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To: mdmathis6
Since you do not wish to discuss rationally and since you do not seem to learn eagerly, I'm going to force feed you regarding this issue. The Bible is the guide, not my opinion, which I hold up to you:

"Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the(added by the translators) east to Jerusalem, . . ." (Mt. 2:1 AV)

"τουThe δεAnd ιησουJesus γεννηθεντος(he)was born ενin (locative) βηθλεεμBethlehem τηςof the ιουδαιαςJudaea ενin ημεραιςdays ηρωδουof Herod τουthe βασιλεωςking ιδουlook! μαγοιMagoi=wise men αποfrom ανατολωνAnatolia=the land east of Greece παρεγενοντοshowed up ειςinto ιεροσολυμαJerusalem" (Mt. 2:1 Textus Receptus, with my translation of each word superscripted).

The area of Anatolia was well known to all Greek speakers, and the confirmation of that is given here:


and here:

Asia Minor (click here)

This says:

"Assuwa is considered the Bronze Age origin for the name `Asia' as the Romans later designated the area. It was called, by the Greeks, “Anatolia” (literally, 'place of the rising sun’, for those lands to the east of Greece)."

You seem to think (or probably most rather likely have been led to believe, or merely guess) that the "wise men" came from somewhere to the east of Jerusalem, but you don't know where, and that they looking to the west, saw a miraculous star.

Others read the English read the KJV and others and assume that these wise men, looking in an easterly direction, saw in that direction a star that did not pass overhead during the night. However it got them to Jerusalem area from that supposition would be a great mystery, wouldn't it?

Of course, neither of these untutored assumptions are true. The residence and learning center of the Magoi was in Anatolia, to the north of Jerusalem, and their Star that symbolized a royal being appeared in their view to the south, in the direction of Israel, because such a star seen on the horizon would remain in pretty much the same place throughout the night. Actually, it will have been in the same direction for a thousand years, inching closer and closer to the horizon that generations of astronomers had been observing it. But now, in the fulness of time, it was about to disappear unless they traveled south far enough to observe it again.

And at that time of history, the star could be seen in Jerusalem. On going to Bethlehem, six miles almost directly south, the star would remain directly before them, though low on the horizon. Today, due to shift in the position of the Southern Cross more toward the axial direction of Earth's South pole, that constellation cannot be seen until one travels about a thousand miles more toward the Equator.

So wherever you see "East" in this passage, it is the commonly then known name of that locality now referred to as Turkey.

Let me call to attention to your opening sentence to which I am replying:

I don’t care...the fact is you don’t know the real mechanics and I don’t know the real mechanics of what the star was.

What you really have said is that if you do not know the real mechanics of what the star was (or who the Magoi were, or in what direction they saw the star), you absolutely have no basis, intellectual or spiritual, for arguing that I don't.

Another observation to be made from your screed is that you are so easily self-inflicted with the consequences of unsupported opinion that your arguments fail to be taken seriously.

The following link ought to help widen your horizons a bit:

Exploring the Famous Southern Cross Constellation (click here)

From this article, the following is of note:

Who saw it first?

It is believed that Amerigo Vespucci was the first European explorer to see the "Four Stars," as he called them, while on his third voyage in 1501. Yet, Crux was plainly visible everywhere in the United States some 5,000 years ago, as well as in ancient Greece and Babylonia.

According to the writings of Richard Hinckley Allen (1838-1908), an expert in stellar nomenclature, the Southern Cross was last seen on the horizon of Jerusalem around the time that Christ was crucified. But thanks to precession — an oscillating motion of the Earth's axis — the Cross ended up getting shifted out of view well to the south over the ensuing centuries.

60 posted on 12/31/2017 3:21:02 AM PST by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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To: imardmd1

Yeah I got all that already....

What you don’t want to accept ‘rationally’ is that you don’t know what the star was any more than I do! I can accept a more “rational” mechanistic view but you cannot accept that perhaps God did a more tactical supernatural work. You deny that God has any tactical intervening power other than what he may have set “strategically” or “providentially” in motion from the time of creation.

You will not address what the star “means” and what it meant to these gentile “magi”, astrologers, magicians, wisemen that so motivated them to check out what was going on when Jerusalem and Israel were blind to the times. I think the shock of gentile VIP Magi types showing up to worship a newborn jewish king while Herod reigned by treachery and murder got many talking and got the Satanic king plotting. It would appear Satan of old was also blindsided!

I remember reading of Hezekiah for whom God reversed the shadow of the sundial 10 degrees and of the Babylonian ambassadors sent to investigate the “great sign in the land”(how they suspected that Israel was the origin of it was another question). I remember reading of Joshua and how God lengthened the day and the sun and moon held place until Israel had won its battle. If God can tactically interfere in this it no great feat of God to create a supernatural beacon which guided rejoicing gentile Magi to worship a jewish young child, who is the living God in flesh?

61 posted on 12/31/2017 7:24:31 AM PST by mdmathis6 (Men and Devils can't out-"alinsksy" God! He knows where "all the bodies are buried!")
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