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Faith Healing & The Sovereignty of God
Modern Reformation Magazin ^ | 1998 | C. Everett Koop

Posted on 01/25/2005 8:54:53 AM PST by Gamecock

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To: Gamecock

Your lies about what my truth is built on are not well received in my camp, at all.


61 posted on 01/26/2005 7:46:52 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: jboot

I encourage you to continue to find as much fault as you can with all such . . .

and see how much God blesses such an exercise.


62 posted on 01/26/2005 7:47:44 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: P-Marlowe

I'm glad that someone in your camp--and pleased it's you--have the courage to

ALLOW GOD TO BE GOD!


63 posted on 01/26/2005 7:49:21 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: P-Marlowe

I'm not certain, but I think the fellow with the glass eye has gone on to Glory. I may try and Google for him sometime. Certainly my aunt, uncle and cousin are passed on to Glory. But their stories of their reasonably close friend with the glass eye were quite encouraging and faith building during my growing up.

They tended to be scrupulous in their narration of such events to be as accurate as they knew how to be.


64 posted on 01/26/2005 7:51:04 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: jboot

Nice to read that you, too, will alllow God to be God.

Doesn't seem to be a real common phenomena when one reads of your list's respect for, appreciation of and flowing in Acts 2 as THE MANUAL directs.


65 posted on 01/26/2005 7:52:42 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: NativeTexun

Reasonable criticisms, at least to a point--imho.

I do believe God is going to clean those nonsense aspects up wholesale in the not too distant future.

However, I also believe that God's drama, antics and FOOLISHNESS is still likely to be somewhat off the wall for many--especially many who may tend to try and stuff HIM into THEIR OWN TIDY LITTLE BOXES.


66 posted on 01/26/2005 7:54:59 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: topcat54

It would be very helpful if you would avoid playing my shrink.

You are consistently entirely wrong.

In this post, you are entirely wrong yet again. I'm not at all stinging regarding the St Nilus prophecy at all. If confirmation comes, it comes. If it doesn't it doesn't. Doesn't rock my faith in such things the least bit.

And your obnoxiousness is not an impressive advertisement for the . . . . notions of your perspective.


67 posted on 01/26/2005 7:57:12 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: NativeTexun

He's just trying to keep up his reputation . . . .


68 posted on 01/26/2005 7:57:56 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: Quix

and your point?

surely you're not referring to me

you don't know me well enough to make such harsh judgments

I suppose you believe the laughter movement aka Rodney Howard-Browne to be of God?

Surely there are no holds barred in your beliefs since you also believe in alien life forms.

Enough said.


69 posted on 01/26/2005 7:59:47 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: suzyjaruki

Actually, the research is quite contrary to your impression.

Pastors of every stripe TYPICALLY do well at discerning the difference between mental illness and other sorts of problems. And TYPICALLY they make appropriate referrals.

Also, Pentecostal, Charismatic sorts of pastors GENERALLY do very well at ministering to a range of mental illness problems with and even without professionals involved.

This is smack in the middle of my PhD Dissertation and something I know more than a little about.


70 posted on 01/26/2005 8:00:49 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: NativeTexun

The research says clearly and emhatically that your assumptions and impressions on this matter are wholesale wrong.

Your impressions and assumptions are the urban legend in this matter.


71 posted on 01/26/2005 8:01:50 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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To: Quix

>>ALLOW GOD TO BE GOD! <<

Flimsy teflon doctrine.


72 posted on 01/26/2005 8:05:07 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: topcat54

Quix seems to just be adversarial about everything. I better put on my flame suit.


73 posted on 01/26/2005 8:06:28 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: Quix

>>not well received in my camp, at all. <<

so what is your camp?


74 posted on 01/26/2005 8:07:15 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: Gamecock

Has the healing of Evander Holyfield's heart condition ever been doumented?


75 posted on 01/26/2005 8:08:56 PM PST by 185JHP ( "The thing thou purposest shall come to pass: And over all thy ways the light shall shine.")
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To: Quix

>>I encourage you to continue to find as much fault as you can with all such . . .

and see how much God blesses such an exercise. <<

I just have to ask .. since I came here for intelligent discourse ... not all these childish antics ... just why do you feel it necessary to be so condescending and downright nasty to anyone that would dare to challenge you or disagree with you? Can you give an answer from scripture rather than a hateful comeback? I'm not impressed ..it's downright rude and shouldn't be occuring among people who call themselves "believers."

I'm sure you'll have a slick comeback .. hey .. Slick Quix must be related to Slick Willie.

The animosity you show towards others is certainly not of God.

"you shall know them by their fruits ..."

So far it's a sour lemon.


76 posted on 01/26/2005 8:14:07 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: Quix

I'm going to ignore you and I hope you will do the same with me.

I want no further discourse.

I have one scripture for you, however .. and since the shoe fits .. why don't you put it on. "A fool gets into constant fights. His mouth is his undoing! His words endanger him." Proverbs 19:6-7

God does not approve of all the strife being stirred up in this forum.

I don't want to be a part of your animosity. If I weren't a Christian already and came in here, just from your posts and your attitude towards others I'd be turned off to any attempt to win me to Christ.

You are about the most arrogant religious person I've run into in all my years and I think you take great pride in being so.


77 posted on 01/26/2005 8:26:12 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: Quix

>>Pastors of every stripe TYPICALLY do well at discerning the difference between mental illness and other sorts of problems. And TYPICALLY they make appropriate referrals.
<<

Just finishing up .. couldn't pass this by. Support this assertion. It's not enough to say something without sourcing it.

There's a contrary example .. the pastor who tried to cast the demons out of the autistic boy who is currently serving prison time for same. The boy died during the "deliverance." The pastor might have been well-intentioned but he was clearly ignorant.


78 posted on 01/26/2005 8:30:30 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: suzyjaruki; jboot; P-Marlowe; topcat54; Gamecock
I picked up a book in the early 90's that deals with a person's struggle to have a miracle healing.

"Holding God Hostage" by Tom Watson, Jr. & Stan Schmidt

From the cover: "Sometimes we attempt to limit God's healing to something supernatural, denying the miracle of healing that He often provides through modern medicine and counseling. What we're usually doing is "HOLDING GOD HOSTAGE."

Paraphrase of book from back cover:

"For approx. ten years, Schmidt was a diagnosed manic-depressive. "Friends" (quotes mine) told him to stop his meds and "trust God" for his healing. Stan did as his "friends" advised and was okay for a few months but eventually ended up in a suicidal depression. Stan realized he was holding God hostage even tho his intentions were good, he was attempting to limit his healing solely to a miracle denying the healing God often provides thru modern medicine and counseling.

Stan had crossed the dangerous line when faith becomes presumption ... molding God to his own design and naming and claiming what he wanted instead of recognizing the transcending importance and rightness of what HE wants."

EXCELLENT BOOK!
79 posted on 01/26/2005 9:02:42 PM PST by NativeTexun ("If you don't live in Texas, you don't live in the United States.")
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To: NativeTexun

Yes.

There are exceptions.

Just as there are pastors of the persuasion of the folks starting this thread who abuse people up one side and down the other as well. No particular construction on reality in Christendom has a corner on being perfect or on being greatly flawed.

However, my statement with it's qualifier still stands as a very accurate one. I happen to be an expert on the topic. I will not cite other references. I will note that Rokeach is a good researcher in the field. There are others.

Do your own research if you want to pontificate on the topic from accurate authority.


80 posted on 01/26/2005 9:08:01 PM PST by Quix (HAVING A FORM of GODLINESS but DENYING IT'S POWER. 2 TIM 3:5)
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