From Canterbury to Rome: Why the Queen’s Former Chaplain Became Catholic

National Catholic Register ^ | 8 March 2020 | KV Turley

[attiladhun2]

Orthodox doctrine comes from Scripture, not Popes or councils. The Roman Catholic Church is an institution created by man for man. That the Pope is styled “Vicar of Christ” is evidence. He and the organization he leads is a substitute for the preaching of the Gospel, and a poor one at that. Lots of ritual and color in RC ceremonies that appeal to the pride of man and to his flesh.

[edwinland]

Wow ... superb analysis. A good example of how to use clear thinking to cut through a sandstorm of lies and sin and keep your hold on truth.

[Cronos]

Orthodox doctrine and Catholic doctrine come from scripture. The Church, the community of Christ is what birthed scripture.

Let’s see, the Catholic Church, the Orthodox, the Orientals and the Assyrians all
1. Believe in Jesus’s words about baptism and the salvic nature of that sacrament
2. Believe in the True Presence of Christ in the Eucharist (as do the Lutherans)
3. Believe in the sacrament of confession (as do Lutherans)
4. have a structure of elders (bishops) and presbyteroi (priests)

this is the Church of Christ as inaugurated in 33 AD as the pentecost. The Catholic Church is the church of the pentecost

[Cronos]

btw, you don't seem to know much about the Orthodox church, do you?

[Cronos]

And pretty definitely you don't know what the Oriental churches are, do you?

[Cronos]

And pretty definitely you would need to read the Bible, wouldn't you?

For your brother Aaron you will make sacred vestments to give dignity and magnificence. You will instruct all the skilled men, whom I have endowed with skill, to make Aaron’s vestments for his consecration to my priesthood. These are the vestments which they must make: a pectoral, an ephod, a robe, an embroidered tunic, a turban, and a belt. They must make sacred vestments for your brother Aaron and his sons, for them to be priests in my service. They will use gold and violet material, red-purple and crimson, and finely woven linen.

Exodus 28:2:

or Acts 20:28 28 Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God,[a] which he bought with his own blood.

Eph 2:20 19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21 In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord.

ePh 4 11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, 12 to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13 until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

Phil 1:1 "To all God’s holy people in Christ Jesus at Philippi, together with the overseers and deacon"

it was the laity who changed their attire, not to distinguish themselves from priests, but to keep up with fashions.

Catholic priests simply retained their manner of liturgical dress.

[Cronos]

btw and " that appeal to the pride of man and to his flesh."

width = 700>

Showmanship and

appealing to the pride of man

or woman...

[MayflowerMadam]

Is it really a big transition?

I dated a guy was was Anglican, and he said it’s “J.V. Catholic”.

[Hieronymus]

If you are Congregationalist tending towards Baptist (which would be the best guess to make given your screen name), or a non-believer, they look basically the same—just like the Life of Brian, from some perspectives, looks basically the same as the Life of Christ.

If you are close to the subject, or a believer, they appear to be different.

[Cronos]

it depends.

The Anglican church retains a Calvinist philosophy with the external trappings (but not the depth) of Catholicism.

In many ways this was a compromise solution arrived at by good queen Bess.

[Cronos]

As an aside - read the "Stripping of the altars" by Eamon Duffy

The liturgy lay at the heart of the English religion, and the Mass lay at the heart of the liturgy. In the Mass the redemption of the world, wrought on Good Friday once and for all, was renewed and made fruitful for all who believed. Christ Himself became present on the altar of the parish church, body, soul and divinity and he nourished and renewed the Church and the world. As kneeling congregations raised their eyes to see the Host held high, they were transported to Calvary itself, and gathered not only into the passion and resurrection of Christ, but into the full sweep of salvation history as a whole

It then describes how Harry 8's destruction tore out the soul of the English nation that was then trampled upon by Cromwell.

Good book to read if a little weighty

[attiladhun2]

So you are admitting that ceremonies, costumes, rituals, staffs, burning incense, etc. are appeals to the flesh. Because everything that draws people away from the Gospel, i.e., the message that Yeshua the Messiah and Son of God, was crucified on the cross for our sins and was risen from the dead on the third day, and appeared to his disciples for 40 days hence, is an appeal to the flesh.

[Marchmain]

Hail Mary! She’s the opposite of appealing to the flesh.
Purity in body and soul, an example to all men and women of faith.

[attiladhun2]

Hail Mary is idolatry. Praying to saints is necromancy. The Roman system incorporsted the ideology of Babylon unto itself, and is about to incorporate that of Marx and Gramsci.

[Cronos]

Nope, I’m pointing out the plank in yer eye of the showmanship of the evangelical pasters.

Do you think a Creflo Dollar or Paula White or Joel osteen or any Baptist fiery preacher needs to have the fire and brimstone?

[Cronos]

oh and btw, the ceremony of the Eucharist is what Jesus inaugurated.

[attiladhun2]

The eucharist saves no one, and itself is an example of RC idol worship. The Lord instituted communion as a memorial feast only, else God would violate His own commandment against consuming blood.

[Cronos]

Actually, Jesus disagrees with you

It is called:

Eucharist, because it is an action of thanksgiving to God. The Greek words eucharistein
Lk 22:19

19And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1 Cor 11:24

24And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

and eulogein
Mt 26:26

26And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.

Mk 14:22

22And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.

recall the Jewish blessings that proclaim - especially during a meal - God's works: creation, redemption, and sanctification.

1329 The Lord's Supper, because of its connection with the supper which the Lord took with his disciples on the eve of his Passion and because it anticipates the wedding feast of the Lamb in the heavenly Jerusalem
1 Cor 11:20

20When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

Rev 19:9

9And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

The Breaking of Bread because Jesus used this rite, part of a Jewish meat when as master of the table he blessed and distributed the bread,
Mt 14:19

19And he commanded the multitude to sit down on the grass, and took the five loaves, and the two fishes, and looking up to heaven, he blessed, and brake, and gave the loaves to his disciples, and the disciples to the multitude.

Mt 15:36

36And he took the seven loaves and the fishes, and gave thanks, and brake them, and gave to his disciples, and the disciples to the multitude.

Mk 8:6

6And he commanded the people to sit down on the ground: and he took the seven loaves, and gave thanks, and brake, and gave to his disciples to set before them; and they did set them before the people.

Mk 8:19

19When I brake the five loaves among five thousand, how many baskets full of fragments took ye up? They say unto him, Twelve.
20And when the seven among four thousand, how many baskets full of fragments took ye up? And they said, Seven.
21And he said unto them, How is it that ye do not understand?

above all at the Last Supper
Mt 26:26

26And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.

1 Cor 11:24

24And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

It is by this action that his disciples will recognize him after his Resurrection,
Lk 24:13-35

13And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs.

14And they talked together of all these things which had happened.

15And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.

16But their eyes were holden that they should not know him.

17And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad?

18And the one of them, whose name was Cleopas, answering said unto him, Art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which are come to pass there in these days?

19And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people:

20And how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death, and have crucified him.

21But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the third day since these things were done.

22Yea, and certain women also of our company made us astonished, which were early at the sepulchre;

23And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive.

24And certain of them which were with us went to the sepulchre, and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not.

25Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

26Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

27And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

28And they drew nigh unto the village, whither they went: and he made as though he would have gone further.

29But they constrained him, saying, Abide with us: for it is toward evening, and the day is far spent. And he went in to tarry with them.

30And it came to pass, as he sat at meat with them, he took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them.

31And their eyes were opened, and they knew him; and he vanished out of their sight.

32And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?

33And they rose up the same hour, and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven gathered together, and them that were with them,

34Saying, The Lord is risen indeed, and hath appeared to Simon.

35And they told what things were done in the way, and how he was known of them in breaking of bread.

and it is this expression that the first Christians will use to designate their Eucharistic assemblies;
Acts 2:42

42And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers

Acts2:46

46And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

Acts20:7

7And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

Acts 20:11

11When he therefore was come up again, and had broken bread, and eaten, and talked a long while, even till break of day, so he departed

by doing so they signified that all who eat the one broken bread, Christ, enter into communion with him and form but one body in him.
Heb 13:15

15By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name.

1 Pet 2:5

5Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Ps 116:13

13I will take the cup of salvation, and call upon the name of the LORD.

Ps 116:17

17I will offer to thee the sacrifice of thanksgiving, and will call upon the name of the LORD.

Mal 1:11

11For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts.

[Cronos]

What really nails it for me is this scripture!
Mal 1:11 “11For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts.”

The original sacrifice was at one place only in the old testament. Here The Lord is showing a future in the world when this was written. That there are many places for this to be offered in the future. It can only make sense in the context of the Mass.Which is today.

11”For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles;”

All over the world there are churches saying this offering.

“In EVERY place incense shall be offered unto my NAME”

Now the emphasis is every Place. When I see the priest with the Incense holder with that beautiful aroma going around the the altar. This is part of the prophecy even when it is not every day the emphasis is on every place not every day done with incense. Which use to puzzle me but not now after prayer and thought. The Re-presention of the eternal offering which is Jesus who is eternal because of his divinity. It just is amazing how many levels of thinking is going on here. God is outside of his creation( The universe) which is how time and space exists. It just is amazing!

Praise Jesus!

[ScholarWarrior]

Methinks you doth protest too much. Brevity is the soul of wit.