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Libertarians Join Liberals in Challenging Sodomy Law
NYTimes ^ | March 19, 2003 | LINDA GREENHOUSE

Posted on 03/19/2003 12:48:02 AM PST by RJCogburn

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To: The Green Goblin
Only God makes those decisions, not I. He is qualified because He rules the universe and owns each one of us completely. He decides when people die, and can take each one of us at any time. I've given an explanation on this issue already.

The question that remains - what will you say when you face Him, as you will someday? Jesus Christ has enabled us to be forgiven of our sins. That is the only way to be redeemed.
581 posted on 03/23/2003 8:32:32 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Zack Nguyen
Only God makes those decisions, not I. He is qualified because He rules the universe and owns each one of us completely. He decides when people die, and can take each one of us at any time. I've given an explanation on this issue already.

You have failed to provide a logical argument for your belief that God is the source of moral absolutes, and have offered nebulous arguments in the face of hard evidence to the contrary. The essence of your argument is that moral relativism is ok if God approves of it. I think I've proven my point that God is as morally relative as the rest of us.

582 posted on 03/24/2003 5:28:07 AM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: Zack Nguyen
We don't know all the answers.

Obviously you don't. Good. Maybe next time you won't be so quick to attack atheists for not knowing all of them.

By the way, your initial argument on this thread assumed that all libertarians are atheists, which is certainly not true either.

583 posted on 03/24/2003 5:32:35 AM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: The Green Goblin
I do not recall saying that all libertarians are atheists. If I did, please quote me. I said that libertarians find it difficult to form a fundamental moral worldview.

I do not have all the answers. God does, and His Word illuminates His will.
584 posted on 03/24/2003 12:34:09 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Zack Nguyen
I said that libertarians find it difficult to form a fundamental moral worldview.

Also untrue, since libertarianism is merely a political philosophy and says nothing about the religious views of those who subscribe to it may hold. Why did you you make such a broad and unjustified statement?

585 posted on 03/24/2003 12:52:10 PM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: The Green Goblin
All politics is moral, ergo all politics is connected, one way or another, with a religious worldview, whether that worldview be true or false. Politics and religion cannot be separated.
586 posted on 03/24/2003 2:39:05 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Zack Nguyen
All politics is moral, ergo all politics is connected, one way or another, with a religious worldview, whether that worldview be true or false. Politics and religion cannot be separated.

Really? Then the existence of the Christian socialists and communists condemns you. That broad brush you're wielding can certainly be used both ways.

Furthermore, your statement bespeaks an ignorance of political philosophy, and such a statement would certainly earn you a failing grade in any freshman course on political philosophy...

587 posted on 03/24/2003 3:57:28 PM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: The Green Goblin
It may very well lend me a failing grade, but I wouldn't take that as meaning it was untrue. I am confused how the existence of Christian socialists and Christian communists (though I confess I have never met a Christian communist - perhaps Stalin had them all killed), "condemns" me. Rather I think it proves my point.

Their politics is a result of their religion. Now they have taken a terribly wrong view of the Bible and of Christianity, and thus their political views are based on faulty premises. But nevertheless it proves my point that all politics is based fundamentally on a moral, or religious viewpoint.

After all, you and I have spent the last week arguing about sodomy. Eventually we discovered that our differences are based, fundamentally, on spiritual matters.
588 posted on 03/26/2003 7:38:08 AM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Zack Nguyen
You are apparently unaware that the vast majority of libertarians happen to be Christians.
589 posted on 03/26/2003 12:24:19 PM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: The Green Goblin
Yes, that would surprise me a great deal. Most libertarians I have communicated with on this site are not Christian. Many are atheists and followers of the philosophies of the late Ayn Rand. I have never heard that a majority of the Libertarian Party is Christian. Do you have data to support your assertion?
590 posted on 03/26/2003 12:34:08 PM PST by Zack Nguyen
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To: Zack Nguyen
Most libertarians I have communicated with on this site are not Christian.

Instead of basing your views solely on what you see on this limited site, you should read a book or two on the history of libertarianism, especially the pre-Rand days. You'll be surprised...

591 posted on 03/26/2003 12:43:57 PM PST by The Green Goblin
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