PREZ WILL TRY TO RALLY INVESTORS

New York Post ^ | Saturday, July 13, 2002 | By BRIAN BLOMQUIST

[rwfromkansas]

Want to get things going again?

Announce that any investor that does not buy stock every day for the next month will be considered an enemy combatant and detained at military facilities indefinitely.

Ultimately, that is what investors are if they do not do their patriotic duty to get this country back on its feet after 9-11 and in this time of war.

[rwfromkansas]

Obviously excluding the small investor.....

[Mulder]

Sounds to me most people here are looking for Government to bail them out again.

No. Most people here are looking for the gov't to leave us the hell alone, and for the Republican party to follow their written (and rhetorical) platform and reduce both spending and taxes.

The only way a speech would work if some people here and the Demorats do not undermind everything he say's.

Is the President (who has a 75% approval rating) so weak that "some people" on an internet forum can undermine his agenda? Or even the democratic Senate (which has many members from states which Bush won with a 10%+ margin)? We don't need the consent of 50 democratic Senators-- only a handful. Perhaps the President should start working with the John Breaux's of the Senate instead of the Ted Kennedy's.

Anyway, I'm just not talking about making a speech and stopping there. I'm talking about mounting an aggressive campaign to get major tax cuts enacted. It starts with a speech.

If it passes the Senate (with the help of moderate democrats), then the economy can begin a recovery. If the democrats block it in the Senate, it will make a great campaign issue for the GOP. The dems will be griping about "corporate corruption", while the GOP is advancing an agenda to revive the economy. The GOP will likely win the Senate as a result, AND they will have a mandate to pass the tax cut.

[Mulder]

Considerig the scenario above, what do you think is the best strategy for the Bush adminstration to combat the likely book-cooking revelations, and to bolster consumer confidence? A tax cut would be nice, but that simply won't help a consumer's perception of the market or the economy.

See my posts in #37 and #43 for the economic/political side of it.

The "corporate coruption" side of things is stickier (not in theory; only implementation). It requires starting from the following two premises:

1) One of the few legitimate purposes of government is to ensure that fraudulent business practices are prosecuted, therby insuring a free marketplace wherby consumers and investors can make informed choices that are in their best interest.

2) As corrupt as corporate America is, it pales in comparison to the corruption in the government.

Based on that, the gov't should aggressively prosecute those engaging in fraud both outside the gov't and within. Make a list of everything that is a federal crime (or covered by a regulation), and cross off those laws/regulations which are unconstitutional (such as gun laws), those which the states could handle better, those which are simply too complicated for anyone to understand, and those which just don't make sense.

"Interstate fraud" would be one of the few items left on that list. Take the massive federal bureaucracy, reduce it by 80%, and have the remaining 20% enforce the fraud statutes.

Cleaning up gov't corruption is more difficult, and it starts with the gov't coming clean about OKC, TWA 800, etc.... ; and making their agents accountable for their actions.

[The_Media_never_lie]

Eliminate The Capital Gains Tax.

What are capital gains?

[Uncle Bill]

Ouch! Investors Lost $2.4 Trillion in '02

Rich lost $2.6 trillion in financial markets in '01

Networth of households dropped by a whopping $4 trillion

2001 Laws Approached $1 Trillion in Cost

US Set For $1 Trillion Of Internet Writeoffs

Bankruptcies rise to record level, indication that consumers kept spending in recession

Bankruptcies Soar - Breaking Records/Grim and Bear It

White House Says It Expects Deficit to Hit $165 Billion

Feudalism: You have two cows. Your lord takes some of the milk.

Fascism: You have two cows. The government takes both, hires you to take care of them and sells you the milk.

Communism: You have two cows. You must take care of them, but the government takes all the milk.

Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull. Your herd multiplies, and the economy grows. You sell them and retire on the income.

Enron Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell three of them to your publicly listed company, using letters of credit opened by your brother-in-law at the bank, then execute a debt-equity swap with an associated general offer so that you get all four cows back, with a tax exemption for five cows. The milk rights of the six cows are transferred through an intermediary to a Cayman Island company secretly owned by the majority shareholder who sells the rights to all seven cows back to your listed company. The Enron annual report says the company owns eight cows, with an option on one more.

How Big Is the Government's Debt? "When these obligations are combined with the debt held by the public, the total burden equals $33.1 trillion, or 10 times the official debt measure. This "total debt" is more than three times the size of the nation's total output in 2001, and amounts to $116,381 for every man, woman and child in America."

American coup d'état: Joseph Farah bounces Federal Reserves' bogus check

THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM: A FATAL PARASITE ON THE AMERICAN BODY POLITIC

"If the American People ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property, until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied. The issuing of money should be taken from the banks and restored to Congress and the people to whom it belongs."
Thomas Jefferson

O'Reilly Tearing up The Fed

.

THE MOB ON WALL STREET

"The burden of debt is as destructive to freedom as subjugation by conquest."
Benjamin Franklin

SECRETS OF THE FEDERAL RESERVE
On September 30, 1941, before the same Committee, Governor Eccles was asked by Representative Patman:

"How did you get the money to buy those two billion dollars worth of Government securities in 1933?

ECCLES: We created it.

MR. PATMAN: Out of what?

ECCLES: Out of the right to issue credit money.

MR. PATMAN: And there is nothing behind it, is there, except our Government’s credit?

ECCLES: That is what our money system is. If there were no debts in our money system, there wouldn’t be any money."

On June 17, 1942, Governor Eccles was interrogated by Mr. Dewey.

ECCLES: "I mean the Federal Reserve, when it carries out an open market operation, that is, if it purchases Government securities in the 167 open market, it puts new money into the hands of the banks which creates idle deposits.

DEWEY: There are no excess reserves to use for this purpose?

ECCLES: Whenever the Federal Reserve System buys Government securities in the open market, or buys them direct from the Treasury, either one, that is what it does.

DEWEY: What are you going to use to buy them with? You are going to create credit?

ECCLES: That is all we have ever done. That is the way the Federal Reserve System operates.

The Federal Reserve System creates money. It is a bank of issue."

At the House Hearing of 1947, Mr. Kolburn asked Mr. Eccles:

"What do you mean by monetization of the public debt?

ECCLES: I mean the bank creating money by the purchase of Government securities. All is created by debt--either private or public debt.

FLETCHER: Chairman Eccles, when do you think there is a possibility of returning to a free and open market, instead of this pegged and artificially controlled financial market we now have?

ECCLES: Never. Not in your lifetime or mine."

The Declining Dollar

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How Big Is the Government's Debt?
"When these obligations are combined with the debt held by the public, the total burden equals $33.1 trillion, or 10 times the official debt measure. This "total debt" is more than three times the size of the nation's total output in 2001, and amounts to $116,381 for every man, woman and child in America."

"With the decline of society begins, indeed, the bellum omnium in omnia war of all against all, which some philosophers observing to be so general in this world, have mistaken it for the natural, instead of the abusive state of man. And the fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follows that, and in its train wretchedness and oppression."
Thomas Jefferson to Samuel Kercheval, 1816. ME 15:40

Return of the 'Audits From Hell'

Former Critics of IRS in Congress Now Clamor for Tough Enforcement
Sen. Charles Grassley, Chairman, Senate Finance Committee:

Oct. 1, 1997:

• "The management culture at the IRS has led to institutional arrogance and abuse of taxpayers. Substantial changes must be made to eliminate the 'we-versus-them' mentality at the agency."

March 25, 2002:

• "I'm amazed at the creativity of those who like being Americans but dislike their American tax obligation. Since tax cheats are endlessly creative, the IRS has to be just as creative to catch the crooks."

7 Years Of Hell At Hands Of IRS

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Uncle Sam's Audit Gap

Government Fails Fiscal-Fitness Test

U.S. Federal Government Accounting Methods

$3,400,000,000,000(Trillion) of Taxpayers' Money Is Missing

The War on Waste - Rumsfeld Says 2.3 Trillion Dollars Missing

1.1 Trillion Dollars Missing At Defense Department

HUD Missing 59 Billion

Billions Lost By Feds

Cooking The Books At The Department Of Education

Looking For More Crooked Books? Try U.S. Government

America's Biggest Crook - Uncle Sam

No Criticism Please, We're Bureaucrats

Forget Enron - Congress Is Even Worse

Corporate Responsibility: Federal Thieves Dislike Enron Competition

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Deputy Attorney General Larry Thompson - Bush's top corporate-crime fighter paid $400 million to settle fraud charges

Bush Pushes Prison For Corporate Scammers

"We've had too many cases of people abusing their responsibilities, and people just need to know that the SEC [Securities and Exchange Commission] is on it, our government is on it," - George W. Bush

[Uncle Bill]

Bush Says Economy May Be Against Him
"They keep saying we're going to have a tough time winning because the Dow Jones industrial average is high. But that doesn't lift the spirit of America. It shouldn't obscure the fact that some kids can't read in our society."..."The Dow Jones average should not obscure the fact that failed schools can create two societies. There are issues other than the economy,"

You want a coke?

[Jackie]

What are capital gains?

They are something that lots of people are not going to have to worry about for sometime to come.

[Jackie]

W should never speak without prepared notes.

[montag813]

I hope he is successful is "rallying" Joe Investor to snatch up stocks so that the Casino Bosses (Goldman, Morgan, Merrill et al) can continue to unload overvalued inventory in their sorry ass laps. I am more than happy to profit from the investing public's stupidity.

Don't listen to Bush or anyone else. Cash is King. Let the market complete the correction without you and your family's money on the line.

[montag813]

Eliminate The Capital Gains Tax.

I think most people would rather see an increase in the absurd $3,000 limit on capital losses which can be taken against income. I know dozens of people carrying forward over $100,000 in losses from 2001, yet still must pay taxes if they make money on anything else but the market.

[Arleigh]

Post #18 is right on the money. Everyone reading this message should go back and read Shrinkermd's post again!

[Arleigh]

President Bush is planning a major economic speech on Monday to restore investor confidence...

Time to short the QQQ's!!! If Jorge makes too big a deal about the current situation, it will REALLY spook the ignorati who've plunked their life savings into stupid investments they were too dumb/lazy to try to understand. Up until now, the sheeple have been calming themselves by chanting the buy-and-hold mantra, "In the long run, stocks only go up. In the long run, stocks only go up. In the long run, stocks only go up." Once they realize that the long run can be measured in DECADES we'll see some REAL selling.

[olliemb]

Other than he is commander in chief--explain to me why it is that all this mess with the crooked CEOs/corporations and funny bookeeping is Bush's fault. Does anyone know how long the CEO/corporate accounting in question has been going on ? A Ponzi scheme like Enron takes a while to finally unravel. With the new kids (SEC) on the block investigating a lot of what has been happening could these accounting messes have happened years on back? Or are they just of this year (as if the corporate world said, yeah,Bush is in town and now we can cheat)? Could it be a bunch of crooks taking advantage of loopholes in the system and they went beyond the pale and now have gotten caught?

When the companies have to announce new revised statements why are they doing it? Is it b/c they are honest and found a mistake or was it that the SEC caught them and told them to revisit their accounting statements?

Anyone out there with knowledge and facts not just their predisposed ideas that can answer these honest questions?

[TruthNtegrity]

Eliminate the Capital Gains Tax.

I've been saying this for years.

I noticed that Larry Kudlow brought this up the other night - the first time in a long time I've heard him suggest this. I have so much carryforward, it's ridiculous.

Now, losses are going to be the bain of most investors existence, when they get around to doing those taxes with all the sales they've been doing. I'm hoping that the chorus of voices will convince Bush to push for cutting the Capital Gains tax - like eliminating it.

[olliemb]

Yes, congress does take a long time to get a bill out and they add so many porkers and ludicrous money handouts. But if the president is waiting for his bill to help stimulate the economy ( for instance) and more unreasonable bills get put in then if he vetos, the economic stimulus is at a stalemate.

No, no one ever holds congress responsible for going over the budget. President Bush is still waiting for bills that the house passed and the senate is still on hold with them.

I do not hold the president responsible for the actions of the crooked corporations. I do expect him to clean house and I agree with those here the sooner the better.

We have all known for many years that the corporations and the wealthy have loopholes in the law that lets them pay no taxes or fudge with the numbers. I hold responsible whoever oversees these corporations--if this is the SEC then does the SEC oversee every year or when?

If I come into office in 2001 and the corporations are doing their thing, at what time was their malfeasance taking place--in the prior administration (and I am not looking to fault Clinton) but I want to know were these corrupt companies doing this for a long time or did they just start or did finally someone just catch them.

Anyone know the true story?

[olliemb]

I have kept my money in and next week will meet with my broker and start buying some more. I think we all owe it to the country to venture forth and buy stock and bolster the economy.

[The Duke]

If Bush *REALLY* wants to give a speech to bolster the
markets then he should, in that speech, direct his own
fund managers to invest heavily.

Anything short of that is blowing the proverbial smoke.

[Huck]

Other than he is commander in chief--explain to me why it is that all this mess with the crooked CEOs/corporations and funny bookeeping is Bush's fault.

I don't believe it's his fault, olliemb. Not only that, I don't know what people within 5 years of retirement were doing with ANY money in stocks. I know I am ultra-conservative when it comes to investments, but I hope when I'm 50 I am all into bonds (hell, I am all into bonds right now.) But the President gave a speech. The President is expected to respond. I was simply expressing my subjective reaction to his speechifying and proposals on this subject. As far as I can tell, the perps are all free. The President has done what politicians normally do: recommended stiffer penalties for the next guy, and commisioned a new task force. As I said, it's just my subjective reaction; I admit that; but it seems weak. What could he have done? Rhetorically, it would have helped for him to name names: Ken Lay, Gary Winnick, Joe Perrone, etc. It would have helped for him to promise to go after these guys like he promised to go after Al Quiada.

[Huck]

I think we all owe it to the country to venture forth and buy stock and bolster the economy.

You can't be serious. Do you owe it to your country to lose your shirt?