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Posted on 07/19/2006 10:40:38 AM PDT by Youngstown
IS THE NEW CATHEDRAL TO PADRE PIO IN SAN GIOVANNI ROTONDO ACTUALLY A "MASONIC TEMPLE"?
I have just received and am in the process of studying a special issue, #381 (March 2006), of the Italian religious magazine “CHIESA VIVA”. It is my understanding that in March 2006 this special issue was sent by the publisher/editor of “Chiesa Viva”, Dr. Monsignor Luigi Villa, to Catholic & 'catholic' priests, Bishops, Cardinals, as well as a selected group of Italian lay persons including members of the judiciary. This entire special issue deals with only one subject, that being the inauguration in July 2004 (construction began in 1996) of the new Cathedral dedicated to Padre Pio of San Giovanni Rotondo. The authors allege that after years of study they are now able to prove that this new church is in fact, NOT a Catholic Church, but rather a “Masonic temple”!
The authors (the engineer Franco Adessa) further allege that they have analyzed the complete church structure including the entry doors to the church, the altar plus the cross that hovers over it, the chapel of Adoration with the Tabernacle made out of jet black stone with the 13 plaques of silver as well as the immense stone cross that towers 40 meters over the piazza.
The authors allege that Masonic symbols are apparent everywhere. The authors allege that their special issue of Chiesa Viva has put into focus an alleged Masonic plan to DO battle with God by attempting to destroy the Catholic Church with Masonic Ecumenism. According to the authors the most devastating aspect of this blasphemy is the direct insult to the Holy Trinity and Our Lord Jesus Christ that have been symbolically displaced from the Cross and the Tabernacle and replaced by the blasphemous “Masonic triple trinity” and of Lucifer in person.
The authors allege that this story is one of money, power and control that go to the very top. To date news services around the world seem to be totally unaware of what has allegedly transpired in San Giovanni Rotondo, not one word has been uttered by the Vatican or other officials and millions of devotees to Saint Padre Pio are unaware and would be outraged if they ever suspected that their donations (estimated to be over $250,000,000.00 US) had been used to allegedly defame their beloved Saint!
If these allegations are in fact verified the scandal could be enormous. Millions of Catholics devoted to Padre Pio would be shocked and angry. The scandal would involve huge sums of money, the defamation of a Sainted Priest loved world wide by millions, the undermining of Faith, the undermining of the Catholic Hierarchy. It seems that officially no one in the Vatican is talking about this alleged scandal, even though a special reunion took place in San Giovanni Rotondo, on May 1 through May 6, 2006 attended by 150 Vatican experts including the Secretary of State Sodano. Ostensibly these experts converged on San Giovanni Rotondo to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the founding of the hospital (Casa di Sollievo della Sofferenza) by Padre Pio. Their meetings were open to the public during the day, however, their closed door evening meetings were allegedly dedicated to high level discussions of the Chiesa Viva special issue #381.It was subsequently reported, confidentially, that the Vatican has adopted an official solution that essentially amounts to total silence on this matter! If this is true then the allegations of Chiesa Viva may be much more than allegations and silence on the part of the Vatican is tantamount to conceding victory to Chiesa Viva. How long can this story be kept under wraps before the devotees of Padre Pio find out that they and their saint have been betrayed!?
Oh please. EVIL fighting EVIL is still EVIL.
BTW Can I watch a 4th degree Knights of Columbus installation?
RE: "These oaths are also sworn under symbolic, blood-curdling penalties of physical torture and death called self-curses (e.g., having my throat cut across, and my tongue torn out by its roots). These penalties show a lack of respect for God and amount to blasphemy which is a serious sin."
Makes ya wonder if Salza is at all familiar with the Inquisition.
Is Jack Chick a freemason? :-)
Just floating a trial baloon. I wanted to see what would happen if I used Jack Chick and Freemasons in the same sentence. :-)
sign me up!
I have no problem with anyone promoting goodness and morality, it's the other issues that I have mentioned that is a problem. It is teaching religious indifferentism and religious syncretism.
It is totally incompatible with the Christian faith which teaches what the Lord Jesus Christ taught us, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life."
You keep claiming that it's promoting tolerance, but you can be tolerant of others without telling them:
"Rather, they are the inspired wisdom contained in the Bible, the Talmud, the Koran, the Bhagavad-Gita or any of the other Great Books of Faith that have been universally recognized as man's best guides to happiness on this world and reward in the next.
Talk about starting a one world religion... there's your roots for it!
hey there! good to see you. where is everyone...back at "the lodge"?
You Freemasons remind me of the James Carville types during the Clinton era. Deny, Deny, Deny.
Do we not have the right to believe that the Catholic religion is the only true religion under our Constitution? After all, all religions contradict each other. If the statement, all religions are true is true, then the fact not all religions believe this disproves this because of the philosophical law of noncontradiction.
Freemasonry, by contrast believes that no religions are absolutely true, and requires everyone to believe likewise. Actions speak far louder than words. The Americans United for Separation of Church and State was founded by the Scottish Rite Freemasons, and BTW, the KKK was founded by Freemasons.
Gotta love your tolerant Fraternity.
I would suggest you research the role the Grand Orient Lodge played in the French Revolution. Stop denying the role your murderous little fraternity has played in world history.
My ancestor met the guillotine due to the Masonic ideology of the French Revolutionaries. I shouldn't waste my time with an ignorant fellow such as yourself.
Sure, become a Catholic and we'll let you join the Knights of Columbus, but you'll have to drop that membership in the Masons.
Hey Sparky. The "lodge" is becoming a vacant house on a huge lot I'm afraid. Good to see you too.
Not really because there's enough information out there to investigate if one is interested, plus I know several Masons that have told me some pretty bizarre stuff. Of course, doubt anyone here would believe me since it would be coming from a Catholic.
Exactly so and that poster owes ALL Masons, living and dead and all of their extended families a PUBLIC apology!
Nope. I don't worship the founding fathers. At least the Masons in America didn't follow their foreign counterparts into the innumerable murderous rampages.
My Swedish great-grandfather was a Mason, but it's not my job to judge his or anyone else's souls.
I reject, condemne and anathematize everything Freemasonry stands for.
Exactly so and that poster owes ALL Masons, living and dead and all of their extended families a PUBLIC apology!
Nope. I don't worship the founding fathers. At least the Masons in America didn't follow their foreign counterparts into the innumerable murderous rampages.
My Swedish great-grandfather was a Mason, but it's not my job to judge his or anyone else's souls.
I reject, condemn and anathematize everything Freemasonry stands for.
Worried about Masons? Worry about this. Italians not replacing themselves. Italy will become a Muslim country before the Masons ever get a chance to drive those funny little cars around Rome...
Bill Clinton is a Freemason, say no more. His persona sums up Freemasonry's belief system.
No, he's a nut, LOL! But you better not get too chummy with him, Invincibly Ignorant. I hear from Protestant circles he's a raging anti-Semite.
Dear nopardons,
"Yes, Freemasonry DOES teach something counter to Catholic teachings..."
If that is true, it is reason enough for Catholics not to join Masonry.
"...that all men are equal and that men of good character should be viewed as 'brothers'."
Actually, Catholicism teaches that all are created in the image and likeness of God, and in this way, all are equal. What we do not believe is that all men are created equal in terms of their natural and supernatural gifts, station in life, etc.
However, it's fair to say that Masonry tends to discount the Christian revelation as being authoritative and absolutely true. Its belief in the divinity is proved exclusively through natural revelation. Of course, this is understandable for an organization that tries to appeal to theists of every stripe. However, the overemphasis on natural revelation, to the exclusion of Divine revelation, is not something that the Catholic Church can accept. For Catholics, that's enough not to belong to Masonry.
I've discussed Masonic history with friends who are Masons, including one fellow who has researched Masonic history pretty thoroughly. I think one thing that most Catholics don't understand is that Masonry isn't like Catholicism, in that it isn't a monolithic movement with a unified central authority. My understanding is that there are different branches of Masonry, and that not all branches even agree who's in and who's out (even you allude to these facts).
Thus, one should be careful about holding all Masons responsible for the actions of some masons.
My Masonic friend has helped me explore a little some of the more sensationalist charges against Masonic ceremonials, especially those related to satanism. I've seen a significant amount of source documents concerning Masonic ceremonials as a result. My friend has actually given me a very old, out-of-date book showing the ceremonials for the degrees from one of the main rites (it's at work, so don't ask me any details right now - I just don't have the book handy). In perusing the volume, frankly, I found it difficult to uphold charges of satanism, or even explicitly anti-Christian teaching. As well, I didn't find the purported anti-Catholic oaths I've read on the Internet. I found some of the material sometimes quoted by anti-Masonic folks, but it was clear to me that it had been quoted out of context.
In fact, in some of the ceremonials, the imagery is actually explicitly Christian, and at times, even Catholic.
I'm a Catholic, and I'd never ever join the Masons, but these more fantastic charges haven't been sustained by my own research. Of course, absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence. As well, I haven't looked at all the ceremonials used at all times by all rites.
However, the more general charge of Masonic anti-Catholicism is more readily sustained. It's true that there are lodges in Europe that have been virulently anti-Catholic. My Masonic friend tells me that those groups weren't "real Masons," but the problem with not having a central authority is that to the outsider, all you have is competing claims of legitimacy from each group. To this outsider, they all look like Masons to me, so I'm inclined to think they're all Masons, as there isn't any Masonic "pope" to excommunicated them.
As well, in the United States, Masons corporately pushed for the anti-Catholic Blaine amendments that litter the constitutions of many states, preventing any state government funds from ever accruing to the benefit of Catholic schools. "Rum, Romanism, and rebellion!!"
In the Northwest, Masons pushed to actually ban Catholic schools, but were smacked down by the Supreme Court. Interestingly, the legal doctrines established from these cases now form the basis for constitutional law interpretation related to homeschooling.
And of course, another poster has cited the anti-Catholic deeds of Mexican Masons.
Now, it's true that probably most Masons are not (at least any longer) openly anti-Catholic. Anti-Catholic bigotry is less acceptable, and less pronounced today than, say, a hundred or a hundred fifty years ago. It's also true that many Masons a century and a half ago who were likely anti-Catholic were anti-Catholic because American culture was largely anti-Catholic, not because they were Masons.
And some will defend by saying that what some Masons did shouldn't be ascribed to all Masons. That's fair enough, but the fact is that a lot of Masons, and a lot of Masonic organizations, at a lot of times, have been anti-Catholic. I believe that the anti-Catholicism has largely abated.
However, as a devout Catholic, I don't really have any interest in a movement with the degree of anti-Catholic history that the Masons have generally.
sitetest
I hear he reads Foxes book of Martyrs everyday too. :-)
Hmm..they are building Mosques right here in America. According to MIT, there are over 2,000 Mosques in the United States today.
I know, he probably sleeps with it under his pillow at night.
A zealot. Perhaps your ad hominem attack reveals your bigotry and ignorance.
Give me a break. I'm just someone who takes my faith seriously. I stand by my and supporting a bigoted anti-Catholic organization such as Freemasonry is equivalent to Jews supporting the Aryan Nations or Nazi Party.
Perhaps they guys and gals in the Blue Lodges sit around drinking a few, but they know nothing about the higher degrees' hostility to Catholicism in particular. Any "Catholic" who joins the Masons is no longer a Catholic.
You should educate yourself a bit about the role the Masonic fraternity has played in persecuting Catholics and the Catholic Church for over 200 years.
Unless of you are afraid of what you might learn.
In a word, denial!
No, he is not a Freemason.
He was associated with DeMolay in his youth, which is a Masonic youth affiliate. He never became a Mason.
Nice try
Intolerant. That's just what Freemasonry is.
Masons only tolerate people who think they way they do, i.e. Truth is Relative.
"Catholics were forbidden to go inside another religions' church or temple; even to attend a funeral or a wedding, where they were not asked to participate in any religious activities. They couldn't even go into a church hall to attend an MYF ( Methodist Youth Fellowship ) dance, where absolutely NOTHING religious was going on."
Big deal. Who are you to judge? Who made you God? The Catholics weren't bothering you. They weren't, back then, marching to your home with torches, seeking to burn your home down because you weren't Catholic.
St. Paul teaches that adherence to heresy = spiritual death.
The Catholic Church was being charitable to the souls of its
adherents. Outside the Church there is no salvation, and any Catholic who leaves the Catholic Church knowing it is the unique Church of Christ cannot be saved.
Period. Your anti-Catholic bigotry is showing. We believe what we believe, and you can keep your relativism.
"However, as a devout Catholic, I don't really have any interest in a movement with the degree of anti-Catholic history that the Masons have generally."
There are many Catholic members of my Lodge. Are you to say that because of the Catholic history of Anti-Masonry, that I am not to associate with them or have interest in the Catholic Church, which I believe to be a force for good?
BILL CLINTON IS NOT A MASON. THAT IS A LIE!
Ahemm... those "Catholics" aren't being very good Catholics by disobeying the Church. They should be in the Knights of Columbus, not your organization.
The Masons have been undermining Italian Catholicism ever since Garibaldi helped establish the Republic of Italy.
Italy is in danger of becoming Muslim because of the prevalence of Masonic anticlericalism over the past approximately 150 years.
http://freemasonry.bcy.ca/biography/garibaldi_g/garibaldi.html
I don't think Pravknight was deliberately telling a lie about that. There are some websites that say he is, others that say he isn't. One says he was in the DeMolay Youth Group, but never actually became a Freemason.
He was associated with DeMolay in his youth >>>
you are right, Clintoon was never a mason, as a matter of fact, only 14 US presidents were masons.
I don't mean to be rude, but would people kindly put up a little bit of a text that they are talking about. I am discussing issues with several people in here so I don't know what you are referring to madam.
Ya know, my boss is belongs to the Knights of Columbus, and I know many others. We all honor each others Fraternities for the good they do. There may be some "Interservice" rivalry, but I have never known a Mason or a Knight to bad mouth the other like you and others on this thread have done to Masons.
You all could learn from the Knights
ohmygosh. That's slapping the "catholic" card down on the table. It won't work.
I have no prejudice against Catholics, and to invoke that sort of excuse seems rather childish.
Bill Clintoon was never a freemason, as a child he was in the youth group called DeMolay. That's it. Only 14 US presidents were freemasons, Gerald Ford was the last president who was a freemason.
"you are right, Clintoon was never a mason, as a matter of fact, only 14 US presidents were masons"
I guess that shoots down the "Grand Masonic/Illuminati/Trilateral theory, now, doesn't it? How many others theories of the same ilk are false?
GW Bush is a Freemason
Your ignorance of history is telling.
You guys need to get rid of your queer Priests so you can be free to attack the Freemasons.
Quite a story-one that does not need to be forgotten-or diminished by idiots that equate Masons to Nazis.
>>Your ignorance of history is telling. Perhaps you should investigate the role Freemasonry played in the slaughter of Mexican Catholics during the Mexican Revolution of the 1910s and 1920s.
Maybe your insular American Freemasonry hasn't resorted to physical violence, but it has historically used the courts to undermine the Catholic Church in America.
How do you know you aren't talking to some Knights of Columbus, LOL! There are several on this thread. I'll let you guess which ones.
GW Bush is a Freemason
>>
If he is it's the best kept secret in town, until I see it documented I will say that you are wrong. He is a member of the Skull and Bones which is documented, he being a freemason is not documented and not mentioned in any official biography. There were only 14 US presidents who were freemasons, Gerald Ford was the last.
Your stupidity is telling.
Ignorance is a condition. Stupidity is a lifestyle
Have a nice day
You guys need to get rid of your queer Priests so you can be free to attack the Freemasons.
Ouch! Well, we are trying and I do agree with you that that needs to be stopped.
Both
If you are one, you dishonor the Fraternity that I have known very honorable men to be a part of.
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