Posted on 07/19/2013 7:28:49 AM PDT by marshmallow
Israel’s deputy foreign minister has denied reports that his government is prepared to recognize the Vatican’s claim to ownership of the building that houses the site of the Last Supper. The same building in Jerusalem is revered by Jews as the site of King David’s tomb.
Deputy foreign minister Zeev Elkin, who has been actively involved with negotiations over a long-awaited pact with the Holy See, told lawmakers that there has been no discussion of ceding ownership of the building to the Catholic Church. He added that rumors of an exchange—with the Vatican relinquishing other properties in exchange for control of the building on Mount Zion—were inaccurate.
(Excerpt) Read more at catholicculture.org ...
bfl
I’ve been there!
I always thought it was Milan. At least it was when I saw it.
No matta! We walk by faith and not by site.
So the building where the last supper took place was built on the site of Kind David’s tomb? I’m not sure what I think of that. Would Jesus have known this?
Me too! (The tomb part.)
I’ve been there which proves there’s no need for the Vatican to control it unlike the Muslims which restrict access. Not only is Israel a great ally, it’s a great place to visit.
Why give control to the Vatican? They only represent a portion of Christian believers.
If this is the site of King David’s tomb and if that was known then, then it’s highly unlikely that the last supper took place there.
Israel should be like most other countries and nationalize all religious sites. Once they do so, they can be very generous at renting them to those other religions that wish to use them, conditional on their good behavior as tenants, but it would be abundantly clear that no foreign power, government or religion, “owns” any territory inside of Israel, outside for their embassies.
Doing so would give Israel a powerful tool to combat those foreign governments and religions who seek to use such places to disrupt or cause public disturbance.
In particular, the al-Asqa mosque, which is currently managed by the violent Wahhabi sect of Islam, is a source of much violence and hatred directed towards Jews and Israel. But once nationalized, Israel could tell the Wahhabis to “Tone it down or lose your lease; and we will turn the site over to the Sufi sect.”
This is a dire threat to the Wahhabis, and one that is used by the Saud family in Saudi Arabia, whenever its Wahhabis become ambitious and obnoxious. It works.
And the Sufis are more than willing to take the Wahhabis place, and would be “little angels” for the gift.
Two points:shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiachThe so called last supper was truly a Pesach Seder
Pesach is one of YHvH's required feast days.Second :
Matthew 15:24 But He answered and said,
"I was sent only to the lost sheep
of the house of Israel.
‘Twas an iconoclastic sufi mystic that chiseled the nose off the Sphinx. I guess it would be a step up from wahabism, but not a big one.
As a Messianic Jew, a careful reading and study of the 4 Gospel accounts reveals that in fact, the last supper was just that, supper. It was not a seder of any kind, but what Yeshua was doing was the kiddish, the blessing of the bread and wine that we do every Shabbat. In this account of the kiddish, Yeshua adds greater meaning to the bread and the wine.
See John 6:48-71
Yeshua was the Passover sacrifice, but He is also the bread (manna) and the wine (blood) of the Word. We must be careful not to confuse the two lest one finds themself being deceived when the false one appears!
May you have a blessed Shabbat! Shalom!
13 And He sent two of His disciples and said to them, "Go into the city, and a 14 and wherever he enters, say to the owner of the house, 15 "And he himself will show you a large upper room furnished and ready; prepare for us there." 16 The disciples went out and came to the city, and found it just as He had told them; and they prepared the Passover. 17 When it was evening He came with the twelve. 18 As they were reclining at the table and eating,.... Clearly Yah'shua eat the Pesach Seder. Shabbat Shalom ! I recommend for your understanding
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
Mark 14: 12-18 12 On the first day of Unleavened Bread, when the Passover lamb was being sacrificed,
Or Luke 22:8-14
His disciples said to Him, "Where do You want us to go and prepare for You
to eat the Passover?"
man will meet you carrying a pitcher of water; follow him;
'The Teacher says, "Where is My guest room in which I may eat the Passover with My disciples?"'
Mt 26:3 Then the chief priests, the scribes, and the elders of the people assembled at the palace of the high priest, who was called Caiaphas, 4 and plotted to take Jesus by trickery and kill Him. 5 But they said, “Not during the feast, lest there be an uproar among the people.”
Mt 26:26 And as they were eating, Jesus took bread(artos-leavened/raised bread), blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, “Take, eat; this is My body.”
John 13:26 Jesus answered, “It is he to whom I shall give a piece of bread when I have dipped it.” And having dipped the bread, He gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon. 27 Now after the piece of bread, Satan entered him. Then Jesus said to him, “What you do, do quickly.” 28 But no one at the table knew for what reason He said this to him. 29 For some thought, because Judas had the money box, that Jesus had said to him, “Buy those things we need for the feast,” or that he should give something to the poor.
Mark 14:1 After two days it was the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread (azumos-unleavened bread). And the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take Him by trickery and put Him to death. 2 But they said, “Not during the feast, lest there be an uproar of the people.”
John 18:28 Then they led Jesus from Caiaphas to the Praetorium, and it was early morning. But they themselves did not go into the Praetorium, lest they should be defiled, but that they might eat the Passover.
Clearly, the disciples would not have purchased raised bread for the Feast of Unleavened Bread and Yeshua certainly would not have raised up raised bread at the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Leaven represe4nting corruption, Yeshua would have never referred to His body as that which has been corrupted. Matthew, Mark and John's accounts all agree, the bread that was eaten was leavened bread and that the festival of Unleavened Bread had not yet taken place. Therefore, this was a Tues evening meal, not an after sunset Wednesday when the actual Passover sacrifice is to be eaten at the Feast of Unleavened Bread.
Very interesting Eisegesis.shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiachBefore looking for the hidden or gnostic meaning
begin with the plain meaning of the text (Peshat)consider : John 8:32; 6:34; 6:48 ; 6:58
Consider that the bread and wine
are the Tzafun and the third cup of wine.
The third cup is the Cup of Redemption.After the Seder, the apostles sing the Hallel
(praise of worship).
Matthew 26:30 After singing a hymn,If you torture the scripture enough it will yield
they went out to the Mount of Olives.
to any Eisegesis.One needs to get their Hermeneutics
correct before they attempt to exegete.
And that is the beauty of it all, you have your understanding according to the pashat level of but one witness that you have relied on and my understanding comes from the pashat level of passages from two or more witnesses. There was not torture of Scripture at all on my part. When the servants and the priests would not enter the palace because the meal of Unleavened bread that the Passover sacrifice is to be eaten had not yet taken place.
So for your understanding to be correct, that would mean that they ate a Passover sacrifice before the Passover lambs were sacrificed and before the appointed time required by Torah for them to eat of the sacrifice.
In doing this, Yeshua would have disobeyed Torah and we know He did not, He obeyed completely the Torah of the Father. He did not eat of the sacrifice that year as He was the sacrifice that year.
I see this as a misunderstanding due to the part of the Pharisees who to this day, call the meal of Unleavened Bread the Passover meal when it is not. Passover is that which is done on the part of the Father and the Son, Unleavened Bread is that which is done on our part as a remembrance to the One who gave us the ultimate sacrifice and the One who gave of Himself to be sacrificed.
It is time for my brethren of Judah to give up this mixing of Passover and Unleavened Bread and put them back into their proper context of Leviticus 23 as commanded by Elohim.
Shalom Alecheim!
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