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Eliminate Israel, Eliminate Islamic Terrorism?-A look at Muslim logic and Western naivety.
Frontpagemagazine ^ | March 2, 2018 | Raymond Ibrahim

Posted on 03/05/2018 7:47:07 AM PST by SJackson

Raymond Ibrahim is a Shillman Fellow at the David Horowitz Freedom Center.

The plague of Islamic terrorism is based on “grievances” against Israel—so says Al Azhar, the world’s most prestigious madrasa (or Muslim “university”) that co-hosted Barrack Obama’s 2009 “A New Beginning” speech.  During a recently televised Egyptian interview, Ahmed Al Tayeb—Al Azhar’s grand imam, once named the “most influential Muslim in the world”—said:

I have noticed that they are always telling us that terrorism is Islamic. All those mouthpieces that croak—out of ignorance or because they were told to—that the Al-Azhar curricula are the cause of terrorism never talk about Israel, about Israel’s prisons, about the genocides perpetrated by the Zionist entity state….  If not for the abuse of the region by means of the Zionist entity, there would never have been any problem. The Middle East and the region would have progressed, and the Arab individual would have been like any other person in the world, enjoying a good life, or at least enjoying the right to live in peace.

There’s certainly much to comment on here.  First, Al Azhar has in fact been exposed time and time again teaching the same “anti-infidel” and supremacist doctrines that groups like the Islamic State rely on.  After being asked why Al Azhar, which is in the habit of denouncing secular thinkers as un-Islamic, refuses to denounce the Islamic State as un-Islamic, Sheikh Nasr, a scholar of Islamic law and graduate of Al Azhar, said:

It can’t [condemn the Islamic State as un-Islamic].  The Islamic State is a byproduct of Al Azhar’s programs.  So can Al Azhar denounce itself as un-Islamic?  Al Azhar says there must be a caliphate and that it is an obligation for the Muslim world [to establish it].  Al Azhar teaches the law of apostasy and killing the apostate.  Al Azhar is hostile towards religious minorities, and teaches things like not building churches, etc.  Al Azhar upholds the institution of jizya [extracting tribute from religious minorities].  Al Azhar teaches stoning people.  So can Al Azhar denounce itself as un-Islamic?

But what of Tayeb’s other point, that because Israel “abuses” Palestinians (meaning fellow Muslims), aggrieved Muslims around the world have had no choice but to turn to jihad/terrorism? This of course is another rehashing of the “Muslim grievance” myth popularized by al-Qaeda post 9/11.   Back in 2009, Bin Laden said:

You [Americans] should ask yourselves whether your security, your blood, your sons, your money, your jobs, your homes, your economy, and your reputation are more dear to you than the security and economy of the Israelis….  Let me say that we have declared many times, over more than two and a half decades, that the reason for our conflict with you is your support for your Israeli allies, who are occupying our land of Palestine [emphasis added].

Needless to say, this message was (and continues to be) swallowed hook line and sinker by many Western analysts—even as bin Laden was stressing to fellow Muslims (in Arabic) the “real reason for our conflict”:

Our talks with the infidel West and our conflict with them ultimately revolve around one issue — one that demands our total support, with power and determination, with one voice — and it is: Does Islam, or does it not, force people by the power of the sword to submit to its authority corporeally if not spiritually?  Yes. There are only three choices in Islam: [1] either willing submission [conversion]; [2] or payment of the jizya, through physical, though not spiritual, submission to the authority of Islam; [3] or the sword — for it is not right to let him [an infidel] live. The matter is summed up for every person alive: Either submit, or live under the suzerainty of Islam, or die. (The Al Qaeda Reader, p. 42)

More emboldened jihadis have of late dropped the façade.  In an article unambiguously titled, “Why We Hate You & Why We Fight You,” the Islamic State confessed that “We hate you, first and foremost, because you are disbelievers.”  As for any and all political “grievances,” these are “secondary” reasons for the jihad:

What’s important to understand here is that although some might argue that your foreign policies are the extent of what drives our hatred, this particular reason for hating you is secondary, hence the reason we addressed it at the end of the above list. […]  The fact is, even if you were to stop bombing us, imprisoning us, torturing us, vilifying us, and usurping our lands, we would continue to hate you because our primary reason for hating you will not cease to exist until you embrace Islam. Even if you were to pay jizyah and live under the authority of Islam in humiliation, we would continue to hate you [emphasis added].

This threefold choice, then—conversion, subjugation/jizya, or the sword—is the ultimate source of conflict between Islam and everyone else; it’s why prudent non-Muslims have always found the question of achieving permanent peace with the Islamic world an unsolvable problem. As professor of law James Lorimer (1818-90) wrote over a century ago:

So long as Islam endures, the reconciliation of its adherents, even with Jews and Christians [“People of the Book”], and still more with the rest of mankind, must continue to be an insoluble problem. … For an indefinite future, however reluctantly, we must confine our political recognition to the professors of those religions which … preach the doctrine of “live and let live” (The Institutes of the Law of Nations, p. 124).

In other words, political recognition—with all the attendant negotiations, diplomacy, and concessions that come with it—should be granted to all religions/civilizations except Islam, which does not reciprocate nor recognize the notion of “live and let live” (as evinced for example by the Koran’s commands for Muslims to “enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong” (e.g., 3:110)—that is, enforce Sharia upon earth).

Nor is Islamic supremacism confined to doctrines and scriptures that are “open to interpretation”; history makes an equally ironclad case.  As I document in my forthcoming book, Sword and Scimitar: Fourteen Centuries of War between Islam and the West, over the centuries and through countless jihads, Muslims invaded and eventually conquered some ¾ of all Christian lands; the scale of destruction and atrocities accompanying these jihads make Islamic State atrocities seem like child’s play. 

If Israel had nothing to do with all this—it did not even exist—are we really to believe that grievances against it are responsible for Al Azhar still teaching, and Muslims still upholding, the same doctrines that caused them to terrorize all non-Muslims for centuries? 

No, this is yet another case of Muslim apologists trying to kill two birds with one stone: portraying—and thus exonerating—their terroristic behavior as an inevitable product of “grievances” against a demonized Israel that deserves all the blame.   In reality, the ultimate “grievance” Muslims have against all non-Muslims is just that—that they are non-Muslim, inferior infidels that must be subjugated one way or the other.  


TOPICS: Editorial; Israel; War on Terror
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1 posted on 03/05/2018 7:47:07 AM PST by SJackson
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
Middle East and terrorism, occasional political and Jewish issues Ping List. High Volume

If you’d like to be on or off, please FR mail me.

..................

2 posted on 03/05/2018 7:47:40 AM PST by SJackson (The easiest way to find something lost around the house is to buy a replacement)
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To: SJackson

If Israel, *slam’s worst enemy, were to disappear, the m*zzies would still be on a daily killing rampage, inspired by the vicious, violent hatred of their cult of death.


3 posted on 03/05/2018 7:50:20 AM PST by I want the USA back (Liberalism is the denial of human nature. Liberals are insane. Liberals should be in strait jackets.)
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And then we can eliminate tooth decay by banning toothpaste


4 posted on 03/05/2018 7:52:42 AM PST by dsrtsage (For Leftists, World History starts every day at breakfast)
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To: SJackson

I always laugh when they say “genocide” by the Israelis.

If the Israelis wanted to practice genocide, there would not be an Arab left to complain about it.


5 posted on 03/05/2018 7:54:29 AM PST by wbarmy (I chose to be a sheepdog once I saw what happens to the sheep.)
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To: I want the USA back

I’ve always sort of wondered why the Israelis have never said to the Arabs at the UN, “Okay, we’ll give you everything that you want, but the minute one rocket lands in Israel, or one terror attack occurs, we’re driving you into the Sea.” The Muzzies can’t resist trying to kill Jews and the Israelis have cover to do what needs to be done.


6 posted on 03/05/2018 7:55:14 AM PST by TallahasseeConservative ( Isaiah 40:31)
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To: SJackson

Keep me on the list, thanks.


7 posted on 03/05/2018 8:10:35 AM PST by Rappini (Compromise has its place. It's called second.)
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To: wbarmy
There is a bill in Congress with bipartisan support to cut off aid to the ‘so called ‘Palestinians.

If this passes then the only ones giving them aid will be Iran. I think an Israeli Iranian conflict is just as likely as a NK-USA Conflict if not more so.

Destroy Iran's Air force, Isolate and starve their army and send them back into the rug making business for good.

8 posted on 03/05/2018 8:10:55 AM PST by wmileo
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To: SJackson

Give Muslims something, they’ll want more. It never stops because the goal of Sharia is worldwide.

If the Jews were removed they would want Christians out of Lebanon next. Then probably Greece back.

Better conflict than suicide.


9 posted on 03/05/2018 8:12:11 AM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: SJackson

Remember, under Sharia a “grievance” is you not being under Staria.


10 posted on 03/05/2018 8:13:02 AM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: SJackson

“First the Saturday people, then the Sunday people.”


11 posted on 03/05/2018 8:14:54 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: SJackson

“First the Saturday people, then the Sunday people.”


12 posted on 03/05/2018 8:14:55 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: SJackson
The problem isn't Israel, it's Islam and the tribal cultures who tend to latch on to it. How many conflicts around the world don't have an Islamic element as the driving force? Very few. Islam as an ideology must have an opponent. If one isn't apparent, a new grievance will be created.

Contrary to what one of our former Presidents stated, Islam means submission, not peace. Islam is all about submission. Of course, what Muslims would call submission, others would call oppression or persecution. Even if Islam were to achieve its goal of dominating all the governments of the world, peace would not follow. Islamic sect would fight Islamic sect with the same ferocity they now turn on the infidel. The whole world would turn into the type of place you see in the Islamic sh*tholes where Western influence is shunned.

13 posted on 03/05/2018 8:18:21 AM PST by CommerceComet (Hillary: A unique blend of arrogance, incompetence, and corruption.)
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To: SJackson

In southeast asia muslims attack Buddhists. In the Philippines they attack Christians. In fact, all over the muslim world they attack indigenous Christians, in Pakistan, Egypt, they’ve nearly wiped them out in Iraq and Syria...

I don’t think wiping out the Yazidis had anything to do with Israel. They are forever at war with Hindus. Sunni muslim slaughters Shia muslim, and where they are all of the same sect they slaughter one another. Several hundred thousands of muslims were killed by other muslims in Algeria just a few years ago.

Within a couple of years of Mohammed’s death they were marching into France, and it was not at all certain they would be stopped when they surrounded Vienna. They turned the Balkans red and only gave up power there in our grandfathers’ times... and haven’t entirely left. None of this had anything to do with Israel.

Muslims are at war where ever there are enough of them to make a war. Against non-muslims preferably, and against each other if that’s all there is. Its who and what they are.


14 posted on 03/05/2018 8:23:29 AM PST by marron
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To: SJackson

Submit or Die

It is the prime directive of Islam and has not changed since 622 A.D. when Mohammed unleashed his war against the rest of humanity.


15 posted on 03/05/2018 8:49:20 AM PST by Lurkinanloomin (Natural Born Citizen Means Born Here of Citizen Parents__Know Islam, No Peace-No Islam, Know Peace)
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To: I want the USA back

Anyone who doesn’t know this
Please gonthe prophetofdoom site and read the terrorism timeline and history of Islam
Jihadwatch is good for today’s terror totals
Still too many dhimmis


16 posted on 03/05/2018 10:06:20 AM PST by Truthoverpower (The guvmint you get is the Trump winning express !)
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To: SJackson

bkmk


17 posted on 03/05/2018 10:09:27 AM PST by Sergio (An object at rest cannot be stopped! - The Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight)
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To: TallahasseeConservative

Since one of things the Arabs want is the “right of return,” if the Israelis granted it, they would be swamped by Moslems and outvoted in their own tiny country.
They’d be voted out of existence in their own elections.


18 posted on 03/05/2018 11:23:02 AM PST by Little Ray (Freedom Before Security!)
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To: SJackson

I could easily counter argue that Israel is simply America’s proxy in the middle east. Muslims can’t whip the US so they whip the next closest thing. Modern Islamic jihadism is just as much formulated around general hatred for the West and the US. Sayyid Qutb clearly formulated his extremism from his 2 year visit in the US. He hated everything he saw.


19 posted on 03/05/2018 11:46:09 AM PST by Sam Gamgee
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To: Little Ray

Sort of like in America


20 posted on 03/05/2018 12:33:33 PM PST by chesley (What is life but a long dialog with imbeciles? - Pierre Ryckmans)
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