Men filming ferry ride raise suspicion [Tacoma, WA]

tribnet.com ^ | July 7, 2002

[TomGuy]

Men filming ferry ride raise suspicion

The Associated Press

State ferry officials have told the U.S. Coast Guard and the Washington State Patrol about two groups of men taking extensive videotapes on state ferries in the past 10 days.

Four men who appeared to be of Middle Eastern descent were videotaping, taking notes and talking on cellphones during two round trips June 24 on the ferry Spokane between Edmonds and Kingston, said Susan Harris of the Washington State Ferries.

"They seemed to be filming more of the interior of the cabin rather than the normal tourist filming, which is always the exterior," she said.

They became agitated when told to leave the vessel at each terminal as required, she said. The captain went home and decided to report the incident the next day.

On July 3, a different group of men appearing to be of Middle Eastern descent took extensive videotapes on the ferry Tacoma between Bainbridge and Seattle, she said.

"They were filming all over the place" even before boarding the ferry, and some observers said they were just tourists, she said.

She said no terrorist incidents have occurred on the ferries.

"There's no proof that there's anything to be concerned about; it's just that we're on heightened alert," she said.

Chief Warrant Officer Ray Cain with the Coast Guard said the incidents have been reported to the State Patrol, which handles law enforcement on the ferries, because they are considered part of the highway system.

"They were notified and they would investigate, trying to identify any such individuals," Cain said.

State Patrol officials were not available for comment late Friday.

(Published 12:30AM, July 6th, 2002)

[Don Joe]

"There's no proof that there's anything to be concerned about"

Yeah right. It's not like the house is a raging inferno, after all. It's just a bunch of smouldering fires in the wastebaskets and window curtains. Nothing to break a sweat over. If it develops into anything serious, deal with it then. But for heavens sake don't do anything that might offend the guy with the matches.

[martin_fierro]

Somebody oughtta film these groups filming. <|:)~

[cardinal4]

SEA has been targeted before. These guys just sound suspicious.

[elfman2]

They're screwing with us (or spending off their own money.) Taking out a ferry or bridge is way too difficult. The force required for that could better be used on a public event to kill or on a multitude of power lines to disrupt. Those tapes won't have much value.

They're in total disarray if they're resorting to this.

[per loin]

Yes. With the tiny digital cameras now available, it's easy to carry one at all times. If you see an Arab doing anything at all suspicious, photograph him/her. If you've Arab neighbors, photograph those who come and go at their homes. Write down license numbers of their visitors. Keep track of their comings and goings. Be alert. America is at war, and many of the enemy are living among us.

[TomGuy]

Taking out a ferry or bridge is way too difficult

Thinking back a few weeks--taking out the I-40 bridge in eastern Oklahoma wasn't real difficult. Of course, that one seems to be an accident, but still has a lot of unanswered questions. Like,

Why didn't a crew of 6 notice the tug being way off course (outside the shipping channel) for 20+ minutes before the impact?

[One I'd ask is--Has anyone checked the tugboat's captain/crew to see if any of them had a recent significant increase of wealth in their bank accounts.]

[livius]

A group of Middle Eastern men were also seen videotaping ferries in San Francisco Bay a couple of weeks ago. Their behavior was almost identical to that mentioned in this article about Seattle. The captain and crew in SF reported it, too, but too late for the men to be found by law enforcement.

[elfman2]

" Why didn't a crew of 6 notice the tug being way off course "

I have a hard time imagining America "terrorized" by hijacked tugboats.

[TomGuy]

Yes. With the tiny digital cameras now available, it's easy to carry one at all times. If you see an Arab doing anything at all suspicious, photograph him/her. If you've Arab neighbors, photograph those who come and go at their homes. Write down license numbers of their visitors. Keep track of their comings and goings. Be alert. America is at war, and many of the enemy are living among us.

A couple of days ago, someone posted this new technology at Radio Shack. Of course, these should only be used to view and record terrorist activities and not be used to peer into the neighbor's bedroom during shower time and click images.

Meade "CaptureView" Integrated Binocular & Digital Camera

$99.99 Reg. Price Brand: Meade Instruments Cat.#: 63-1146 Model: 63-1146
(Pricing and Availability may vary outside the contiguous 48 United States.)

The perfect gadget for the outdoorsman!

This combination binoculars and digital camera is great for sporting events, concerts and wildlife activities such as hunting or bird-watching. Whatever you see in the 8X magnified view of the binoculars, can be photographed in an easy-to-share digital format.

[Movemout]

Barge work is infinitely boring. You go up the river, you go down the river. Twenty minutes is a second in their lives. They are union guys who get a day off with pay for every day they work. They get paid and they party or go home to their families. The "Captain" passed out for whatever reason and the crew didn't respond appropriately. SNAFU is the term of the day. But your point that it is not that difficult to take out a bridge is right on. In Chaos Theory it is said that a butterfly flapping its wings in Houston may cause a hurricane in a far land. So who knows what the introduction of terrorism in the US of A might result in? I would hope it might be the demise of lots of bad guys but like I asked, Who Knows?

[elfman2]

The more I think about it, I see this as what you do when your leaders are in hiding, recruitment's near zero, your cause is hopeless and you still have several million dollars to spend.

[TomGuy]

I have a hard time imagining America "terrorized" by hijacked tugboats.

This war is a war to destroy the economy and infrastructure. The targets will not be normal military war targets. The targets will be those things that can cause disruption to the economy, cost dollars and lives, etc. [Think outside the box.]

[2sheep]

STD reported on another thread tonight that the Muslims are sending their families home to the M.E., presumably to get them out of harm's way.  Now THAT should be a concern.

[twntaipan]

It sounds to me like they are filming the interiors for purposes of building a mock up of the vessel. That could be used for preparing a hi-jacking of a ferry and killing the passengers. Muslim terrorists have hit ships and boats before (in the middle east) because they are relatively defenseless.

[per loin]

Taking out a ferry or bridge is way too difficult

Taking over a ferry on the Seattle-Bremerton run is an excellent method for taking out one of our aircraft carriers. The Bremerton Naval Shipyards are just a short distance from the Bremerton Ferry Dock.

Terrorists could load a semi with a huge truck bomb. By timing their arrival at the Seattle Ferry Terminal, they could assure that they would be loaded to the front of the ferry, and semis are loaded in the center lanes of the ferry. As neither individuals or vehicles are searched when boarding the ferry, it would be no problem to put heavily armed terrorists on board. If they seized control of the ferry as it neared Bremerton, they could steer it down the inlet to where the carriers dock. The carrier would have insufficient time to react, and would not likely fire on a ferry full of passengers anyway. A semi-sized truck bomb, exploded as the ferry rammed the carrier might not sink it, but would certainly damage it, and would be the type coup that al Queda loves.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Taking out a ferry or bridge is way too difficult."

Well, taking out a bridge "is" way too difficult--but taking out a ferry is as simple as driving a van or several car-trunks full of explosives on board and setting them off. I'm sure it is possible to disguise sufficient explosive material so as to not be detectable in a cursory search.

[TomGuy]

A ferry filled with people would make for an ideal hostage situation. Just think, they capture a ferry, threaten to kill off passengers one at a time, one every hour until The Blind Shiek is released. [They are suicidal anyway, so if they run out of passengers to kill and they end up dead themselves, they have managed to "take" a number of dead with them.]

Potential senerios of disruption and threat are numerous and endless.

[per loin]

Excellent. Only problem is that Radio Shack does not open for several hours.

[TomGuy]

Only problem is that Radio Shack does not open for several hours.

Well, you'll just have to tackle all the local terrorists and sit on them until Radio Shack opens. LOL

[STD]

Good Stuff! You can film the Muslim terrorists and give the image to the FBI. Maybe after you empty your Glock in the pagan!

[Don Myers]

"STD reported on another thread tonight that the Muslims are sending their families home to the M.E., presumably to get them out of harm's way. Now THAT should be a concern."

That is like jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

[TomGuy]

STD reported on another thread tonight that the Muslims are sending their families home to the M.E., presumably to get them out of harm's way.

Do you have a link for this?

The LAX murderer's family returned to Egypt about a week before he "went crazy" and "acted alone."

[nicmarlo]

America is at war, and many of the enemy are living among us.

Agreed. I don't care if taking their pictures of them taking pictures/filming hurts their feeeeeeelings.

[elfman2]

"The targets will not be normal military war targets. The targets will be those things that can cause disruption to the economy, cost dollars and lives, etc. [Think outside the box.] "

What do you think's meant by public events and power lines? The "in the box thinking" involves dropping bridges and sinking ferries. Very WWII'ish. Too much effort required for too little return. It would take 100 of them to compare to 911.

These guys are toast, and people just don't recognize it yet, perhaps not even them. As long as we keep reasonably alert and keep the pressure up on their funding and eliminate their shelters, they're the walking dead. People are looking backwards. I've seen it before.

[elfman2]

"A semi-sized truck bomb, exploded as the ferry rammed the carrier might not sink it, but would certainly damage it, and would be the type coup that al Queda loves."

Sounds to me like a waste of a good bomb, but I guess it's possible.

[elfman2]

"but taking out a ferry is as simple as driving a van or several car-trunks full of explosives on board and setting them off."

Perhaps, It depends on a lot of things.

[per loin]

Compared to a semi, the bomb that disabled the Cole was tiny.

[BullDog108]

Excellent idea! Thanx for the tip.

http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=&product%5Fid=63%2D1146 Meade 'CaptureView' Integrated Binocular & Digital Camera can be purchased on-line.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Perhaps, It depends on a lot of things."

Note, that by "taking out", I am NOT implying that the ferry be sunk. Even a small explosion on the car deck of a ferry will cause severe damage, kill a significant number of people, and generate a lot of "terror" footage (news coverage). Of course, a bigger explosion will do more of the above.

[anniegetyourgun]

While I agree, I'm still not convinced such an action would be the devastating hit that they are hoping for in this country. But then, I'm not sure we will see the likes of 9/11 again - unless they are able to significantly hit a dam or nuke plant. At this point these folks appear to be incompetent....thank God.

[per loin]

Incompetent? How many FBI agents have they tied up by activating one limo driver with a pistol?

[elfman2]

"Compared to a semi, the bomb that disabled the Cole was tiny."

Do you know what kind of explosive was used on the Cole and how close it got? I hope if they're able to reproduce it here, they'll spend it on an attempt to get that semi that close to a docked carrier.

[GretchenEE]

I saw a much harder-hitting report on KIRO 7 TV news last night. They didn't use hedging words, such as "appeared to be of Middle Eastern descent," they came right out quoting the sources as saying the men were Middle Eastern, etc. This article is awash in mitigations that represent the pre-9/11 mentality in the US.

The article fails to mention some of the most key points I saw on the news, such as one of the men drove away in a car that had NO license plates.

I must say I sense a need for our local authorities to get themselves folded into some heavy-duty info exchanges, investigations, and action plans with the feds on this.

[elfman2]

"Even a small explosion on the car deck of a ferry will cause severe damage, kill a significant number of people, and generate a lot of "terror" footage (news coverage). "

Yep. Even filming a ferry generates a lot of terror if you let it.

[RaceBannon]

Death of a thousand cuts. Hit them at airline counters, parks, ferries (Because victims cannot escape while you shoot at them), airplanes, buses, inside buildings...

[GretchenEE]

FYI

[TADSLOS]

They became agitated when told to leave the vessel at each terminal as required, she said. The captain went home and decided to report the incident the next day.

Why did the captain wait? He should have notified the Coast Guard and State Patrol of the incident as it was occurring and intercepted these guys when they docked. This is another example of the PC anasthesia that's gripping this country.

There's no proof that there's anything to be concerned about; it's just that we're on heightened alert,"

Repeat after me...9-11, 9-11, 9-11

[twntaipan]

When I lived in South Africa and travelled to Zimbabwe in the early 80s you could see the concern about economic disruption in both countries--primarily by how heavily they guarded electrical substations, as well as fuel depots. Ours are woefully defenseless.

[per loin]

As memory has it, they used C-4 at contact range, or very near that.

As for getting close to an aircraft carrier, are you familiar with how close the ferry dock is to the shipyards, or how often the Washington State Ferries have mechanical or personel problems that put the ferries where thay ought not be? I'd expect any terrorist worth his salt would have the sense to fake steering problems, and possibly generate some onboard fire or smoke. How quickly do you figure a carrier, or its protectors would fire on a disabled ferry, loaded with passengers, coming up the inlet?

[Abogado]

A boat much smaller than a Ferry did some serious damage to the USS Cole... Consider, who would suspect a Ferry in a populated harbor?

[TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig]

Hey, if you light 5 or 6 fires at different vital spots at once. Pandemonium breaks out and the ferry is on fire so much it can't pull in to the pier. Up here in Edmonds There aint no fire tug like in Seattle, as if when the ferry tug arrived 45 mins. later it would matter.

[cgbg]

I have a hard time imagining America "terrorized" by hijacked tugboats

How about if the bad guys drove a small truck with a dirty radioactive bomb in back on to a ferry with a destination of Seattle or San Francisco harbor?

Does that help your imagination?

[GretchenEE]

Death of a thousand cuts. Hit them at airline counters, parks, ferries (Because victims cannot escape while you shoot at them), airplanes, buses, inside buildings...

Bingo bingo bingo and I wish all of America would wake up to this scenario because it is obviously what terrorists do and if we don't plug the little holes, they succeed. They succeed in creatig chaos, fear, stalling our economy or worse, and taking over our lives and country the way an interior parasite does, until the host is so vitiated it cannot fight back.

[isthisnickcool]

AT THE LOCAL TACOMA MOSQUE:

IMAM MOHAMMAD MOHAMMAD: We must never kill innocents. And never kill Jews! No more bombings. I condemn the 9/11 attacks! Let us take the Christian values and be like them. Love and peace. And let's just have fun and take a few ferry rides!

/sarcasm off

[2sheep]

U.S. to Vaccinate 500,000 Workers Against Smallpox ~  32 & 33

[2sheep]

> That is like jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

Prophets have long been saying that an Arab coalition (with Russia and China) will attack America.  Jews in Israel have been told for several years by the Lord to "prepare for refugees from America."

[Wonder Warthog]

"How about if the bad guys drove a small truck with a dirty radioactive bomb in back on to a ferry with a destination of Seattle or San Francisco harbor?"

Bad scenario. Setting off a "dirty radioactive bomb" in a FERRY on the water is a great way to minimize the effects of the radioactivity. To make maximum use of a "dirty" bomb, it needs to be set off on land in a high-people-density area.

Setting it off on the water pretty much guarantees that much of the radioactive material will sink to the bottom of the harbor---water is GREAT radiation shielding material.

[elfman2]

"electrical substations, as well as fuel depots. Ours are woefully defenseless"

Electrical, exactly! Re post #5.

[cgbg]

Setting it off on the water pretty much guarantees that much of the radioactive material will sink to the bottom of the harbor---water is GREAT radiation shielding material

So they set it off when the ferry gets to port in the city. If the prevailing wind is from west to east...