American-Born Muslims And The Lessons Of The Lackawanna, NY Terrorist Cell

toogoodreports.com ^ | September 16, 2002 | Alan Caruba

[dennisw]

Dittos. I feel the same way.

[js1138]

See the difference?

Of course I see the difference, and have pointed it out many times. But for some reason, theology never seems to stop bullies and tyrants. When you get down to the bottom line, what matters is how cultures handle their bullies.

[dennisw]

Really? What major religions would that be? If you are talking about Christianity (e.g. Crusades, colonialism, counter-reformation, etc.), let me point out a simple fact to you. When muslims rape and pillage and force conversions, they are following the fundamental tenets of their founder and their Koran. When so-called Christians do this, they are going directly against the teachings of their founder, Jesus Christ. See the difference?

Look at the track record. Muhammad killed many and made the first Jihads. Jesus killed no one and in fact healed a few. I wonder if there are any healings in the Koran by Mohammed. I'll bet not! Mad Mo' was too busy making wars and looking for child brides.

[austingirl]

Immigrants used to learn the ways of our country and join in our culture. My father couldn't speak English when he went to first grade in Chicago in 1931 - his Lithuanian parents hadn't bothered to adapt - my dad learned English in a hurry. How do you have a melting pot when people isolate in enclaves that refuse to join our country?

[exmarine]

But for some reason, theology never seems to stop bullies and tyrants. When you get down to the bottom line, what matters is how cultures handle their bullies.

It has nothing to do with theology and everything to do with sinful depraved men (anyone who murders and forces conversions) and false gods (Allah).

[dennisw]

Hey I agree. Now I could see if two of the five had American first names. With three having Muslim names. But for all five of them to have Muslim names and are born in America, leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I would say the same if they were Hispanic. I like an American to have the name Robert Perez a lot more than Roberto Perez. It's about respect for the nation you came to for a better life!

[iconoclast]

The book should be mandatory reading in all of our public schools.

Agreed, but you and I will have to stand outside the school and pass them out. They sure as he!! won't get it from the NEA!

[js1138]

At the moment, Islam is the world's number one troublemaker. Everywhere there are Muslims, there is hate, discontent, poverty, riots and war.

It is a stretch to find support for this kind of behavior in the teachings of Jesus, but it has been done. I've heard people within the last week on television say that war can be justified by Jesus' driving the moneychangers out of the temple. I find this a stretch.

I say every time I get the opportunity that goodness and evil are properties of individuals rather than ideas. Of course cultures that have stupid beliefs are more susceptible to being led by evil people. that is why we say "those who believe absurdities will commit atrocities."

[exmarine]

Hey I agree. Now I could see if two of the five had American first names. With three having Muslim names. But for all five of them to have Muslim names and are born in America, leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I would say the same if they were Hispanic. I like an American to have the name Robert Perez a lot more than Roberto Perez. It's about respect for the nation you came to for a better life!

The reason why they don't have American names is simply because they live in America, but do not love America. Ever notice that hispanic immigrants fly the mexican flag on their homes? They are mexicans first and foremost. Same with muslims. I have a question for our leaders in Washington and elsewhere? Why do we let people into this country who do not embrace our ideals, who do not embrace our heroes, and who reject our culture? That is national suicide?

[dennisw]

To repeat:
How many did Jesus kill? How many did he heal?
How many did Muhammad kill? How many did he heal?

The Bible is all about the teachings of Jesus and the Koran is all about the teachings of Muhammad. I know I'm being simplistic but the Koran/Muhammad are war oriented while the Bible/Jesus are peace oriented. All kinds of justifications and interpretations can be pulled from either book but above are their base orientations.

[exmarine]

It is a stretch to find support for this kind of behavior in the teachings of Jesus, but it has been done. I've heard people within the last week on television say that war can be justified by Jesus' driving the moneychangers out of the temple. I find this a stretch.

Jesus' action at the temple has nothing to do with what we are discussing. However, Jesus said, "all authority on heaven and earth has been given to me" - on that basis -- the basis that He is God in human flesh -- He has the authority to judge people. That being said, he did not kill them did He (even though He was justified in doing so since the money changers were ripping people off in the name of God!!). His anger was a RIGHTEOUS anger. Whoever told you this is an example of violence has a horrendous understanding of the New Testament.

Now that your single objection has been dispensed with, please tell me -- where in the New Testament (the single authority for Christ's teachings) does it teach us to murder and kill in the name of God. If you can't produce it, then perhaps you should change your opinion to correspond with the truth? If you refuse to do that, then I must assume you are operating on uninformed bias.

[desertcry]

CAIR=Council on American Islamic Relation, what is the relevance of AMERICAN in CAIR. Should they rename their council as: CIR, since their their loyalty is only to islam, to the exclusion of everything else.

[desertcry]

CAIR=Council on American Islamic Relation, what is the relevance of AMERICAN in CAIR. Should they rename their council as: CIR, since their their loyalty is only to islam, to the exclusion of everything else.

[holyscroller]

I called them spoiled brats only because they were raised in America and got to enjoy all our rights, freedoms and privilages, educated in our schools at probably not a penny's expense to their parents, probably on welfare, with free housing, food and medical care, and in appreciation they were in training to do us dirt. You're darned right they're terrorists, and I agree with your solutions. I won't be happy until we deport about 99% of our current Muslim population, and stop letting even another one in.

[exmarine]

I say every time I get the opportunity that goodness and evil are properties of individuals rather than ideas. Of course cultures that have stupid beliefs are more susceptible to being led by evil people. that is why we say "those who believe absurdities will commit atrocities."

This statment you made makes no sense. If evil is not real, what standard are you using when a person commits an evil act? If evil and goodness are not objectively real, then there can be no standard with which to judge an evil act. In fact, there can be no such thing as evil unless you are calling it evil as measured against a standard of goodness

[js1138]

where in the New Testament (the single authority for Christ's teachings) does it teach us to murder and kill in the name of God.

I never said such a justification existed. I said people have murdered and killed in the name of Christianity. And as a matter of fact, they have done so for more centuries than not. If you're being murdered, it doesn't help if your killer has his theology wrong. Religions are embodied in people, institutions like churches, and governments. If the people running things are evil, the words mean nothing.

[B-Cause]

Bump

The book should be mandatory reading in all of our public schools.

Agreed, but you and I will have to stand outside the school and pass them out. They sure as he!! won't get it from the NEA!

Right - any idea on how to get it around to the kids - Internet?

[vaudine]

21st century multiculturalists don't want "a melting pot". They want fondue--many little pots with different contents so they can dip into the cultural coating of their choice. It works for toast/cake, but is not conducive to a unified nation.

vaudine

[willyone]

It is already too late to save the Southwest. You all better be prepared to make room for several million fellow Americans when the poop hits the fan. Part of the platform of the Aztlan movement is expulsion of all non Chicanos. Some may laugh but I believe they are dead serious.

[willyone]

And are encouraged by the elites not to assimilate. In fact are told that they can do anything they want and American culture is corrupt so they do not have to fit in. The Pubbies led by George Bush are pushing this insanity in the quest for votes. It ain't gonna work George.