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Should Richard III Receive a Catholic Burial?
First Things ^ | February 4, 2013 | Mark Movsesian

Posted on 02/06/2013 4:11:39 AM PST by NYer

richardIII

You thought there couldn’t be a law and religion angle to today’s news—fascinating for us history nerds—that archaeologists have discovered the mortal remains of Richard III beneath a parking lot in Leicester? Think again. Plans are underway to re-inter the bones in the city’s Anglican Cathedral. Not so fast, say some: the hunchback king wasn’t a Protestant, but a Catholic, and he requires a Catholic burial. In fact, as Shakespeare fans know, Richard died at Bosworth Field (“A horse! A horse! My kingdom for a horse!”), defending his throne from Henry Tudor. Henry went on to reign as Henry VII; his son, Henry VIII, broke with Rome. As The Tablet’s blog argued this morning, “Had Richard prevailed at the Battle of Bosworth Field, there would have been no Henry VII, therefore no Henry VIII and no Reformation. England today might still be a Catholic country.” Think of it: no Reformation, no Established Church, no Archbishop Laud, no Puritans, no Great Migration — no Massachusetts! — and no Establishment Clause. Surely there’s a law review article in there somewhere.

Leicester Cathedral seems to know it’s facing a sensitive situation. A Catholic priest is keeping watch over Richard’s remains (as is an Anglican, I believe), and the cathedral is planning a “multifaith” burial ceremony. Personally, I’m not sure why English Catholics are so keen to claim Richard, anyway. They must be forgetting the nephews in the Tower.


TOPICS: Catholic; Current Events; History; Mainline Protestant
KEYWORDS: anglican; coupdetat; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; henrytheusurper; henryvii; kingrichardiii; murderedbytraitors; plantanget; richardiii; shakespeare; uk; unitedkingdom
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To: cuban leaf

A gentle correction is in order.

A Christian funeral is done not only to say “goodbye” the the believer, bring confort to those who are left behind, and also to celibrate the life of that person.


21 posted on 02/06/2013 5:38:44 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Campion

You miss the whole point of the Gospel passage, which has nothing to do with funerals and everything to do with putting a priority on following Jesus.


I must not have expressed it clearly enough, because that is exactly what I was trying to say.

And check out Dick’s skeleton. You will notice the meat has rottted and been eaten by worms. Jesus’ body would have been rotting meat had he not been who he said he was. There will be a resurrection, of course, but if you check any grave anywhere on the planet where the burial is not fresh, you will find either rotting meat or no meat.

At the resurrection we will all be given a body. One will be given one long enough to go to everlasting destruction/death, the other to eternal life with the Lord. But earthly graves contain decomposing “tents”. All of them.

It is important to remember that you do not occupy the same body you did approximately seven years ago. Not one cell is left. Likewise with dead bodies. The Lord can reconstruct your body at the resurrection, if we even want to go there. It’s not the point.

As you say, the point is putting a priority on following Jesus. It is what I was attempting to say but must not have said it very well.


22 posted on 02/06/2013 5:40:03 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Biggirl

A Christian funeral is done not only to say “goodbye” the the believer, bring confort to those who are left behind, and also to celibrate the life of that person.


That is exactly how I see it. Funerals are not for the dead. They are for the living.


23 posted on 02/06/2013 5:41:42 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf

Plus even in death, a Christian’s body was were the Holy Spirit lived in.


24 posted on 02/06/2013 5:42:23 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Biggirl

A Christian funeral is done not only to say “goodbye” the the believer, bring confort to those who are left behind, and also to celibrate the life of that person.


That is exactly how I see it. Funerals are not for the dead. They are for the living.

And to put that in the context of Jesus’ comment, imagine Jesus was walking the earth right now and he walked up to you and said the exact same thing as in the scripture preceding the one I posted, and you said the same thing. How would you interpret the posted scripture?

Yeah, me too. I’d forget about the funeral and follow him. It’s a priority thing.

That is one of my favorite tools I use to interpret scripture. After all, it is supposed to speak to me personally, so when possible I personalize it.


25 posted on 02/06/2013 5:44:13 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: miss marmelstein; Campion; Anoreth

Drat. I’ll have to listen to the whole 12-hour set of “War of the Roses” lectures again, because I’ve forgotten, like, *everything,* and it’s only been a couple of months!


26 posted on 02/06/2013 5:47:46 AM PST by Tax-chick (Watch out for spiders.)
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To: cuban leaf

But as one previous poster has said, burying the dead IS a corporal work of mercy.


27 posted on 02/06/2013 5:48:58 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: cuban leaf

You said:
“ but if you check any grave anywhere on the planet where the burial is not fresh, you will find either rotting meat or no meat.”

Obviously you have not heard of the “Incorruptibles”.

Your loss.

Lurking’


28 posted on 02/06/2013 5:50:09 AM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: Biggirl

Plus even in death, a Christian’s body was were the Holy Spirit lived in.


The spirit has left the body in death. The body is just the tent that was occupied by the person. As someone said, “it is said you have a soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body.”

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120916145733AATEMDq


29 posted on 02/06/2013 5:56:02 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: LurkingSince'98

The “incorruptibles” is proof of the grace of God.


30 posted on 02/06/2013 5:56:35 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: cuban leaf
Jesus’ body would have been rotting meat had he not been who he said he was.

If a dead human body is just rotting meat, it doesn't matter who its "owner" was, or who he claimed to be, etc. Unless perhaps you think that Jesus' body was something other than human. Going down that path will quickly lead you to the heresy of Docetism (Jesus was truly divine, but his humanity was more-or-less an illusion).

Romans 8: the redemption (Paul says "redemption", not "replacement") of our bodies. What are you going to do with it?

Plenty of Catholic saints' bodies are incorrupt, BTW.

31 posted on 02/06/2013 5:56:42 AM PST by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: cuban leaf

That is why proper respect is given when it comes to Christian buriel for the very reason I have stated.


32 posted on 02/06/2013 5:58:47 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: LurkingSince'98

Obviously you have not heard of the “Incorruptibles”.


;-)


33 posted on 02/06/2013 5:59:16 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Campion

If a dead human body is just rotting meat, it doesn’t matter who its “owner” was, or who he claimed to be, etc.


True. Unless, of course, it was Jesus - or Laserus.

BTW, I believe all believers are “the saints”.


34 posted on 02/06/2013 6:01:02 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Campion

I do believe there is even a book on such a subject.


35 posted on 02/06/2013 6:01:35 AM PST by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: Campion

Plenty of Catholic saints’ bodies are incorrupt, BTW.


Naw. Some are just “less” corrupt. They would not look too good if they were re-animated.


36 posted on 02/06/2013 6:01:50 AM PST by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: cuban leaf

Bernadette Soubirous died 1879

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5OCmTpnCJA


37 posted on 02/06/2013 6:04:35 AM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: cuban leaf
The body is just the tent that was occupied by the person.

Wrong, horribly wrong. A human person is a body-soul duality, not a ghost temporarily inhabiting a sack of meat. This is exactly what I mean when I say your anthropology is not Christian.

As someone said, “it is said you have a soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body.”

"Someone" may have said that, but it's not in the Bible. Nor is it even correctly attributed to C.S. Lewis. I'd say "someone" got it wrong.

38 posted on 02/06/2013 6:05:01 AM PST by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
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To: Tax-chick

Horribly complicated war! But in the end it’s just two families slaughtering each other to get the crown (or really, the lands that come with it).


39 posted on 02/06/2013 6:10:59 AM PST by miss marmelstein ( Richard Lives Yet!)
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To: NYer

Richard III is my 33rd great grandfather. It’s only bones.


40 posted on 02/06/2013 6:11:42 AM PST by Coldwater Creek (He who dwells in the shelter of the Most High will rest in the shadows of the Almighty Psalm 91:)
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