Posted on 05/28/2018 11:14:22 AM PDT by Mariner
For any vet suffering from PTSD please look into the treatment offered free of charge by Emory
Your other points are spot on
“...92% of all vets support full legalization.”
Hogwash. With a result like that, one might want to look at how the questions were worded. Garbage in, garbage out.
And the docs are still prescribing benzodiazapines and prozac. And the vets are still drinking whiskey.
To control the symptoms.
For symptomatic relief in a crunch they are far better off smoking pot.
And yes, they need to stick with the program.
Rule #1 is avoid alcohol.
Rule #2 is avoid benzodiazapines.
BOTH of those make it worse as soon as they wear off...and keep making it worse with each additional application.
I’ve read good things about the eye movement therapy. My personal experience says the CBT is worthless. Though I did find the groups invaluable, like Seeking Safety.
But if somebody is drinking, nothing...nothing works.
I base my distrust in marijuana on teenagers I knew that started smoking and became mentally lazy, unmotivated, and drop out.
I am not sure what percent of kids have anti-motivational problems but not trivial.
Reactions to a drug is variable and close supervision necessary imho..
Personal belief is there are many types of PTSD, not one solution for all.
According to my Mom, my Dad - WW2 in P-47s, Korea in A-26s, killed in Vietnam - had nightmares for years. He’d be sweating, shaking, and she would wake him up. He never told her what the nightmares were about.
He also didn’t drink or use drugs. He married after WW2, raised 2 kids, rose to the rank of Colonel with a high school diploma. Like my uncle who went thru Omaha beach and the uncle who had 3 ships sink under him, he went on with life. NO drugs. All had an occasional beer, but I never saw them drunk. All raised good families.
I 100% believe PTSD happens and is real. I also 100% believe a LOT of folks are claiming it for the $$$.
Both statements sadly are very true.
“Learn more about The American Legion’s push for research into medical cannabis here.”
They have an agenda. I suspect their survey does as well.
FWIW, my Dad, his two brothers, myself, two of my kids and my SIL are all vets. None of us have ever been part of the American Legion. Two of my nieces are married to Marines with combat time. They aren’t members either.
VFW agrees with them.
The two largest vet groups in the nation.
http://connectingvets.com/articles/vfw-va-allowed-research-marijuana-heres-why-they-arent
True words all around
I found great relief from emergency and have recommended it to folks....be sure the practioners knows how to handle what they describe as complex PTSD cases otherwise they can screw the patient by going to fast
Agreed that booze and benes are bad news....doesn’t have a good outcome at all
Last comment is definitely true
There is a huge difference between supporting RESEARCH and supporting legalization. But then, no one in my family has ever joined the VFW either.
First, a large percentage of those who participated were not veterans. Second, there is no information given about how the participants were selected. It is similar to the Obama quoted “poll” that claimed that 97% of scientists agree that “global warming” is caused primarily by human activity. The actual poll was not a poll of scientists at all it was an interpretation of a small number of “scientific papers” selected by a “climate alarmist” advocate. It has been shown to be nonsense in every possible way.
The 92% cited in this survey is in response to the question, “Do you support research into medical cannabis?” There is no indication given that 92% of vets support “full legalization”.
It has been my repeated experience that marijuana advocates are the biggest liars and peddlers of extreme nonsense that show up on this forum. They resort to this because they almost all come from leftist “echo chamber” forums where no one challenges them.
Like most I started out believing it was mostly harmless. My distrust of marijuana and marijuana advocates is based on my observations of the scores and scores of people that I know and have known and family members who are users. This is not just teenagers but many older people as well.
We have one close 75 year old female friend who is a heavy user. She has been in so many car accidents relating directly to her abuse of marijuana that she has lost her drivers license on several occasions and now can't get affordable insurance. Interestingly enough despite being "stoned" during every one of her accidents, the police assumed her behavior and bad driving was from old age and not marijuana or drug use and never asked her for a blood sample. She lost her license on because of the frequency of her motor vehicle accidents. MY distrust is also based on 25 years of responding to medical calls. And it is also based my wife's experiences as a medical professional. Marijuana is very bad news. It causes all sorts of problems that are never ever mentioned in any of these forums.
One of the most notable non-mentioned problems is a breakdown of the vascular systems that has been noted by many physicians. Heavy marijuana users almost always develop varicose veins and other problems relating to weakened blood vessels. It is not known why but theorized that it has something to do with repeated dilation of blood vessels. It also causes issues with muscle and the lymph system. One would assume that this would be associated with an increase in the risk of stroke and aneurism and some studies have suggested this, but further research is needed.
Other serious issues are psychological and dependency problems which anyone who has ever known a heavy pot smoker can attest to. Most heavy users would rather have an arm or a leg chopped off as opposed to giving up marijuana. Yet they claim it is not addictive??? Ha, ha, ha!!! Do you find tobacco users, alcoholics, other drug addicts, or even people who eat too much junk food trying to convince others that what their vices are good for them? It is only marijuana users who do this and I think that it is the ultimate irony.
The survey that this thread is based on says only that 92% of those surveyed favor further research. I favor further research. Any substance that is abused as much by such a large number of people should be studied further so that its negative repercussions can be better documented... Because of that the potheads here would claim that even I am for "full legalization".
The sheer ignorance in your post “is astounding”. Most of us who grew up in the 1960s and 1970s (baby boomers) started out believing that marijuana was a benign substance. WE learned through our own experiences and observations that this was not the case. We saw many of our friends and family struggle with issues caused by their use of pot. But of course pot users do not want to hear about our observation and experiences.
Marijuana use is now so prevalent and so accepted that it should be studied. The problem is that the people who manage to get themselves in a position to conduct the studies tend to be advocates. This guarantees skewed results and results in weird issues like one of our local universities getting in trouble for handing out large quantities of free marijuana to student participants in one of their studies.
You do what you must.
“So many are suddenly acting like marijuana is some kind of miracle panacea.”
Marijuana is definitely not a panacea, but it is clearly useful. Some of the over the top advocacy for Marijuana could be unethical marketing, but a good bit seems to wishful thinking by users, or self-rationalizing their own use. Like most drugs, it is a mixed bag of upsides and downsides - useful for some things, but not good in many instances.
“I don’t believe it is conducive to promoting mental health.”
Balance is a key to mental health, and marijuana is specifically quite effective at countering specific excessive symptoms of PTSD (anxiety, hypervigilance/jumpiness, depression, sleep deprivation, possibly nightmares). Too much or too frequently though, and marijuana can tip the balance to the opposite extreme. Today’s concentrated extracts could enable an individual to take literally hundreds of doses per day (it they are rich, or in the business). We will probably see a few such human guinea pigs come to light over time with serious mental issues from massive overuse. Marijuana is good for some things, but it is not generally good for you. It is also not very bad in moderation.
“It’s really ludicrous to think it would be beneficial to get veterans hooked on an addictive substance that hampers their decision making.”
Anything that triggers a pleasurable response (dopamine) is likely to have some people overuse it. In that way, marijuana can be effectively addictive, and that is enough for many people to become habitual users (abusers) - but there is not a harsh withdrawal associated with chemical addiction. “I could quit anytime I want to - I just don’t want to”, is more the downfall with marijuana.
Chronic overuse of marijuana does produce detrimental changes to the brain, neurotransmitter levels and behavior. Those that allow doses and frequency to creep up over time, gradually become unmotivated “burnouts”.
The key is to cautiously use marijuana as a tool, always keeping an eye toward tapering off and minimizing dose - eventually using it only for occasional episodic relief, like only using aspirin when you have a headache.
Time heals all wounds they say, and over time PTSD definitely tends to subside on its own (somethings will stick with you, but less frequently, and less severely over time). Marijuana is fast acting relief, but you should seek to use it sparingly, to stay sharp and productive in the long run. Cycle off occasionally (e.g. 2 weeks off, every two months) to reset your natural dopamine levels, and gauge how recovery has progressed. Come back a little lighter.
Thank you very much for this sensible post. BeauBo.
Marijuana is definitely not a panacea, but it is clearly useful.
Maybe... Maybe not... but this has not been “clearly” demonstrated by scientific study. I have discussed this specific point over the years with many doctors and medical professionals and in my experience the vast majority do not seem to believe that its usefulness has been demonstrated for more than a handful of very specific circumstances.
Marijuana is specifically quite effective at countering specific excessive symptoms of PTSD (anxiety, hypervigilance/jumpiness, depression, sleep deprivation, possibly nightmares)
There may be some truth for some individuals in this statement, but it has not been proven in any type of "scientifically" conducted study. This is not a set of specific circumstances that has been described to me that marijuana is useful for. And I have been to many calls where marijuana use the cause of extreme anxiety and psychotic episodes.
“I could quit anytime I want to - I just don’t want to”, is more the downfall with marijuana.
This is what many claim, but I have personally seen many people who were a complete mess while attempting to give up marijuana. Given the success rate that I have witnessed... it appears to be much more difficult than giving up tobacco products. Anecdotally, I know scores of tobacco users who have given it up. I have known many heavy marijuana users who have told me repeatedly that they want to give it up, but I know very few heavy users who have successfully done it.
I responded to so many people over so many years who were having problems directly attributable to the substance that they believed was helping them. The most tragic were people who were long term smokers who were dying of CHF or other lung disease who were smoking when we arrived. Unlike most other responders my crew and I would often let them continue smoking until it was necessary to administer O2 if the smoking was helping to keep them calm.
Many if not the majority of people using meth would claim that they were taking it for "medical purposes". They claim that they are taking it relieve the symptoms of ADHD up to the point where their teeth are all falling out and they look like they are on deaths door. But you still hear them saying that they need it for their ADHD.
People addicted to opioids typically claim that they are taking it for medical reasons. They have chronic pain. They typically cannot tell you how the chronic pain started. People smoking marijuana also frequently claimed they were taking it as medicine. A few could even give you a symptom they were treating with if. But it was quite obvious that few of them were using it to treat anything and that marijuana was causing severe issues for many of them.
I do appreciate very much your attempt to have a rational discussion about this subject. Generally, anyone who has any reservations about the use of marijuana for medical purposes is called names and ridiculed by advocates. But you will have to forgive me if I am somewhat skeptical at this point in my life of people using illegal drugs and claiming that they are doing it for medical reasons. 99% of the time it is BS.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.