Ukraine: Police clash with protesters over Saakashvili

The Washington Compost ^ | December 7, 2017 | Nataliya Vasilyeva, Associated Presstitute

[Navy Patriot]

Supporters of Ukraine’s top opposition politician clashed Wednesday with police who tried to arrest him for a second time at a tent camp outside the parliament building in Kiev.

Ukrainian authorities accuse Mikheil Saakashvili, Georgia’s (fugitive) former president and now an anti-corruption crusader in Ukraine, of colluding with Ukrainian businessmen to topple (corrupt) President Petro Poroshenko.

Saakashvili said he will not turn himself in, though prosecutors were welcome to see him at the camp outside the Supreme Rada where about 100 supporters gathered.

[Navy Patriot]

Ukes continue to waste their lives fighting to support either of the two worst scumbag criminal Leftists that the Soros - EU Globalists could produce.

[mac_truck]

Ukraine is a profoundly broken country where mobs of thugs effectively compete with a corrupt unpopular government, while dual citizen oligarchs pull the strings.

No wonder the eastern half of the country wants no part of the fascist sh** show taking place in Kiev.

[SeeSharp]

Trying to emulate Tymoshenko. This was one of her favorite tactics. Maybe he’ll get a weird hairdo next.

[GoldenState_Rose]

Maybe the diva of Damascus, Saint Vladimir Putin, will save them! 😮 I just read a popular Russian nationalist blog following Putin's announcement to stay president until 2024. It's worth posting in English maybe...if only for people to realize woefully fragile Putin's actual pooularity is -- particular among the most nationalist-minded Russians --> Including those "holding the fort" in East Ukraine. Russia's veneer of "stability" will eventually lose cover. That's all I have to say. (And not just because of fed-up nationalists.)

[dfwgator]

I’ve always thought Putin’s position is more tenuous than people think.

[GoldenState_Rose]

Sorry typos: “how woefully fragile Putin’s actual popularity is” among Russian nationalists including those in East Ukraine.

[NorseViking]

That is actually a trademark tactic of petty Stalinist Saakashvili.

[NorseViking]

Fiddling on the Roof? Saakashvili’s Never-Say-Die Rabble Rousing Leads to Wild Scenes in Kiev
http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3611181/posts

Similar post.

[Navy Patriot]

“how woefully fragile Putin’s actual popularity is” among Russian nationalists including those in East Ukraine ...

I suppose we will see on March 18, unless, of course, Russia interferes in the Russian election.

[GoldenState_Rose]

No. March is too soon.

And please do not kid yourself into thinking “elections” in Russia work the way they do here! Aye, more on this topic later. Political repression is on steroids in the lead-up to March especially. Its way worse than hacking or whatever it is people are accusing them of doing here. But there still may be some scattered protests.

In the meantime you can watch what circus “opposition” candidate Ksenia Sobchak (former reality TV star, daughter of Putin’s ex mentor) advises Russians in her English interview with the BBC:

“Evolution, not Revolution for Russia...” so even she is doing Putin’s bidding in the open now. (As opposed to faking that she’s running an actual campagin.)

http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-42154546/ksenia-sobchak-evolution-not-revolution-for-russia

[Mariner]

What are the tactics Russia uses to fix an election?

All independent analysis I have encountered, and much of it not favorable to Putin, says their elections are free and open.

The Russians actually like the guy...by large majorities.

Please, nothing published in Ukraine. It’s universally garbage.

[WatchungEagle]

She’s right about that. Russia would not benefit from any kind of “revolution” right now.

[NorseViking]

Clinton brand. Before 1996 Russians were convinced that the Soviet elections were a sham and Americans would organize it and show them how to do it fair. Then Yeltsyn won reelection that year they were shocked asking their relatives, co-workers, friends and neighbors did they vote for a guy but couldn't find anyone who did. That was the day they understood that the Soviets were pikers in rigging the elections and Clinton's America are pros. That was the beginning of the end of American influence in Russia finished by Clinton's intervention in Kosovo.

[GoldenState_Rose]

“She’s right about that. Russia would not benefit from any kind of “revolution” right now.”

You’re right Eagle, but the idea that Russian can just “evolve” from the Putin set-up is a misnomer.

1) In another interview, K. Sobchak predicts:

“This is the time for cool heads and high-level negotiation with the Kremlin, says Ms Sobchak. The alternative – pressure from the streets for change – will lead to “civil war within six years”.

“Civil war within six years.” -> That’s just the reality of the situation on the ground right now. And Russians know it, but enough are willing to suck up their dissatisfaction in the name of stability. And those who are able, particularly young professionals, leave the country. (Not necessarily permanently.)

Come out here to Los Angeles if you want to be a stone’s throw away from meeting one of those.

2) I think the only real ray of hope for non-revolutionary change has to do with the slow, but steady gains opposition candidates have made in the seats of municipal governments. Particularly in Moscow. An opposition candidate may even pull off a win for mayor of Moscow next year.

In the meantime, these new (quite young!) officials gain experience in how to handle the day to day bread & butter issues for the constituents in their neighborhoods. The kind of localized governance culture foreign to Russians still.

3) And luckily, the protest spirit is high enough, that the Kremlin avoids blatant suppression of these newly minted local officials. So instead they resort to the following:

“Dmitry Orlov, a political strategist who sits on the Supreme Council of Putin’s party, United Russia, said the government understands the problem “a ring of hostile municipalities” poses for the Kremlin, and tries to neutralize it—either by cooperation or trying to split the opposition. “

4) This is a quote from one of the opposition candidates who gained a seat in his district back in October. He normally is a radical street-marcher, but has since changed his approach.

“It is easy to gather a group of passionate people and oust a dictator, but life doesn’t stop there, and you need to manage the country in a different way,” he said. In Yashin’s view, what he’s doing now might be more important than getting rid of Putin. “If there is no functional self-government, then—soon after revolution—you’ll need to make another revolution,” Yashin said.
“I want to show that even at this low level, we can achieve results,” he said.

Articles:

“Russian TV star challenging Putin for presidency says ‘there will be lots of blood’ if country changes too fast”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ksenia-sobchak-russia-campaign-trail-exclusive-interview-vladimir-putin-challenge-election-2018-a8030306.html

“Putin Has a Rebellion Brewing in His Backyard”
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-11-27/putin-and-united-russia-have-some-very-liberal-moscow-neighbors

[bar sin·is·ter]

Wow.. I thought Saakashvili was relegated to selling crappy ice cream treats and soft porn mags on the streets of Georgian village somewhere. Has McCain brainfarted a response yet?

[Mariner]

While I know the differences are considerable, I can’t help but think the Russian “opposition” sounds a LOT like the “Resist” movement in the US.

Again, every resource I have seen shows him very, very popular with the people.

Yes, there are POLITICAL factions that hate him. These people are usually motivated by the lure of power. But by and large, from what I can discern, the vast majority of the Russian people support him.

Hell, something like 40% would like to see a return to Soviet rule.

[GoldenState_Rose]

Mariner, you will see Trump MAGA caps at many of these protests. At the moment people who fall under the anti-Putin umbrella are everyone from Muslim regionalists to hyper-nationalists, to Saint Petersburg hipsters to Evangelical Christians.

The political culture in Russia is not very developed.

[GoldenState_Rose]

I honestly don’t understand the eagerness to embrace Putin. We are citizens of the country of George Washington, who time and time against REJECTED power and STEPPED DOWN. That alone should shape the prism of skepticism we view ANY authoritarian leader who stays in power for that long.

And the Russian mentality is complicated. It’s a very paternalistic culture!

They don’t have the same frames of reference we do and they have the trauma of history preventing them from putting up any real challenge to the status quo.

[Mariner]

“I honestly don’t understand the eagerness to embrace Putin. “

Nobody is embracing Putin. That’s a common diversion.

Putin is a murderer and authoritarian. By no means is he a “liberal” in the classical sense, nor cut from the same cloth as the founders of this republic.

But I see little evidence the majority of the Russian people would not vote for him again. Remember, most are not cosmopolitan professionals in Moscow or St Pete.

You know that better than I.

[Navy Patriot]

I thought Saakashvili was relegated to selling crappy ice cream treats and soft porn mags on the streets of Georgian village somewhere.

Last I heard Georgian Law Enforcement and a couple of prosecutors WOULD like to find Saakashvili on Georgian soil.