduously {love that word}. But this is interesting me, especially the Inquisition idea, maybe it wasn't so bad {for some reason I am laughiing out loud}

[Publius6961]

Reformationists are happy people!

Well, then, it shoudn't be hard to find an image of Rex there with a smile on his face?
Ya think?

[gcruse]

LOL

[Petronski]

"More than ever we need a new international order which draws on the experience and results of the United Nations," the 83-year-old pontiff said at a mass in St Peter's Basilica.

This statement is profoundly disappointing.

[Tao Yin]

Ya gotta go with Rome on the religious stuff if you are a Christian. There is some injunction in Scripture against adding or detracting and your suggestion that Peter is referenced by Christ as Satan is a prime example of why. Are we to believe that Peter blessed and recognized by Christ as the rock (as you concede) is also Satan? Really, the lengths to which you go!

My suggestions? You are ridiculous. Read Matthew 16!

Matthew 16:23 But he turned and said to Peter, "Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man." (ESV)

I’m serious. Go and read Matthew 16! Please!

After Jesus called Peter the rock, He called him Satan! (Matthew 16:23) I neither add nor subtract. However, you seem to want to subtract verse 23! You can not use scripture to fit your desires and beliefs.

I think you are getting confused between the God's Word and man's word. The Catholic Church's words are fallible, and therefore the word of man and not God.

And why are you so bitter about 500 years ago. There is the church and the Church. The "church" is each individual building. The "Church" is all believers in Christ. When you speak about the Catholic Church being the "Church", you are incorrect. You are speaking about a synod. The fact that the Catholic Church lost its monopoly does not mean a thing to the Church. The believers in Christ were still the believers in Christ.

500 years ago, people took a stand. Some for the Word of God, and others for the word of man.

[X-Servative]

What part of "Prince of Peace" did everyone miss on Christmas? That was the brilliance of God's plan by sending His Son, not as a great military leader as the Jews wanted, but as the Prince of Peace. God knows the heart of men and that brute force was not the answer to saving humanity. Christianity is about changing hearts to find Him and eternal life, not about killing people. From a religious perspective, the Pope is right on.

All of that being said, this is a great example of the why the founding fathers had a seperation of church and state. Religion and government play two very different roles,

[Publius6961]

Gotta go to Mass. Like MacArthur, I shall return!

Ahnold's last name is McArthur?
wait...

[DallasMike]

Calling me a tree does not make me grow roots.

Thank you. When BlackElk's friends are confronted with reason and logic and a good grasp of the Bible and church history, they call BlackElk in to (a) bellow that any non-Catholic who disputes a Catholic teaching is a Catholic-basher; and (b) bellow that any Catholic who disputes a Catholic teaching liberal bent on destroying the Catholic church from within.

Neither of the two types of bellowing is very convincing to a rational person but his friends are very impressed.

[Bluntpoint]

He smiles some times but it perturbs his catholic mama to no end.

[Mr. Mojo]

The world needs a "new international order"

The Pontiff is stealing GHWB's lines.

[GirlShortstop]

SO, the Pope is saying, anyone but the USA.

That could be... or not.  Consider this hypothetical if you will:  

I run a ball team.  Said team fails to win the World Series.  After contemplating this outcome, I decide that I should draw upon my players, and their talent, pull those who really did excel, and start a new team.

I'm not putting together the same team, rather, I am using what is good, what has worked and establishing a better team.  If one were to speculate or assume that I would omit from my new roster the homerun hitter who swung on 3 and 0 despite my sign, that's just that, speculation and assumption.

I don't think that you can deny that my motive is to build a better team.
H A P P Y     N E W     Y E A R

[cajungirl]

Ah! Thanks for your post, I am getting the picture. You all do know each other! Still fighting over the Reformation. That is inspiring to me, people still having this kind of conversation in the middle of our crazy culture.

[Cap'n Crunch]

sshhhhhh, don't say that too loudly.

[Publius6961]

Can't fool me! That's a long-suppresed image of Mohammed. (The one with the short hair, sans towel.)

[Bluntpoint]

What crazy culture?

[cajungirl]

We have the same fantasy. I was thinking of a New World Order with the US as the head guy along with Romania, Italy, Spain, Britain. We set the rules, we make the agenda. Sort of our own UN where we get the big vote, cause we have the big guns and the notion of freedom.

[DallasMike]

There is some injunction in Scripture against adding or detracting ...

Thanks for my laugh of the day! Where do I start: Mary's perpetual virginity, Mary's sinlessnes, Purgatory, selling indulgences, the notion that works are required for salvation?

You should practice what you bellow, er, preach.

Note that you started this by giving unwanted advice to Catholics.

No, the pope started this by giving unwarranted advice to the entire world. Please do try to get your facts straight.

[Publius6961]

Girls should never play baseball.

[GirlShortstop]

We have the same fantasy. I was thinking of a New World Order with the US as the head guy along with Romania, Italy, Spain, Britain.

Glad you metioned Italy... gotta have the Paisans, yes!
FReegards.

[cajungirl]

Blunt, it is crazy. Now I am old and maybe it is just my oldness but I despair of what I see. I keep hoping that what I see is the tip of the iceberg with all the good sort of lying down there in wait for the top to melt. But what with JaRule, Brittany, JLO, OJ, Scott, the Clintons,the UN, etc, it just seems at times we have all gone crazy.

[Bluntpoint]

Mohammed with head piece.

Without.

[Tao Yin]

Can we include Poland? I'm half Polish.

[GirlShortstop]

Girls should never play baseball.

Because we may put some fella's "talents" to shame?

[lawdude]

Nice ambition but totally dilusional. We live in a hard world Pope, better get used to it.

[Publius6961]

...Brittany, JLO, OJ, Scott, the Clintons,the UN, etc, it just seems at times we have all gone crazy.

No need to get morose here... Sooner or later we must accept the reality: when the inmates outnumber the keepers, the roles reverse. It's only fair. Egalitarianism is a simple concept for simple times.

[DallasMike]

You all do know each other! Still fighting over the Reformation.

Yeah, BlackElk is the "big gun" who is always brought in to save the day from us supposed Catholic bashers.

[WackyKat]

Please quit your usual whining about Catholic-bashing. It is so tiresome and predictable

that is their usual tactic.

They post articles with some Catholic churchman making pronouncements on political issues, telling us what our laws should be,etc then when people criticize this they scream "Catholic-bashing"!to try and intimidate the opposition.

That it doesn't work doesn't stop them from trying.

They want to have it both ways-to influence our laws according to their beliefs and yet be immune from criticism because their beliefs are religious.

[Publius6961]

Because we may put some fella's "talents" to shame?

HEY!
No need to get personal!

OK... who blabbed... ?

[Bluntpoint]

I don't care how old you feel, you are still a good dancer!

[DallasMike]

LOL!

[Publius6961]

OK I give up. I now when I'm outclassed.

I just got to learn this image posting thing...

[DallasMike]

They want to have it both ways-to influence our laws according to their beliefs and yet be immune from criticism because their beliefs are religious.

Come now, we can't have reason and logic around here. BlackElk obviously hasn't bellowed enough at you yet.

[WackyKat]

Sure, let every man be his own guide. Seems to me that now we have man's theocracy, and the diminishing amendments

And the Catholic Church has a long history of supporting the freedoms of the First Amendment, and the rest of the Bill of Rights?

Suuuure it does

[cajungirl]

I am not that old!!!! It is a funny pic.

[Cap'n Crunch]

I've never been one to yell "catholic basher", in fact, I think it meritorious when folks get ugly when referring to the Church or the Pope. I happen to like BlackElk's posts, his knowledge and his orthodoxy. He's an inspiration to me.

Many say that this country is based on Judeo/Christian beliefs. Since every Christian denomination splintered off of the Catholic Church, and Catholics live in nearly every country of the world, the Holy Father is going to express his opinion. Much of the world, including many 'catholics' aren't going to listen to what the Pope says. I suppose that is their choice.

I believe that the more we reject God and make ourselves god we will fall more and more under the tyrannical rule of man. Even in this country, which is well on it's way to ruin, in my humble opinion.

[cajungirl]

of course, all former eastern bloc nations. And all who helped us in Iraq. And the Aussies just cause they are so cute.

[the blood of tyrants]

"And what did he lie about?"

See "Waco".

[Bluntpoint]

Thanks to modern medicine, you need not ever get old.

[Cap'n Crunch]

Can you be specific with #239?

[Robert Drobot]

His Holiness should be exhorting Christian Warriors to smite the Muslim devils and drive them from the Holy Land. Having Bethlehem draped in posters of Arafat during Christmas was the last straw.

The world needs a Warrior Pope. Not an appeaser.

Worth repeating.

To think that this pretender is alleged to be the defender of the Christian faith, while he embraces the murderer of children - his heathen buddy Arafart.

JPII has shamed The Seat of Peter.

[Cap'n Crunch]

HAHAHAHAHAHA... your own country has given Carte Blanche to the murder of children for 30 years.

[AmericanVictory]

Wont someone please tell the old boy that we're making one and he's not helping?

[Russ7]

"Sorry, Jesus did not found the Catholic Church. He would not create something so flawed."

He created you, didn't He?

[Bluntpoint]

JPII has shamed The Seat of Peter.

I think his underling Cardinals have been messing with the "Seat of Peter!"