Posted on 07/21/2008 6:52:50 PM PDT by PAR35
A leading Anglican bishop has condemned conservatives as "demonic" for using his church as a punch bag.
The Bishop of Washington, the Right Rev John Chane, a leading liberal in the Episcopal Church in the United States, accused conservatives of leading the church in a "dangerous" direction.
***
"I think it's really very, very dangerous and I think it's demonic ... the Episcopal Church has been demonised. It has been a punching bag and I'm sick of being a punching bag as a Bishop and I'm sick of my church, my province being a punching bag.
(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...
Ping
My Bible tells me to bless those who curse you, yes, Bless and do not Curse...
A pity, surely this is an educated man, learned in Latin, Greek, Aramiac, and yet all of that learning has not brought this Bishop into knowledge of Righteousness, such a level of knowledge is fundamental even to the hardest of drug addict who has turned to the Lord and found healing and pure Love.
As the Bible also states “Knowledge will increase, and Wisdom will decrease”...
The Bishop is an Apostate, and he is calling Christians demonic?
Chane is a POS. Before Bp. he was Dean of St. Paul’s Episcopal Cathedral here in San Diego and shortly before that he was on the East Coast.
When he was younger he played in a rock band, doesn’t that figure.
So life, liberty and the pusuit of happiness are NOT unalienable rights from God?
Oh. Ok.
Strange isn’t it? Demons do not exist in Humanism...
Hey! I played in a rock band when I was younger. I’m not demonic... at least I don’t think I am.
The Episcopal Church needs to beat its bishops.
Accusing those you disagree with of being demonic (or Hilter) means you are out of ammunition and have thrown your gun too! The bishop is basically conceding the argument to the (theologically) conservative members of the church.
Humanist the good Bishop may be, a Christian he certainly is not.
I wonder if I’ll ever understand why these people are deliberately destroying the Episcopal Church.
For many of them it’s the usual reasons: pride, power, money, etc.
I can agree, but the Office of Bishop should be respected a bit, just a bit, even if the man is some wishy washy ninnyhammer of a Bishop.
For myself centurion, I’ll send a prayer up for him, that the Lord may open his eyes and reveal the Truth.
For some, the simple answer is that it's the money. There are billions of dollars in trust funds and real estate. Get rid of the members, and the money becomes available to fund leftist causes.
In other cases, it can merely be attributed to spiritual warfare.
ok, you are excused.
There is no doubt you are absolutely correct that the man needs prayer for conversion to the Truth.
He is the sort that makes all Christians look bad.
And I confess that although I am Catholic and not a part of Anglicanism, I still think he deserves a good bap on the head with my handbag.
How can we honor the office of Bishop, when the Apostolic Succession is visited upon a man who stands in public opposition to the doctrine and tenats of the Church? Why do we have a Canon, a doctrine, an a succession if not to preserve the substance and essence of our Faith. If faith is to be a reflection of the popularity of the moment, then we need no Religion, we need no faith. A few well organized cocktail parties will suffice.
I understand the old military saying, 'You salute the uniform, not the man", but I'm not sure that the same holds true at Church. The only perfect one who deserves our salutes is God.
I can respect the elders of the church with whom I disagree when we are sinful men who are both seeking the truth of scripture. When, however, a leader of the church is advancing an agenda contrary to the plain teachings of the Bible, I'll show him no respect, no matter his title, vestments, or hat.
For myself centurion, I’ll send a prayer up for him, that the Lord may open his eyes and reveal the Truth.
A good act, and one for which I applaud you. May we all do so for those who are misleading the Church.
Liberalism is destroying once great Protestant Churches in Europe and America. Bad news for Western Civilization.
But without punching bags, there would be no fighters. Without fighters, there would be no reason to have Bishops. Oh, the irony!
The road to hell is paved with the skulls of bishops
St. John Chrysostom
“How can we honor the office of Bishop, when the Apostolic Succession is visited upon a man who stands in public opposition to the doctrine and tenats of the Church? Why do we have a Canon, a doctrine, an a succession if not to preserve the substance and essence of our Faith. If faith is to be a reflection of the popularity of the moment, then we need no Religion, we need no faith. A few well organized cocktail parties will suffice”
What does it profit thee to love only those who love you? Even the Pharisees do that...
When we are smacked, we offer the other cheek, when we are cursed, we bless, especially among Brothers.
Not for the protection of his Office of Bishop, far be it from me to encourage a Heresy, rather because among the Faithful, such unity is taught by Christ Himself, how can this Bishop curse those who Love him, but will not put up with his false Doctrine?
If Chane persists in his cursing in the face of our care for him, that should tell any fair minded person that he is not one of the Faithful to Christ.
Our weapons are not harsh words Centurion, our weapons are the Same as Christ had, in the face of such a unified front, he can dwell in his hatred and marginalize himself, or he can repent and find the Truth.
It may backfire though. These apostates are becoming more and more isolated. They will probably split their worldwide church and even drive a number of Conservatives, as individuals or even entire parishes to seek Communion with Rome.
I went last Sunday to a former Episcopal church that converted and is allowed to practice the Anglican Usage of the Roman Rite--a beautiful service, very devout parishoners, and a wonderful priest who gave a profound homily about the weeds planted in the wheat.
He said that God is powerful enough to be patient with evil-doers, to give them every chance to respond to his love, and who are we to judge more harshly than God who should be saved and who to condemn.
“Bishop Chane, I am in receipt of a note from...um...an old mutual acquaintance, who asked me to deliver it to you.
‘My dear John,‘You poor thing, you have no idea for whom you’ve been working all these years, do you?
‘Your affectionate colleague,
S.’”
At the end of the day though, Chane very well may have strengthened your Faith in Christ and His Church and Doctrine.
All things work together for the good of those that believe PAR35, Chane and the rest of the unFaithful may be simple tools to sharpen the Faith of them that Believe on the Lord and his Son, Jesus the Christ.
For example, would we be having this conversation without the Heretical actions of Chane?
They are not real bishops, they are the false teachers and antichrists spoken of by the Apostles Paul, Peter and John.
“But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up.” II Peter 2:1-3
Then again, Christ told Pilot “you would not have your job unless my Father okayed it...”
A paraphrase of course, more going to the heart of the matter, they may be in Office, however, no where is it written that they must be endured, the Lord always makes a way of escape.
All the more should they be prayed for, those who know the Lord’s will but do not do it shall be beaten heavily, those who do not will receive a light punishment...
There is a predictable outcome to this kaehurowing...
Sounds like a case for the exorcist.....
Self-defense is shameful. Resisting evil is SHAMEFUL!
It's all shameful, right up until THEY are attacked. Then, of course not for themselves but because the whole thing is just SEW un-FAYur, they will start attacking others and defending themselves.
It is entirely "inappropriate" for conservatives to suggest that there is anything whatsoever wrong with liberal Episcopalians .... whose sad duty it is to point out that conservatives are afflicted with demons.
“A pity, surely this is an educated man, learned in Latin, Greek, Aramiac”
Not necessarily true for Episcopalian clergy. While Mr. Chane may indeed have taken such courses, they generally all are not required in ECUSA seminary. Some may still require an overview of ancient Greek, however Hebrew is optional and Aramaic is non-existent. You would be shocked at how Biblically illiterate so many senior ECUSA clerics are.
As in, it has become infested with demons?
" It has been a punching bag and I'm sick of being a punching bag as a Bishop and I'm sick of my church, my province being a punching bag."
You might try adhering to the Bible, then.
You're just sick.
yup, like another old heresy from Christianity, he may start to call us infidels soon...
I think the plan now is to get rid of most members so that the remainder can keep the money from all the property owned by the Ang and ECUSA
Yes, this is true, I read an article once that demonstrated one can graduate from an Episcopal seminary without having taken a single Bible course. Most of the coursework is in things like the feminist view of Christianity, gay rights and the like.
Unfortunately, the cancer continues to spread. I left the Episcopal Church over its unfaithfulness and joined a Bible-believing PCUSA church. Now they are under assault as a result of actions at the recent General Assembly essentially saying a minister, elder or deacon could commit adultery, fornication or engage in homosexual acts and still be in good standing.
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Speak the truth in love. Eph 4:15
So tempting... but read #24. *\;-)
"Go on, my dear boy, go on. That is so like you. No doubt you'll tell me why, on your view, I was sent there. I'm not angry."
"But don't you know? You went there because you are an apostate."
"Are you serious, Dick?"
"Perfectly."
"This is worse than I expected. Do you really think people are penalised for their honest opinions? Even assuming, for the sake of argument, that those opinions were mistaken."
"Do you really think there are no sins of intellect?"
"There are indeed, Dick. There is hidebound prejudice, and intellectual dishonesty, and timidity, and stagnation. But honest opinions fearlessly followed-they are not sins."
"I know we used to talk that way. I did it too until the end of my life when I became what you call narrow. It all turns on what are honest opinions."
"Mine certainly were. They were not only honest but heroic. I asserted them fearlessly. When the doctrine of the Resurrection ceased to commend itself to the critical faculties which God had given me, I openly rejected it. I preached my famous sermon. I defied the whole chapter. I took every risk."
"What risk? What was at all likely to come of it except what actually came-popularity, sales for your books, invitations, and finally a bishopric?"
"Dick, this is unworthy of you. What are you suggesting?"
"Friend, I am not suggesting at all. You see, I know now. Let us be frank. Our opinions were not honestly come by. We simply found ourselves in contact with a certain current of ideas and plunged into it because it seemed modern and successful. At College, you know, we just started automatically writing the kind of essays that got good marks and saying the kind of things that won applause. When, in our whole lives, did we honestly face, in solitude, the one question on which all turned: whether after all the Supernatural might not in fact occur? When did we put up one moment's real resistance to the loss of our faith?"
"If this is meant to be a sketch of the genesis of liberal theology in general, I reply that it is a mere libel. Do you suggest that men like ..."
"I have nothing to do with any generality. Nor with any man but me and you. Oh, as you love your own soul, remember. You know that you and I were playing with loaded dice. We didn't want the other to be true. We were afraid of crude salvationism, afraid of a breach with the spirit of the age, afraid of ridicule, afraid (above all) of real spiritual fears and hopes."
- C.S. Lewis, The Great Divorce
I used to challenge him about the new translation we were using in church, and he couldn't say a word because he didn't read any Greek at all. He had no Latin, either. I have no idea about his Hebrew, 'cause I barely know my aleph-beis, but I seriously doubt he had any.
I think it is the mind cemetaries of the seminaries that are spreading this heresy kaehurwong, the leftists are clever, seize the Mind Cemetaries and let the newly minted Heretics split congregations from the top down.
Problem with that is, Churches are bottom up entities not Wall Street companies..the Faithful can vote with their feet..
It may be time for me to post my disclaimer again.
While very active on the Anglican threads, I’m reformed in theology and presbyterian in polity. I actually got involved in the discussions out of an interest in some very interesting legal issues concerning property, but since then have developed a broader interest in the issues.
The cancer spreads because we are not fighting it — I know it’s very easy for me to stand on the sidelines and tell you what to do, but I think all of us need to fight this as tomorrow the same groups will try to attck the Ctholics or the Orthdox
According to such as these, if you do not accept their false doctrines you do not love them.
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