4 Truths About Hell Is the doctrine of hell incompatible with the way of Jesus Christ?

The Aquila Report ^ | 4-6-13 | Tom Ascol

[American Constitutionalist]

" 2 . Tim 4:3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. "

Of course ?
We have teachers who look for disiples who have " itching ears " to build a cult of followers around themselves.

As in ? great teachers, sort of like how our todays cults are, to control people, to put fear into their hearts for no other gain, but, unto themsevles, and not for God or Christ.

Who are these so called teachers ?

Teachers of the law.

If you have ever study cults, the one thing they use the most is fear and intimidation.

I know, I was in a church like that.

If you didn't do this, you go to hell, or at least that is what was implied.

If you didn't tithe 10 % ? your cursed with a curse and GOD would cut you off and you will go to hell.

The problem with them is ?

Anyone who is saved or born again ?

They are NOT cursed, nor can they ever be cursed again.

God rebuked Balaam for trying to curse Israel and God told him ? why do you try to curse those in whom I have not cursed ?

The bible tells us that God loves a " cheerful giver " not someone who is complelled , forced to give their money.

If you didn't go to church every sunday ?

Your cut off from God and your going to hell...

No, they didn't say it in those exact words, but, the spirit that was implied had you feel that way.

The bible tells us that for God has not given us the spirit of fear, or intimidation, but of Power, and of Love and of a sound mind.

Why do these cults or cult leaders do this ?

To control the people.

The use the law to break over people's heads to keep them in control.
Do you think God's grace does that ?

No !

" 1 Cr 3:11. For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. "


Correct... no other foundation....
Nothing but the blood of Jesus Christ.

Church going every sunday can't save anyone, nor can it ever save anyone.

Nor can the Law, nor can the Law ever save anyone, or justify anyone before a holy God.

It ( the law of God ) was only put in place to be a school master ( read the book of Gal ) to bring man kind to his understanding of his hopeless state without christ.

There is only one name, and person in whom anyone can be saved and that is Jesus Christ alone and his blood atonement.
For by Grace are ye saved through faith, and not of yourselves... it's a free gift from God and God alone.

[count-your-change]

You’re restating the obvious, that wasn’t the question.

[American Constitutionalist]

Hebrews 10: 26 - 29 :

26. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27. But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29. Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?


To read it from backwards on up.

They have offended the spirit of grace.

Who have done despite unto the spirit of grace by counting it ( those who were sanctifed by it ) the blood of the covenant.
Who have trodden under foot the son of God.

So shall be be worthy !

Suppose ye !

Who have done this !

Worthy of sore punishment !

He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries !

( those who reject Jesus Christ, God's grace, and offend the spirit of grace ).

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

( The knowledge of the truth ? what is it ? that God sent his son to save us by his grace, but some rejected it, some scorned it, therefore they have offened the spirit of grace and are worthy of sore punishment and hell dammnation. )

This part of the book of Hebrews is a very fearful and stern warning to those who already reject Christ, and God's gracious gift to us, and those who go back into Judiasm, the law system to trust in them selves to save themselves for salvation .

[American Constitutionalist]

Rotting corpses, rotting flesh, where the worm’s eating the dead flesh never ends.

[Truth2012]

Yes and don’t do things that get us thrown on the trash heap. And if we are in the trash heap- raise up our hands and beg to be lifted up and out. But at some point, he will say he doesn’t know us- and it will be too late.

[caww]

....” only the saved have an immortal soul”....

There are three parts to humans...body, soul, and spirit.....we are made in His image....and He also is Triune. God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit.

...The concept of death as used in the Bible does not mean nonexistence... rather, it means “separation.” ....

Physical death occurs when the spirit exits the body......
James 2:26......... “For as the body without the spirit is dead.”.... In other words, the separation of one’s spirit from one’s body results in physical death.

Spiritual death, on the other hand, entails separation from God due to sin..... So “death” involves the idea of separation—not extinction or unconsciousness.

[fish hawk]

Wont get no Kudos from God but still , it is possible he is saved. Depends on what he did with Jesus sacrifice. This is hard for a lot of Christians to swallow but if Hitler prayed for Jesus to come into his life and accepted him as his Lord and Savior just before he pulled the trigger, he is saved. Like I said, it is not a question on or about sin, only , what did you do with the Father's salvation plan with His Son on the cross. I have this in writing from God. (its in the Bible and that is God breathed)

[CottShop]

Hi Plain Talk- I don’t mind sharing at all-

I beleive what I ghad was a very high fever induced due to peritinitis from perforated intestines- Docs didn’t realize the extent of the damage until they operated that night- but suffice it to say I was a very sick pup- the fever was what I beleive to be the cause of hallucinations- I don’t know for sure, but I donb’t beleive I actually died- I think I mgiht have been quite close as I experienced what many who claim NDE’s have said happened with htem- and what is common with foklks very near death (soem claim to have actually died and come back to tell the story)

What happened was I went into convulsions- I remember the hospital bed flipping end for end, the room spinning, and hten the next sensation I had was everythign goign blank briefly, then I felt myself tumbling downward and descendign into hell- I felt extreme excruciating suffocating heat (which could have been a sensation caused by the fever mind you) and then I epxerienced sand engulfign me and further suffocating me- I rmeember tryign to breathe in and fillign my lungs with sand- but I coudl still breathe somehow- but hte sensation fo suffocating was terrible- Insects covered my body and I remember that I couldn’t get rid of them because I was trapped by the sand and couldn’t move- I heard screams and wailing (Which ‘could have been’ the doc and nurses yellign to each other tryign to cool me down- and could have been muffled which I mistook for screamign and wailing- I can’t say for sure)-

I then heard what I took to be God’s voice saying My son- I will give you a test and if you pass, you will not be condemned to hell’ (Which is NOT biblical by any stretch of the uimagination) I remember beign excited abotu hte test because hte heat and suffocation was too much to bear, and then I heard the voice say soemthign alogn htel iens of “You will need to count these sounds”

I then heard a ‘clang’ then aniother- and I counted them- but hten they became faster and pretty soon they were too close togehter to count any longer- I remember weeping because I thought I was doomed to hell forever

Then hte voice said “Don’t worry- there is no hell, you don’t exist” which you would think woudl be a ‘good thing’ BUT it was NOT- at that point I sensed ‘compelte nothingness’ and hten an overwhelming sense of aloneness- I can’t really expalin the terror of this nothingness/aloneness except to say it was like I was just a ‘conscious energy’ that was compeltely alone in the vast universe floating aroudn forever alone- compeltely isolated from God and heaven - not feelign anythign except for loneliness and isolation and abandonment- It wasn;’t the physical terrors of hell, but it was a sense of loss of self and importance and abandonment thaqt really scared the dickens out of me-

Note thaqt I do NOT beleive in pergatory, or in being prayed out of hell once there- or that God will give peopel tests when they end up there- but this was just somethign I experienced as clear as day like aq ‘vivid nightmare’ or lucid dreaming or a dobule nightmare where you feel you are really awake and really experiencign hte the evil i nthen ightmare- I do bleive it was all just a result of the high fever causing the brain to misfire or soemthing- and when it did it brought up perhaps soem of my latent fears into a vivid ‘reality’ or what I took at the time to be a reality-

I’ve studied the phenomenom of NDE’s a bit, and I’m not convinced that peopel actually experience after death experiences, but perhaps more they experience misfirings of the synapses of hte brain that cause VERY lucid and ‘real-like’ hallucinations- The brain is a compelx thing, and I think misfirnings i nthe brain can cause such visions- I will not however stand firm on htis- as I just dfon’t know for sure what the actual truth is, but in my case, I think probably it was just the brain freakign out due to a near death experience coupled with a very high fever-

[CottShop]

[[26. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,]]

These verses had to do with apostates who had ‘tasted the life of Christianity’ but who had NOT yet received Christ as Savior- Psaul was warnign them that IF they turnerd their back after havign coem so far and yea- almost compeltely to salvation, that htey woudl not be given antoher chance thereafter- there woudl remain no more sacrifice for their sins-

Apostates are thsoe who delved into Christianity, but who neve3r got saved and hten later compeltely turned on Christ and God and the Hoyl Spirit-

Verse 25 clearly shows that it verses 26 and 27 are meant for apostates “They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.”

[American Constitutionalist]

The inspection will reveal that those who placed their trust, hope and faith in Jesus Christ will pass that inspection.

It's a metophor, is that how it's spelled ? that was for the spelling police.
It's a metophor, sort of speak, of course I know that God has a all seeing eye and knows all.
But the bible shows us that God speaks to us in pictures and types.
When he sees the blood ? the high priest says " you passed the inspection, go in. "

[ScubieNuc]

Actually, the Bible says that our three parts are “heart, soul and mind.” Matthew 22:37

The heart was known at the time of Jesus as the ‘throne’ of the physical body. The mind or as we call it, our brain was considered the ‘throne’ of the thoughts, and the soul was the ‘throne’ of the spirit.

As far as what death is...that should be pretty simple, the END of life. The first death, as mentioned in the Bible, refers to the END of our physical life. The Second death refers to the END of those people’s soul or spiritual life.

Why people wish to read things into Scripture that isn’t there, I can only guess, but I have looked at the all of the Scriptures in the New Testament about death and Hell (Hell, btw, is a very deep subject, which I may go into later) and I see no Scriptural support for an eternal punishING.

The eternal punishMENT is eternally separated from God and that is accomplished by the unsaved being destroyed in the Lake of Fire.

[American Constitutionalist]

God's thoughts are not our thoughts, and God's ways are not our ways.
God has a greater compacity to forgive and give grace than any one of us can give to another person.
Good thing God is God ? or else ? all of us would go to hell.
The abortionist ? well, what about the Apostle Paul in how he kill those christians before he got saved ?
God forgave him, didn't he ?

[American Constitutionalist]

I was always curious why that question of suicide comes up when people start to talk about those who are saved, or when people talk about hell, or forgiveness.

That subject seems to come up everytime, as if it was a big question for christians to answer and not for those who are unsaved.
There will be questions that will never have a good answer to until Christ comes back the 2nd time, so why even bother to seek a answer to them.

[fish hawk]

Not, “Well done thou good and faithful servant” But consider I Corinthians 3:15: If any mans work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. Of course Paul is talking about born again Christians here. I don’t know what that Dr’s state was.

[American Constitutionalist]

I thought King David rested with his fathers.

The only hell I know of that David went through was the hell and tradegy that happen after he sinned with Basheba.

[right way right]

Thanks for your response.
I would never say Paul is a false teacher.
You need not worry about me
Like Paul, I hate my sin and I’m not afraid to
talk about it.
I cannot testify in Christ that I am perfect but
that I am saved by His glory, and by His grace.

We are Gods works, His glory refined in this life
for His purpose.

[American Constitutionalist]

I agree with you in most part.

I heard all the arguments about these verse in Hebrews 10:26.
And I know God will as long as I live won't let me hear the end of it so I won't brag about heaing it all .. LOL.

There will be more arguments about this verse I know in the future.
I always thought that Apostates; i.e. were those who left the faith.
I do beleive in once saved, always saved.
But could it be ?
For those who think they are saved and then turn back into Judiasm, or back into the world, or renouce their faith in Jesus Christ ?
Anyway, yes, I even asked our pastor this question because I confessed to him I was backslidden before, and I heard all the arguments about that before to.

Those " LAW PREACHERS " and teachers would have people think that even if you backslide ? your going to hell if you don't repent.

The proper greek meaning to the word for repentance is: to have a change of mind.

And what John the baptist was preaching about " Repentance " was ? to turn from the former way of thinking, i.e. of keeping the law and turn the Jesus Christ.

You see ?

After 2000 years of Christianty ?
We have become so complacent, got to remember ?
Jesus's preaching was so radical in it's day.
So new was his teaching.

The old Jewish hebrew rabbis did not know the meaning of the symbol of their Hebrew letter 5 hei meant.
All they could say it was, was it was a open door or window, it was a mystery to them.

The 5th letter in Hebrew means, GRACE.

They had no concept of grace as we know it today, for Grace and Truth came by Jesus Christ.

Anyway, what the writer of the book of Hebrews were trying to warm those who have heard the message of the cross of Jesus that ?
Hey ? please ? don't turn back into Judiasm, or back to the law, it won't save you.
I wonder ?
Did the writer of the book of Hebrews was warned by the holy spirit of the inpending doom of Jerusalem ?
Was the book of Hebrews writter a few years before 70 AD ?
There was a Roman general who came up to the walls of Jerusalem, but, for some strange reason did not attack Jerusalem.
Was the book of Hebrews writter between this time the one Roman general retreated, and then the other Roman general eventually came and destoryed Jerusalem ?

All I know is those who are APOSTATES, are those who renounce their christian faith.

But, yes, my pastor told me the same think, this part of the book of Hebrews, that it was for those who fellowshiped with Christians, and tasted the life, and heard the message, but, not actually converted yet, or saved yet.

Another reason why they left was of persecution, and excommication from the Synagogues for even associating with the christians, or losing their businesses, wealth, fame, or standing in the community by being with the christians.

[caww]

Yes and yes and yes..to all you stated....

Our level of forgivenees, and even the idea of, is very minute. We see through our humanity, and that is tainted beyond measure......He sees through absolute perfection.

We can always and forever Trust whatever God determines on any matter....even , and especially, when we might not understand or agree.

[American Constitutionalist]

If any man’s work, any work that was not part of God’s will... i.e. doing your own thing apart from doing God’s will .. shall be burned up, but the saved person won’t recieve any lose, as in eternal punishment.

[caww]

Oh Okay...