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Ron Paul: Our Liberties Come From Our Creator
Christian Post ^ | 2011-06-04 | Stephanie Samuel

Posted on 06/05/2011 6:54:55 AM PDT by rabscuttle385

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To: Reagan Man

“Conservatives believe in defending America. Libertarians do not.”

That’s not true. Yes, for the Reason Foundation (which I like), Ron Paul, et. al. sure, that’s a true statement. That is *not* true for all libertarians and would venture a guess that this is a minority (but well-funded) group within libertarianism. I’m a libertarian with the good understanding that:

1. Protecting personal liberties is the primary duty of the federal government. Not banking, not the environment, not education, not employment, and not stopping personal decisions that harm the individual, no matter how galactically stupid. When the feds dig their hands into these areas, they inevitably invade on our personal, God given liberties.

2. The only way the government can ensure our liberties is by actively fighting all enemies, foreign and domestic.

3. Supporting other nations with free markets and free peoples strengthens our freedoms. Israel rocks and they have my support; not because they are Jews or they are Israel or they are “God’s people,” but because they are the only nation in the Middle East that understands the basic concepts of freedom. The rest of the loons over there want to (and have) come here and take away the very freedoms the government should protect. Oh yeah, and the Israelis kick a$$.

There are plenty of libertarians out there who would take all the money going to Departments of Education and other useless bureaucrats and get it to defense. You can’t have personal liberty without a strong defense. Unfortunately, scumbag bureaucrats dole out wasteful contracts to their friends, which doesn’t help defense, but gives it a bad name.

Now you may continue your bashing of Ron Paul’s foreign policy positions without saying he speaks for all libertarians.


61 posted on 06/05/2011 5:25:26 PM PDT by cizinec
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To: andyk

http://www.seattlepi.com/default/article/2012ers-still-running-on-ethanol-1409873.php


62 posted on 06/05/2011 5:34:15 PM PDT by chilepup
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To: chilepup

Well I give you credit for trying, but that’s not support for ethanol subsidies. If that’s the best you have, I would love to see what your preferred candidate likes. Regardless, kudos to you, sir or madam. I appreciate your response.


63 posted on 06/05/2011 5:41:40 PM PDT by andyk (Interstate <> Intrastate)
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To: chilepup
that’s not support for ethanol subsidies.

Just wanted to clarify, in case others were not sure, if those are subsidies, then the mortgage interest deduction is a subsidy. By your definition, standard deductions are subsidies.

I'd hate to even bring up welfare like child tax credits, if you think that standard deductions are subsidies.
64 posted on 06/05/2011 5:51:11 PM PDT by andyk (Interstate <> Intrastate)
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To: cizinec
LOL You can extrapolate, reformulate or recreate libertarianism any way you choose. Means nothing, however. Obfuscation can not change the historic record. Sorry, revisionism just won't work.

Since the creation of modern libertarianism in America back in 1971, Ron Paul has been the most high profile Libertarian/libertarian of the last 40 years. And Reason magazine is the major mouthpiece of libertarianism as disseminated by the Libertarian Party.

The Godfather of modern libertarianism is Murray Rothbard. He would disagree on your #2 and would call you more a neoconservative, not a true libertarian.

I see you as a neo-libertarian -— a factional thinker and hopelessly confused!

65 posted on 06/05/2011 6:03:42 PM PDT by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: andyk

How do you figure that? A subsidy is a subsidy....we pay for it. Ron Paul is trying to parse words in an effort to support ethanol...and add this to his $400 million in earmarks, and we are beginning to see a trend. His statements make no sense.


66 posted on 06/06/2011 5:04:34 AM PDT by chilepup
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To: andyk
Friend, he's accomplished as much as ONE congressman can accomplish on his own

I gave him credit for acquiring all those earmarks, and I agree he did that all on his own. Other than that though he has done nothing. Nothing, either working with others, which is something a person usually needs to be able do in order to get anything meaningful accomplished, or alone.
67 posted on 06/06/2011 9:08:42 AM PDT by John D
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To: rabscuttle385

I don’t disagree with that at all. I still don’t think you can take a hit like 09/11, and not send a clear message to the terrorists and their organization that they will cease to exist if they do that sort of thing.

We didn’t take much action after our embassies and the Cole were attacked. Did that buy us any safety, less hatred overseas?

We weren’t occupying any nations in the Middle-East as of 09/11/01.

The price of freedom is spilling some blood from time to time, and preferably our enemy’s, and as many of them as possible.


68 posted on 06/06/2011 9:55:22 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Conservatism: Come up with a better political belief system, and I'll adopt it as my own.)
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To: DoughtyOne
I still don’t think you can take a hit like 09/11, and not send a clear message to the terrorists and their organization that they will cease to exist if they do that sort of thing.

Of course not - but you know the fix is in when the mission is renamed from "Infinite Justice" to "Enduring Freedom."

69 posted on 06/06/2011 10:06:15 AM PDT by rabscuttle385 (Live Free or Die)
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To: Reagan Man

Nah. Rothbard is an anarcho-capitalist. He coined the phrase to describe himself. The Libertarian Party is most certainly an offshoot of these nuts. Ayn Rand is another devotee of this sort of anarchism.

I’m no more confused than Bill Buckley was (until he decided it was a good idea to ban tobacco). I would argue that what we call “libertarianism” is no more than a recovery of the 18th century idea of liberalism. Whether that be termed “minarchist” or some other nonsensical and hyper-modern label, the concept has been unchanged since before the American Revolution and most definitely before 1971.


70 posted on 06/06/2011 10:35:35 AM PDT by cizinec
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To: cizinec
Libertarian factionalism and anarcho-capitalism aside. Rothbard is a libertarian, period. The Father of modern libertarianism. As we live in 2011 and not 1789.

If you don't want to be linked with the likes of the Paul's, Rothbard, Rockwell, DiLorenzo and others. I suggest you find a label that better suits your politics. Btw, classic liberal is not it.

71 posted on 06/06/2011 11:41:55 AM PDT by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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