God’s Ten Plagues Revisited

Cross Action News ^ | 6-20-08 | Carl Sterling Parnell, Ed.D.

[Victory111]

Whether the problems in America are plagues or not, God is still in control. The revisiting of the ten plagues of ancient Biblical times makes it easier to understand the reasons why America is in the mess that it is in today. All the possible plagues that have been mentioned could become even worse as days, months and years pass. But, one thing is for sure, if America does not repent as a nation, God will send some form of punishment. God will not be continually mocked by sinful Americans who rebel against Him.

[count-your-change]

“God will not be continually mocked by sinful Americans who rebel against Him.”
How about sinful Europeans, Africans, Asians? How to account for the high prices they pay for oil and their natural disasters?
What a mishmash of half-baked religiosity.

[Tennessee Nana]

The author mentions the deaths of “new born” babies several times...

That would be “unborn” or pre-born” babies I guess...

Some good points though...

[Alex Murphy]

But, one thing is for sure, if America does not repent as a nation, God will send some form of punishment. God will not be continually mocked by sinful Americans who rebel against Him.

"...Our culture and our country deserve to be under the wrath of God..."
....Francis A. Schaeffer, 1983

[Augustinian monk]

How do we “repent as a nation?” Such talk shifts attention away from individual accountability.

[beckysueb]

As a nation, America didn’t used to be so sinful. He punished the nation of Israel several times for turning away from Him. When He brought the flood in Noahs’ time, the bible says every thought in mans heart was wicked. Same with Sodom and Gomorrah. America seems to accept more and more evil without fighting against it. Maybe He means His people sit by and do nothing to fight evil.

[Zionist Conspirator]

G-d is still in control and He is still just. However much suffering we are now enduring, it is doubtless that justice is being served.

Divine Providence is all-embracing.

[MEGoody]

This citizens of this nation are punishing themselves with the consequences of their reprehensible behavior (and the tolerance of it). If we don’t change, and soon, we will destroy ourselves.

[beckysueb]

Some of those countries are pagan countries who don’t believe in the One true God. They are left to their own devices. God has blessed America. Look at how those countries live. They are not near as great as America. God chastises His children when they stray like a father chastises his children. He does it cause He loves us. He would like to be a part of the lives of everyone in the world but most countries believe in idols. But for the most part, America and Israel and Europe are the only nations left who believe in the God of Abraham.

[beckysueb]

bookmark

[onedoug]

"If I knew God I'd be Him."

Though I'd be loathe to risk Him from goodness.

[count-your-change]

“Some of those countries are pagan countries who don’t believe in the One true God. They are left to their own devices.”
Left to their own devices by whom? Jesus said the good news of the kingdom was to be preached in all the inhabited earth (world). He didn’t leave them to their own devices or write them off. But it seems you’re able see yourself as one of “God’s children” because you were born in a certain country.

[ViLaLuz]

2 Chronicles 7:14

“However, if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves, pray, search for me, and turn from their evil ways, then I will hear [their prayer] from heaven, forgive their sins, and heal their country.”

[ViLaLuz]

“How do we “repent as a nation?” Such talk shifts attention away from individual accountability.”

2 Chronicles 7:14 - “However, if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves, pray, search for me, and turn from their evil ways, then I will hear [their prayer] from heaven, forgive their sins, and heal their country.”

We each do this, and the rest falls into place.

[nobama08]

Do you want America to become like Europe, Africa or Asia?

[nobama08]

Do you believe God has blessed America?

[count-your-change]

“Do you believe God has blessed America?”
That part that DOES His will: Yes.
That part that DOESN’T do His will: No.

[count-your-change]

“Do you want America to become like Europe, Africa or Asia?”
Those are kind of biggish places, can you narrow it down to “like” in some sense or definition?

[Quester]

As a nation, America didn’t used to be so sinful.

You mean back 150 years ago when slavery was practiced ... or up to 50 years ago when blacks were relegated to second-class status ?

[Quester]

Do you believe God has blessed America?

God has blessed ... and continues to bless America.

Americans, per capita, still enjoy the highest standard of living in the world. Despite the 'sufferings' we whine about now, there are few others in the world who enjoy the same access to housing, food, other necessities, travel, affluence ... that Americans do.

I was reading in my local paper today about three American families trying to cope in today's economic climate.

One of these was a single parent household where the yearly income was some $25,000.00. Now she seemed to, truly, be struggling.

Though, truthfully, most people in the world would have their lives tremendously improved to have such an income at their disposal.

The other two families brought home between $50,000.00 and $100,000.00 apiece. They were saying that it was hard too. But their comments were more like ... "We used to be able to just jump in the car and drive to Chicago. Now we have to fit it into the budget."

Most Americans have not really experienced (economic) suffering yet.

[Quester]

“Do you believe God has blessed America?”

That part that DOES His will: Yes.
That part that DOESN’T do His will: No.

Yours is too black and white an answer. God blesses everyone ... to some extent. And the good suffer with the evil ... to some extent.

Matthew 5:45b ... for He maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

[count-your-change]

“Yours is too black and white an answer. God blesses everyone ... to some extent. And the good suffer with the evil ... to some extent.”
It was a rather broad question and I took it to mean, To whom does God direct His blessing. You will note that what Jesus spoke of were general blessings that fell indiscriminately upon all with any action required on the part of the recipient just as natural disasters (time and unforeseen occurrences) cause suffering to even the most upright of persons.
I was thinking of the specific and you noted the general.

[Iscool]

Zec 2:8 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.
Zec 2:9 For, behold, I will shake mine hand upon them, and they shall be a spoil to their servants: and ye shall know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me.

God WILL judge the nations, whether you believe it or not...

Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

The context here of course in Jesus coming in His Glory but regardless, one would have to be a fool to think we Americans have prospered to the extent we have as a nation compared to the rest of the world unless the hand of God was upon us...

And one would have to be just as foolish to think God wouldn't take it away if we as a nation turned against Him or His chosen people, Israel...

[beckysueb]

God will save anyone who calls on Him. But He loves Israel. Any country that is a Christain nation and turns pagan is just asking for the wrath of God.

[count-your-change]

Which “Israel” are you talking about?

[beckysueb]

There is only one Israel.

[count-your-change]

Let’s see, there was Jacob, a.k.a. Israel. There was the nation of Israel from Moses to 70 a.d. Then there is the spiritual Israel, and finally the country of Israel today.
That makes four by my count.

[beckysueb]

I was referring to the nation of Israel. I believe it is the same Israel today as the biblical one up to 70AD.

[count-your-change]

One very large difference I see between the two is that one was a theocracy and the other a secular democracy.
And the first had a temple with a priesthood and attendant practices and the modern has the synagogue as the place of worship while the pagan Dome of the Rock rests where the temple once stood.
Most importantly it is the spiritual Israel that is God's people not the secular democracy called Israel of today.

[Iscool]

Let’s see, there was Jacob, a.k.a. Israel. There was the nation of Israel from Moses to 70 a.d. Then there is the spiritual Israel, and finally the country of Israel today. That makes four by my count.

You're using too many fingers...There is no 'spiritual' Israel...

[Iscool]

Most importantly it is the spiritual Israel that is God's people not the secular democracy called Israel of today.

God did not invite you to become a Jew...God invited you AND Jews to become Christians...

The Jews, who have been summoned by God to get back to that piece of real estate in the Middle East that He gave them always have been and always will be His chosen...

[count-your-change]

At Matt.10:5 Jesus, after choosing the twelve sent them out but only to the “lost sheep of the house of Israel”.
The nation of Israel enjoyed the first opportunity to become a part of the spiritual nation of Israel. Jesus said by way of illustration and in plain words that the special opportunity for becoming part of his heavenly kingdom would be taken away from the nation. In Matt. 21:43, “That is why I say to you, The kingdom of God will be taken from you and be given to a nation producing its fruits”. He had just quoted Ps.118:22 which showed that the nation of Israel had rejected the stone (Jesus) which was was now to be the chief cornerstone.
Note Jesus’ words that the kingdom was to be given to a nation producing its fruits as the nation of Israel was not. Which leads us to the comments the apostle Paul made to the Jews at Acts 13:46, “It was necessary for the word of God to be spoken first to you. Since you are thrusting it away from you and you do not judge yourselves worthy of everlasting life, look! we turn to the nations.”
At Pentecost the opportunity for all to become part of that nation producing the fruits of the kingdom, spiritual Israel, was opened up and now one's nationality or former religious status or place of birth was of no account in God's view, hence the words of John at Luke 3:8 that having Abraham as a forefather wasn't what counted as ‘God could raise up children to Abraham from the stones’.
Who are Abraham's seed, those that God promised Abraham, ‘by your seed all the nations of the earth will bless themselves? Gal.3:29 says that if ‘one belongs to Christ that one is Abraham's seed, an heir of a promise.’
Hence from the Scriptures it is clear that it is spiritual Israel, made up of people from all the nations, that constitutes God's people, God's nation and not the entity that calls its self Israel in the Middle East today.

[beckysueb]

Thats mostly true but I think the nation of Irael plays a big part in it, too. It is the land that God gave to the Hebrews.

[count-your-change]

“Thats mostly true but I think the nation of Israel plays a big part in it, too. It is the land that God gave to the Hebrews.”
And as He demonstrated 7th. century b.c. He would take it away from them too for unfaithfulness to the covenant they had freely entered into with God. In Exodus 19:5,6 God tells the nation that they will become a kingdom of priests and a holy nation under His covenant and all the people agree forming a contract between two parties, God and the nation.
But that nation finally rejected the terms of the covenant when they rejected the God anointed King of that “kingdom of priests and a holy nation”. Hence Jesus’ words when at the temple quoted at Matt. 23:37,38. He calls Jerusalem, the center of Jewish religion and civil authority, a “killer of prophets and stoner of those sent forth to her”, and adds how the nation did not want to be gathered under his care. So Jesus now says, “Look! Your house is abandoned to you”. The meaning of those words became all too clear in 70 a.d.
Peter identified those who would be the kingdom of priests and a holy nation at 1 Peter 2:9,10 when he said to the Christian believers, “But you are a “chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for special possession....” and then, “For you were once not a people, but are now God's people...”.
That nation's land and capital city was not to be in the Middle East as the apostle Paul wrote at Gal. 4:25,26 that the city existing in his day was foreshadowed by Hagar the slave girl, that city was in slavery but the capital for heaven bound Christians under the new covenant was “Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother” alluding to the children of Hagar and Sarah.
Jesus said he came to fulfill the Law not destroy it so as the contract or covenant was fulfilled it was no longer in effect. Christ preached “the kingdom of the heavens” not a restoration of the nation of Israel under the Law with its geographical boundary's. That was a mistake some of his disciples made and inquired about.
So I see nothing in Scripture that indicates the modern day nation of Israel plays any unique role in Bible prophecy.

[Iscool]

So I see nothing in Scripture that indicates the modern day nation of Israel plays any unique role in Bible prophecy.

That doesn't mean it isn't there...YOU just aren't seeing it...

Eze 36:24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
Eze 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you a heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Eze 36:28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Heb 8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
Zec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
Zec 12:11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.

Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Isa 49:12 Behold, these shall come from far: and, lo, these from the north and from the west; and these from the land of Sinim.
Isa 49:13 Sing, O heavens; and be joyful, O earth; and break forth into singing, O mountains: for the LORD hath comforted his people, and will have mercy upon his afflicted.
Isa 49:14 But Zion said, The LORD hath forsaken me, and my Lord hath forgotten me.
Isa 49:15 Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.
Isa 49:16 Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.
Isa 49:17 Thy children shall make haste; thy destroyers and they that made thee waste shall go forth of thee.
Isa 49:18 Lift up thine eyes round about, and behold: all these gather themselves together, and come to thee. As I live, saith the LORD, thou shalt surely clothe thee with them all, as with an ornament, and bind them on thee, as a bride doeth.
Isa 49:19 For thy waste and thy desolate places, and the land of thy destruction, shall even now be too narrow by reason of the inhabitants, and they that swallowed thee up shall be far away.
Isa 49:20 The children which thou shalt have, after thou hast lost the other, shall say again in thine ears, The place is too strait for me: give place to me that I may dwell.
Isa 49:21 Then shalt thou say in thine heart, Who hath begotten me these, seeing I have lost my children, and am desolate, a captive, and removing to and fro? and who hath brought up these? Behold, I was left alone; these, where had they been?
Isa 49:22 Thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I will lift up mine hand to the Gentiles, and set up my standard to the people: and they shall bring thy sons in their arms, and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders.
Isa 49:23 And kings shall be thy nursing fathers, and their queens thy nursing mothers: they shall bow down to thee with their face toward the earth, and lick up the dust of thy feet; and thou shalt know that I am the LORD: for they shall not be ashamed that wait for me.

Isa 60:1 Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee.
Isa 60:2 For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee.
Isa 60:3 And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.
Isa 60:4 Lift up thine eyes round about, and see: all they gather themselves together, they come to thee: thy sons shall come from far, and thy daughters shall be nursed at thy side.
Isa 60:5 Then thou shalt see, and flow together, and thine heart shall fear, and be enlarged; because the abundance of the sea shall be converted unto thee, the forces of the Gentiles shall come unto thee.
Isa 60:6 The multitude of camels shall cover thee, the dromedaries of Midian and Ephah; all they from Sheba shall come: they shall bring gold and incense; and they shall show forth the praises of the LORD.
Isa 60:7 All the flocks of Kedar shall be gathered together unto thee, the rams of Nebaioth shall minister unto thee: they shall come up with acceptance on mine altar, and I will glorify the house of my glory.
Isa 60:8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows?
Isa 60:9 Surely the isles shall wait for me, and the ships of Tarshish first, to bring thy sons from far, their silver and their gold with them, unto the name of the LORD thy God, and to the Holy One of Israel, because he hath glorified thee.
Isa 60:10 And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in my wrath I smote thee, but in my favor have I had mercy on thee.
Isa 60:11 Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought.
Isa 60:12 For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.
Isa 60:13 The glory of Lebanon shall come unto thee, the fir tree, the pine tree, and the box together, to beautify the place of my sanctuary; and I will make the place of my feet glorious.
Isa 60:14 The sons also of them that afflicted thee shall come bending unto thee; and all they that despised thee shall bow themselves down at the soles of thy feet; and they shall call thee, The city of the LORD, The Zion of the Holy One of Israel.
Isa 60:15 Whereas thou hast been forsaken and hated, so that no man went through thee, I will make thee an eternal excellency, a joy of many generations.
Isa 60:16 Thou shalt also suck the milk of the Gentiles, and shalt suck the breast of kings: and thou shalt know that I the LORD am thy Savior and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob.
Isa 60:17 For brass I will bring gold, and for iron I will bring silver, and for wood brass, and for stones iron: I will also make thy officers peace, and thine exactors righteousness.
Isa 60:18 Violence shall no more be heard in thy land, wasting nor destruction within thy borders; but thou shalt call thy walls Salvation, and thy gates Praise.
Isa 60:19 The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the LORD shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God thy glory.
Isa 60:20 Thy sun shall no more go down; neither shall thy moon withdraw itself: for the LORD shall be thine everlasting light, and the days of thy mourning shall be ended.

This is but a small sampling of the scripture referenced to the restoration of Israel...

God is not only going to regather Israel as a Nation in their homeland, but He is going to convert them to the crucified Saviour as their real Messiah, and when He appears the second time He will be accepted of them...

The capstone of the Jewish Restoration prophesied throughout the Old Testament is put on by the Apostle Paul in Romans 11:25-29...Here Pauls says three things that no New Testament Christian could miss unless he deliberately and willfully submitted to deception...

1. Someday God is going to 'dump' the Gentiles...(Romans 11:25, Jer. 30:11; 46:28, Isa. 40:17, Jer. 50:4-7)
2. Someday God is going to 'save' Israel as a Nation...(Rom. 11:26, Dan. 12:1-4, Jer. 30:7)
3. The greatest danger for Gentile Nations is becoming 'wise in their own conceits'...(Rom. 11:25, Psa. 2, Jer. 50:4-7, Isa. 40:12-22; 45:11-24)

Half the OT is filled with the prophecy of the restoration of Israel...You couldn't miss it with a laser guided missile...

[count-your-change]

And the nation was restored in 539 b.c. so you are about 2500 years late.
How does any this relate to modern day Israel? Dumping Gentiles? For what reason?
In the eleventh chapter of Romans Paul tells those Roman Christians not to be exulting over the fact that natural branches of the olive tree (Israel) were broken off because of a lack of faith allowing branches of the wild olive (Gentiles like the Romans) to be grafted in. The Romans did not thereby become fleshly Jews but spiritual Jews even as Paul said Romans 2:28,29 that being a Jew in God's sight was the inward person not according to the flesh. Also at Gal. 3:28,29 Paul said that being Jew or Greek (non Jews) made no difference, that Abraham's seed were those that belonged to Christ. Therefore being a citizen of modern day Israel is of no special account in God's eyes.
As Paul went on to say in Romans 11:23 it was a lack of faith that caused the branches of the natural olive tree to be lopped off and they remain so in that lack of faith.
They might be grafted back in if they showed faith but there is no indication there that God is going to “convert” the Jews of today's Israel.
Confusing the prophecies relating to the nation of Israel coming back to restoration from Babylon, and prophecies that the apostles applied to the nation of spiritual Jews Paul spoke of, causes many to look to the modern day nation of Israel without Scriptural support. You may see them that way for whatever reason but that is not how the Scriptures themselves explain it. I realize that there are a number of popular books being sold that echo the idea that modern day Israel is the focal point of Bible prophecy and will be the seat of some sort of God's kingdom on earth or such but the message of the Bible as a whole and in in part refutes such an interpretation.

[Iscool]

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Zec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

And the nation was restored in 539 b.c.

That may well be but it was destroyed again in 70 A.D. And it was restored again, in 1948...

And clearly, these few verses and hundreds more like them could not possibly have happened in 539 BC...So they haven't happened yet, or God's a liar...

Paul said that being Jew or Greek (non Jews) made no difference, that Abraham's seed were those that belonged to Christ. Therefore being a citizen of modern day Israel is of no special account in God's eyes.

That's your conclusion, not God's...Again read Rom. 11:25-28...

As Paul went on to say in Romans 11:23 it was a lack of faith that caused the branches of the natural olive tree to be lopped off and they remain so in that lack of faith. They might be grafted back in if they showed faith but there is no indication there that God is going to “convert” the Jews of today's Israel

Again, read Rom. 11:25-28...

[count-your-change]

Had you turned back in the letter to the Romans you would have a better understanding of Paul's later words at chapter 11:25-27.
At Romans 9:6, Paul explains, “However it is not as though the word of God had failed. For not all who ((spring) from Israel are really “Israel”. Neither because they are Abraham's seed are they all children, but: “What will be called”your seed” will be through Isaac.” That is, the children in the flesh are not really the children of God, but the children by the promise are counted as the seed.”
In chapter 9:27 Paul quotes Isaiah “concerning Israel”, “Although the number of sons of Israel may be as the sand of the sea, it is a remnant that will be saved.”
A “remnant” was saved by becoming Christians and as Paul later wrote and as I quoted, people of the nations were “grafted” to bring to “fullness” (11:25) the spiritual Israel, (11:26), “and so all Israel shall be saved....”
“All Israel” as Paul had just written in 11:17-24, now consisted of the previously mentioned, “remnant” of Israel(the natural olive tree) that put faith in Christ, and the Gentile Christians (the wild olive) grafted in.
So I did read Romans 11:25-27 and Paul's previous words make clear it's meaning as to who “all Israel “ is.
You wrote, “Paul said that being Jew or Greek (non Jews) made no difference, that Abraham's seed were those that belonged to Christ. Therefore being a citizen of modern day Israel is of no special account in God's eyes.

That's your conclusion, not God's...Again read Rom. 11:25-28...”, as a quote of what I said earlier but because you left off part of my words you misunderstood what I said. Here is what I said in FULL, “Also at Gal.3:28,29 Paul said that being Jew or Greek (non Jews) made no difference, that Abraham's seed were those that belonged to Christ. Therefore being a citizen of modern day Israel is of no special account in God's eyes.”
You will notice that I referred to Gal.3:28,29 to show it was NOT my conclusion at all. Since leaving this reference out really changes the meaning of what I said from Paul's statement into a conclusion of my own I feel you should at apologize for this error, if that is what it was, since otherwise I can only conclude it was a deliberate misquoting of my words and so end any further discussion. Which one was it?
As for God's hand in the formation of the modern Israeli state, if you wish to believe that, so be it, but attempting to apply prophecy that relates to ancient Israel and the “Israel of God” as Paul called it, is unjustified by any reading of Scripture as has clearly been shown here.

[Iscool]

Also at Gal.3:28,29 Paul said that being Jew or Greek (non Jews) made no difference, that Abraham's seed were those that belonged to Christ. Therefore being a citizen of modern day Israel is of no special account in God's eyes.” You will notice that I referred to Gal.3:28,29 to show it was NOT my conclusion at all.

Sorry Charlie, it's still your conclusion, not God's...

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

There is neither Jew nor Greek IN JESUS CHRIST...But there certainly is 'Jew' outside of Christ...

You did not become a Jew, or Israeli when you became a Christian...You became a Christian...Just as a Greek becomes a Christian or a Jew becomes a Christian...Just exactly as Paul says...In Christ Jesus...

A “remnant” was saved by becoming Christians and as Paul later wrote and as I quoted, people of the nations were “grafted” to bring to “fullness” (11:25) the spiritual Israel, (11:26), “and so all Israel shall be saved....”

What spiritual??? There's no spiritual to it...We Christians have been adopted into the family...It's physical...And why would we want to become Jews??? Jesus wants the Jews to become Christians (where there is no Jew nor Greek)...

The verse doesn't say we are to bring to 'fullness' the spiritual Israel...It says that blindness 'is' happened to Israel UNTIL the fullness of the Gentiles be come in...

When the fullness of the Gentiles be come in, then Israel will be UNBLINDED...AND THEN,

Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

AND THEN, when the fullness of the Gentiles be come in, the DELIVERER will show up and turn away ungodliness from ungodly Israel...

Doesn't matter how you slice it and dice it, or shake it and bake it, we are not Israel and God is clear that when he's done with the Gentiles, He again is going to turn back to the Jews and continue on where He left off when they rejected Him before they Crucified Him...

No amount of adding to the scripture or taking away from it is going to change the Truth one iota...

[count-your-change]

First of all, my name isn't “Charlie” and insults and/or sarcasms aren't amusing.
Secondly, the only person who has taken anything away is you yourself.
Thirdly, the difference between what is spiritual and what is fleshly is clear from the Scriptures even if you see it otherwise.
But you have your views and have stated them clearly enough. With that I conclude our discussion as I said I would previously. Good day.