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Threat of switch to Euro currency inspired war
BSU DAILY NEWS ^ | 4.18.03 | Matt Sharp

Posted on 04/19/2003 8:07:22 AM PDT by Enemy Of The State

Threat of switch to Euro currency inspired war


April 18, 2003

Dear Editor,

Oil has been traded with U.S. dollars since 1971. Other countries must stockpile dollars to be able to purchase oil, which gives America the dominant economy. The only economic bloc to contest America's power is the European Union. Yet, the EU still has to hoard dollars to buy oil, making the Euro's power limited indeed.

Iraq switched to the Euro in 1999. Of course, America didn't take this seriously, since the Euro was relatively weak.

However, within two years the Euro was gaining on the dollar. Venezuela also has been thinking about making the switch. Now our government is scared.

Our government owes $12,000 per citizen of America. That's $12,000 times 280 million. Do the math! We haven't had to pay this, because our debt never reaches the bank. The world subsidizes us, and we keep printing more money for trading.

Now, what would happen if oil nations switched to the Euro? An almost overnight crash of our economy.

So, what to do?

Hmm...how about invade Iraq, force them back to trading oil for the dollar, and send a message to the rest of the world that the dollar is here to stay. To the optimists who say this war was for democracy and freedom, wake up. Our government put Saddam in power. In 1989, it gave him $1 billion in loan guarantees, when it knew he was gassing Kurds. Now we care about the Iraqi people?

Democracy? Please...what about the democratically elected leaders our government has killed? Lumumba and Allende come to mind. Democratically elected leaders overthrown? Does Bosch of the Dominican Republic, Ortega of Nicaragua, or Arbenz of Guatemala ring a bell?

We, the people, must stop the malfeasance of our government. We must demand justice, social equality, and true freedom, and do it now.

Matt Sharp

senior



TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Germany; Government; Politics/Elections; US: Indiana; United Kingdom; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: conspiracy; energy; energylist; eu; europelist; forex; funnymoney; geopolitics; iraqifreedom; oil; tinfoil; usdollars

1 posted on 04/19/2003 8:07:22 AM PDT by Enemy Of The State
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To: Enemy Of The State
Ignorant booshwa.

They could denominate the price of oil in any currency they want, and it would make little difference.

Beyond that, there isn't any reason to think that the Euro's present relative strength against the dollar is anything but temporary. European monetary and fiscal policy is a shambles and getting worse. Within two years the Euro will be trading below 85 cents, anmd in ten years it will be nearing 50 cents.

It is inevitable, given the fact that the Euro is a transnational currency.
2 posted on 04/19/2003 8:15:06 AM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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To: Enemy Of The State
A Ball State senior, ahem, I mean a BS senior? Didn't Letterman attend that school? Is this guy another comedian?
3 posted on 04/19/2003 8:15:48 AM PDT by hillary's_fat_a**
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To: Enemy Of The State
Idiot conspiracy theorist...
4 posted on 04/19/2003 8:17:30 AM PDT by AFPhys (((PRAYING for: President Bush & advisors, troops & families, Americans)))
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To: Enemy Of The State
So we fought a war to keep oil contracts denominated in dollars instead of euros.

Yeah, sure, and Jeff Gordon won the race last week because his car is a cool color.

Just to note one of the more egregious distortions here, Ortega was not overthrown by the US. He was voted out of office by his own people. Even doofus Jimmy Carter conceded that the election was fair.
5 posted on 04/19/2003 8:18:14 AM PDT by Joe Bonforte
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To: Enemy Of The State
I love the "The USA put Saddam in power" line...
6 posted on 04/19/2003 8:18:14 AM PDT by Guillermo (Sic 'em!)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Now, what would happen if oil nations switched to the Euro? An almost overnight crash of our economy.

The oil nations all have their own currencies. And they don't set prices in dollars or anything else. They set production targets.

What a retard.

7 posted on 04/19/2003 8:20:24 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: aculeus; general_re; BlueLancer; Poohbah; Enemy Of The State
With understanding and treatment, this young man could eventually lead a useful and productive life.
8 posted on 04/19/2003 8:20:48 AM PDT by dighton (Amen-Corner Hatchet Team, Nasty Little Clique)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Democratically elected leaders overthrown? Does … Ortega of Nicaragua … ring a bell? Since when does being defeated in an election constitute being overthrown?
9 posted on 04/19/2003 8:22:22 AM PDT by Friend of thunder (No sane person wants war, but oppressors want oppression.)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Ah, to be young, and stupid, and have no future . . . .
10 posted on 04/19/2003 8:26:00 AM PDT by surely_you_jest
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To: John Valentine
"Beyond that, there isn't any reason to think that the Euro's present relative strength against the dollar is anything but temporary. European monetary and fiscal policy is a shambles and getting worse. Within two years the Euro will be trading below 85 cents, anmd in ten years it will be nearing 50 cents."

Not so fast.

Britain will probably join (unfortunately). Don't forget, when the Irish chose no, they voted all over again.

Also, many countries are thinking of trading in Euros. The country I live in, Indonesia, is seriously contemplating this switch.

I hope I'm wrong.

Keep smiling,

Philip.

11 posted on 04/19/2003 8:27:43 AM PDT by Jakarta ex-pat
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To: Enemy Of The State
Matt Sharp

Not very.

He needs the back end (knife sharpener) of my electric can opener for a little work.

.........and to think his parents paid good money for 4 years to educate him. They should ask for a refund

12 posted on 04/19/2003 8:29:10 AM PDT by JZoback (Don't have such an open mind, your brain falls out)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Just before the troops went in, a talk show host - Gene Burns of KGO 81 San Francisco, and a man who ran for the Presidency as a liberterian about 20 years ago - had some fella' on who wrote an article about just this topic.
This didn't come from the psycotic mind of Mr. Sharp, but is another tin-foil story circulating in and amongst the Bush hating crowd.

13 posted on 04/19/2003 8:47:35 AM PDT by skinner
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To: Enemy Of The State
So what currency was that the soldiers found in Iraq??? There was not a Euro there, all greenbacks. Saddam was not stupid.
14 posted on 04/19/2003 8:49:20 AM PDT by cynicom
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To: Enemy Of The State
"Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son"

Dean Wormer
15 posted on 04/19/2003 8:51:33 AM PDT by Nubbytwanger
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To: Enemy Of The State
BSU? OK
16 posted on 04/19/2003 8:53:52 AM PDT by putupon (I smack Chirac and Robbins too w/ my shoe.)
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To: Jakarta ex-pat
The Euro is now probably at the highest exchange rate with the dollar it ever will be. We are in economic downturn and there largest economy is tanking, Germany. Not to mention 10% unemployment in many EU countries and virtually zero job growth in Europe for decades. I like our chances better than there's.
17 posted on 04/19/2003 9:01:49 AM PDT by arkfreepdom
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To: Enemy Of The State
This is not an origional thesis.

Sites like rense.com have been putting forth this idea for months now.

18 posted on 04/19/2003 9:02:14 AM PDT by Freebird Forever
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To: putupon; John Valentine; hillary's_fat_a**; AFPhys; Joe Bonforte; Guillermo; Dog Gone; dighton; ...
Well, apparently Mr. Matt (not so) Sharp is not only an idiot, but he appears to be an idiot that copies material from other idiots!
 
I just noticed this post on the forum where this "article" was located.
 
"Dear Mr. Sharp,
For your edification/education please read
http://www.2000wave.com/article.asp?id=mwo032803.
Oh, and when you quote or paraphrase information
from other printed material, even in a letter to
an editor, it is appropriate to cite said info.

mdf
teacher"

19 posted on 04/19/2003 9:05:37 AM PDT by Enemy Of The State
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To: Freebird Forever
Thanks! See post above.
20 posted on 04/19/2003 9:06:16 AM PDT by Enemy Of The State
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To: Enemy Of The State
Good catch. Here's a corrected link.
21 posted on 04/19/2003 9:09:35 AM PDT by dighton (Amen-Corner Hatchet Team, Nasty Little Clique)
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To: AFPhys
Clearly.

The overwhelming strength of the Euro was reason for the US to go to war? Why, then, was it about 2/3 of a BILLION dollars, in US currency, that was recovered in the blocked-up residence found by the USMC? If the Euro was so strong, those boxes would not have been filled with dollars. The US dollar is still recognized by a far greater portion of the world's population as the premier currency, and no other nation's currency is subject to as many counterfeiting attempts.
22 posted on 04/19/2003 9:16:02 AM PDT by alloysteel
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To: Enemy Of The State
We, the people, must stop the malfeasance of our government. We must demand justice, social equality, and true freedom, and do it now.

We did stop it. The Clinton/Gore nightmare is over.

23 posted on 04/19/2003 9:30:42 AM PDT by AlaskaErik
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To: Enemy Of The State
This thesis is out there among some Bush haters, but also among the economic alarmists and doomsayers. I don't believe that either oil or the dollar was the primary reason for our war against Iraq, but they may well be among the secondary considerations.

As for oil, it's perfectly true that we need to deal with one of radical Islam's most powerful weapons: its control over most of the world's oil reserves and its ability to undermine the world economy. Saudi Arabia has the power to virtually destroy the world economy almost singlehandedly, if they become desperate enough; and Saudi Arabia also happens to be at the very root of Islamic terrorism. One reason we had to go into Iraq first is that we had to secure the world's second-largest oil reserves (plus Kuwait) before we could venture to confront the Saudi problem.

Yes, the Euro is sick; but recently the dollar has been even sicker, since it is has been declining against the Euro and has broken through the support level. That is mostly because of our huge and growing balance of payment deficits and our current economic malaise.

Malaysia has been leading the way toward a gold-based dinar, on which oil payments could be based, hoping to replace the dollar in trading among the Muslim states, and I don't doubt that France is trying to lead the way toward a Euro-based world economy, and that Chirac has been secretly working with the Arab countries to implement this dream.

Gold and the British Pound used to be the two chief mediums of exchange. They were replaced by the U.S. dollar after Britain suffered a string of deficits going back to 1914. Nothing says that the dollar will not similarly be replaced if we continue to run huge balance of payments deficits and if the world loses confidence in the American economy as a place to park their funds.

So, there is likely a smidgen of truth in this article. There were many reasons for fighting the war against Iraq. This may be one of the subsidiary reasons. Like the need to preserve our oil supply, it is a perfectly legitimate national security consideration, although not enough in itself to justify fighting the war.
24 posted on 04/19/2003 9:32:34 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Sigh. Every time I think the "youts" of the nation may actually have it together, someone like this nincompoop pops up. Our best and brightest are thousands of miles away, still trying to sort out the "good" Iraqis from the "bad." This dipwad ought to take the tour.
25 posted on 04/19/2003 9:57:26 AM PDT by LS
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To: Enemy Of The State
Iraq switched to the Euro in 1999.

How many boxes containing Millions of Euros have been found?

26 posted on 04/19/2003 10:22:48 AM PDT by Mike Darancette (Soddom has left the bunker.)
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To: Fzob
Post# 21 Excellent read
27 posted on 04/19/2003 10:46:24 AM PDT by JZoback (Don't have such an open mind, your brain falls out)
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To: Enemy Of The State
Threat of switch to Euro currency inspired war

If this is the sort of critical thinking they teach in college these days, it makes you think a college degree isn't worth much any more.

I heard some weirdo on "Coast to Coast" (Art Bell's program without Art now) say the same thing. Maybe the guy was another graduate of Ball State.

28 posted on 04/19/2003 10:52:50 AM PDT by stripes1776
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To: alloysteel
But the reasons for switching to the euro by the oil countries are not economic. They are political. It is economic warfare against the United States, striking the only way they can. If Saudi Arabia could freely switch to the euro it could dictate our Mideast policy.

What if a wave of hyperinflation means that America can no longer afford a world class military ? What if it means America becoming an IMF basket case like Argentina and baby boomers spending their golden years scrounging in garbage pails ? I support the war but I agree that this is a very hard economic self interest rationale that was totally compelling.
29 posted on 04/19/2003 11:01:24 AM PDT by Tokhtamish
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To: Enemy Of The State
I don't know macroeconomics from shinola...
but I'm getting the feeling that the Democratic Party/Anti-War/Anti-Dubya
partisans are going to make the "Clinton-Conspiracy" extremists look
very, very sane.
30 posted on 04/19/2003 11:02:55 AM PDT by VOA
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To: Enemy Of The State
Something similar was reported on a radio show called "Goldline" about 8 weeks ago. That the EU is fed up with having to trade in dollars. And Mexico was having a fire sale to unload dollars. Plus in June or July some countries (2 or 3) automatically switch to trading in dinars. Apparently, in the world market in order to trade, dollars is the currency, which in turn makes the US stronger financially. However, the EU and others are trying to break that tradition. Don't entirely discount this info. It's worth watching.
31 posted on 04/19/2003 11:03:39 AM PDT by lilylangtree
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To: Enemy Of The State
This urban legend about oil rich countries switching to the Euro shows up every three to five years in those Middle Eastern countries who's currencies are tied to the US dollar. It began when petrodollars started flowing to those countries (about 30 years ago ) , and won't end anytime soon. Not saying that it won't ever happen, but it's usually just wishful thinking on some European's part. I'm surprised anyone fell for it.

Before the Euro, the rumor usually had those countries switching from the dollar to whichever currency was trading the strongest at that time. The British Pound, Swiss Francs, or the most popular, German Deutschmarks were the front runners.
32 posted on 04/19/2003 11:09:06 AM PDT by Hillarys Gate Cult ("Read Hillary's hips. I never had sex with that woman.")
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To: Brad's Gramma; GunRunner
Here's another one. You can leave feeback on their forum below the article (click on source link).
33 posted on 04/19/2003 12:08:05 PM PDT by Republican Wildcat
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To: Republican Wildcat
Who ME? Little ole innocent ME leave feedback? Send an email?

Awwwww.......come on. You must have me confused with someone else BUMP! :-)
34 posted on 04/19/2003 1:10:59 PM PDT by Bradís Gramma (Become a Monthly Donor to Free Republic. Please?)
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To: Jakarta ex-pat
If you are posting from Indonesia, you are staying up late.

Really, it makes little or no difference whether Indonesia denominates its debts in Rupiah, Dollars, Yen or Euros.

These are all paper transactions, and are dwarfed by the enormous quantity of money exchanged every day -1.2 TRILLION dollars. This dwarfs the daily trade in securities on all worldwide markets combined, and dwarfs by an even huger amount the total daily trade in oil.

By the way, I also have a home in Indonesia, but the press of my own economic requirements keeps me away too much of the year...
35 posted on 04/19/2003 2:07:59 PM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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To: cynicom
The national currency of Iraq is not the Euro. The international oil wholesalers and retailers almost exclusively base their indexes on the US Dollar.

Big difference.

About the rest of the story, a little truth mixed with a bunch of hooey makes for an opinion I guess.
36 posted on 04/19/2003 4:19:39 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: lilylangtree
Yes, there is truth in this. The *ONLY* thing backing the US Dollar, the favored index currency for world trade, is the sword.
37 posted on 04/19/2003 4:21:30 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: Enemy Of The State
This kid spent 16 years becoming educated and came to this conclusion? Something is very, very wrong here.
38 posted on 04/19/2003 4:23:28 PM PDT by Former Proud Canadian
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To: Guillermo
Saddam was allied first with Soviet Union
when he came to power.
Then we through Iran supported Kurdish
rebels who really had Saddam on the ropes.
Then Saddam cut a deal were he stopped
be a Soviet ally and we cut off aid to
the Kurds.
39 posted on 04/19/2003 6:28:27 PM PDT by Princeliberty
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To: Enemy Of The State
Thank you for that excellent link (and very long read)...
40 posted on 04/19/2003 10:29:04 PM PDT by AFPhys (((PRAYING for: President Bush & advisors, troops & families, Americans)))
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To: ApesForEvolution
Once again, by his adhreence to hooey, "Apes for Evolution" proves anew that there is truly room left for growth, evolutionary or otherwise, even in the "higher" apes.
41 posted on 04/20/2003 2:12:11 AM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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Comment #42 Removed by Moderator

To: John Valentine
Are you disputing what I asserted in post 37?
43 posted on 04/20/2003 11:09:44 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: ApesForEvolution
Yep. Sure am. In spades.
44 posted on 04/20/2003 4:55:13 PM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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To: John Valentine
Then, please - by all means, share what you know about world currency and trade...
45 posted on 04/20/2003 4:59:37 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: ApesForEvolution
You are the one pronouncing that the economic theory and practice of the past 200 years is wrong and should be stood on it's head, so why don't you go first.

But, I'll endorse the article linked in post 21 above as quite representative of mainstream thought on the subject.
46 posted on 04/20/2003 10:05:32 PM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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To: Enemy Of The State
It's way too complicated for this useful idiot.
That move was not Iraq's.
Clearly it was the pressure from the two self-perceived strongest members of the E.U.

I'll let the readers guess who that might be... he he he.

The "prestige" factor alone would maintain their illusions.

47 posted on 04/20/2003 10:34:25 PM PDT by Publius6961 (Californians are as dumm as a sack of rocks)
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To: John Valentine
That's what I thought. For the record, the monetary system in both theory and practice changed dramatically in this country just 70 short years ago. The nation was taken off the gold reserve. The dollar only remains as strong as the nation's strength is to dominate our world. After Sept. 11, 2001, it appears that the dollar can be weakened very substantially and very quickly.
48 posted on 04/21/2003 1:04:35 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution ("The only way evil triumphs is if good men do nothing" E. Burke)
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To: ApesForEvolution
I was composing this reply a few hours ago when I hit a mystery key on my computer and sent the whole thing to oblivion.

Look, anything, gold, the money of any nation, you name it, is worth exactly what others are willing to pay for it, no more and no less. Gold, schmold, it makes no difference except to maintain monetary discipline. Gold is certainly not a necessary adjunct to monetary stability.

The Euro, for example, is not backed by anything, not even a nation. As money goes it is pure hype and little else, but it has been gaining against the dollar for some time.

I for one think that is a very temporary situation, for many reasons, and the US Dollar will reestablish its value vis-a-vis the Euro within the near term.

But whatever its value at any moment it is purely reflective of the market in its endless chase of an elusive and ever disappearing equilibrium.

The "sword" has nothing to do with the value af any nations currency except indirectly, as a nation is perceived to be strong and enduring. But if that were the ONLY consideration the Euro would be 40 cents US, as Europe now stands exposed as totally inept militarily and politically.

But, just wait. Nature's balance will reassert itself, and quality will out.

But don't get hung up on gold. Gold has no more absolute intrinsic value than paper. It is all in the perception of others that value is found.

If the paper is not kited, it will be good. Gold can be debased too and often has been, and prople have been burned bad over the years.

I took issue with your assertion that the value of the dollar is somehow enforced by the sword. I still take issue with that. I think it is utter nonsense.

If the US Dollar has any value it is due to trust and faith in the sincerity and honor of the United States, as well as in it's strength. It is not a matter of "enforcement" by the sword.
49 posted on 04/21/2003 1:21:40 AM PDT by John Valentine (Writing from downtown Seoul, keeping an eye on the hills to the north.)
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To: John Valentine
The goldbugs never learn.

You are correct; gold is only worth whatever someone says it is and THAT has changed many times, throughout history. Some peoples thought/think certain shells are more valuable than gold. In other times and other places, it was pepper.

And as for this silly letter to the editor, by an empty headed kid,it's apparent that he's never taken an eco class, nor one in history.

50 posted on 04/21/2003 1:33:43 AM PDT by nopardons
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