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Why ‘religious freedom’ laws are doomed
MSNBC ^ | February 28,2014 | Adam Serwer

Posted on 02/28/2014 11:20:39 AM PST by C19fan

By the time Arizona Republican Gov. Jan Brewer announced that she was vetoing SB 1062, a bill that would have made it easier for business owners to turn away gay and lesbian customers, the religious right had already lost.

......................................................

There’s no chance that LGBT rights activists will give up that fight. While religious conservatives see the issue of allowing people to act according to their conscience, gay rights supporters see them as essentially demanding state sanction of gays and lesbians as a semi-pariah class against whom discrimination is less objectionable than it is against people on the basis of race, religion, or sex. When racists raised religious objections to integrating their schools and stores, they were told they had to follow the same rules as everyone else–and LGBT rights activists don’t think this should be any different.

(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Arizona
KEYWORDS: discrimination; gay; marriage; religion
Unfortunately I agree with this piece. The LGBT side easily brings out the bloodt shirt of Jim Crow and the like. At least their side is now coming out of the closet, pun intended, and admitting it is not just about being able to marry and tolerance but removing all the stigma associated with their behavior and having society full acceptance and approval.
1 posted on 02/28/2014 11:20:39 AM PST by C19fan
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To: C19fan
Homosexuals are not semi-pariah, they are full blown pariah class.

When the US dollar is no longer the worlds reserve currency, you are going to see the end of the homosexual agenda. When people are starving, they will not care about pushing homosexual marriage.

2 posted on 02/28/2014 11:28:04 AM PST by Flavious_Maximus
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To: C19fan

Laws must be carefully written, but I do not think they are doomed.


3 posted on 02/28/2014 11:28:53 AM PST by SoFloFreeper
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To: SoFloFreeper

Why do we bother having a constitution at this point?


4 posted on 02/28/2014 11:31:41 AM PST by Phillyred
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To: C19fan
but removing all the stigma associated with their behavior and having society full acceptance and approval

It won't stop there either. The activists do not want equality. They want supremacy. They want affirmative action "to compensate for past discrimination". They will not rest until anything less than open rejoicing of their lifestyle send the offender to the gulag.

5 posted on 02/28/2014 11:33:28 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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It's February 28th

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6 posted on 02/28/2014 11:33:31 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (The Fed Gov is not one ring to rule them all)
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To: Flavious_Maximus

Like most of the BS from the left, the main goal of it all is to DEMORALIZE the traditional Right. Like terrorism, its goal is not to get the people to DO something, rather it seeks that they ‘give up’ the fight cower down and do NOTHING.
Once the ‘S’ does actually hit the fan, this will not end well—for them or us.
Lock and load, boys and girls—and keep yer powder dry.


7 posted on 02/28/2014 11:33:50 AM PST by Flintlock ( islam is a LIE, mohammed was a CRIMINAL, sharia is POISON.)
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To: Phillyred

As I understand the situation, a gay baker now could be compelled to bake a cake for a fellowship meeting of the Westboro Baptist Church.


8 posted on 02/28/2014 11:34:51 AM PST by bagman
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To: C19fan

Most people believe that the lifestyle is wrong and if they are Christians believe that it is God’s decision about the sin of another person. Not theirs.

Even secularists believe that it is wrong. Why?

Because EVERY ballot issue or amendment that has come up in an election, has won overwhelming support from voters against their lifestyle choice. Only to be invalidated by a judge somewhere.

Most people believe that it is wrong but when push comes to shove, won’t fight to overturn the decision.


9 posted on 02/28/2014 11:35:17 AM PST by dhs12345
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To: bagman

Yup. Goes both ways.

They could even have them write on the cake: “sodomites are evil and quote some bible verse.”


10 posted on 02/28/2014 11:36:31 AM PST by dhs12345
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To: C19fan

I have my doubts as to this being codified as a law.
I would have thought they first amendment would have
covered it. I’m just afraid it would have been used
by the Islamic advocacy groups against other Americans,
gay or straight or nonmuslim.


11 posted on 02/28/2014 11:37:20 AM PST by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: C19fan

Liberal ideas are doomed.

Liberals stall an airplane and think that pulling back on the stick will make it go up.

Liberals spend and borrow, and think more spending and borrowing will eliminate the debt.

Liberals abort (e.g. kill) babies and think that importing folks with different cultures and languages will make up for the lack of productivity.

Liberals major in underwater basket weaving and think they know all about energy and climate.

Liberals elect idiots with totally fabricated backgrounds and no experience to high offices and think that nothing bad will happen.

Liberals are slime and should be eliminated.

STAT.


12 posted on 02/28/2014 11:41:32 AM PST by Da Coyote
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To: C19fan

I just can’t wait to get the popcorn out the first time the Gays overreach and try to force a Muslim business to serve them and are are treated to “Fatwa’s” and death threats (and maybe more than just threats)...


13 posted on 02/28/2014 11:43:02 AM PST by apillar
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To: bagman

That is what the church needs to do or, bakers need to have a few errors in measuring their baking needs


14 posted on 02/28/2014 11:43:25 AM PST by edcoil (Realism is only a socially accepted for of pessimism)
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To: Phillyred
"Why do we bother having a constitution at this point?"

The constitution makes specific statements regarding freedom of religion.

So an alternate approach to these laws is to simply file civil rights lawsuits against governments and/or organizations that can be shown to promote, or tolerate discrimination or favorable treatment against Christian beliefs.
15 posted on 02/28/2014 11:45:37 AM PST by indthkr
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To: bagman
As I understand the situation, a gay baker now could be compelled to bake a cake for a fellowship meeting of the Westboro Baptist Church.

I just went to the ultra-leftist Westboro "liberal lawyer" site (it's not a church, Baptist or otherwise). Not a peep from those AlGore supporters about Arizona SB 1062.

Given the background of Democrat Fred Phelps and his numerous awards from far-left civil rights organizations, it's not at all surprising that they care not a whit about freedom and religious liberty. Phelps was all aboard with the Warren court's overreach of Brown vs. Board (argued by commie Thurgood Marshall with his silly baby doll props). That's why Phelps and his anti-military socialist gang are headquartered in their little compound in Topeka, Kansas.

There's no doubt at all that the leftist lawyers posing as a church are actually part of the homosexual thug squad. Their little drama shows of street theater are actually designed to advance the sodomite agenda.

16 posted on 02/28/2014 11:47:46 AM PST by re_nortex (DP - that's what I like about Texas)
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To: C19fan

I agree with you. I sadly, too, agree with this piece. Add that to the fact that America is racing Left, not Right, and there is nothing to “replace us”. America has had plenty of occasions to course correct and move Right. However, it has been quite the contrary. This is a battle lost ... and perhaps a war.


17 posted on 02/28/2014 11:48:20 AM PST by RIghtwardHo
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To: dhs12345

Actually, that is not true. Polls make it clear most people have no problem with it. Over the past few years, ballot measures are successful in moving the Gay agenda forward. What you say may have been true 10 years ago, or even 5, but it is no longer true at all.


18 posted on 02/28/2014 11:49:40 AM PST by RIghtwardHo
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To: C19fan

Blacks cannot hide their skin color; LGBT can. Comparing this to Jim Crow is liberal racism at its worst.


19 posted on 02/28/2014 11:50:47 AM PST by CincyRichieRich (Bloom right where you are.)
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To: C19fan

There’s a deeper reason. “Religious Freedom” laws should not be necessary because that freedom is already in the Constitution. Adding such a law implies there was no such freedom before the law was passed, and that sets a bad precedent.

What we have here is a series of bad court decisions, and writing new laws to address that only invites more bad decisions. This AZ law is a case in point. It would have been thrown out, leaving the perception there is no “Religious Freedom” protected in the Constitution.


20 posted on 02/28/2014 11:51:26 AM PST by Cyber Liberty (H.L. Mencken: "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.")
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To: C19fan

For a variety of reasons I think the Antichrist and the False Prophet will be none other than the Islamic Mahdi and Isa. If they’re consistent with Islamic teachings, homosexuals will have a very short life expectancy. They’ll likely go after them first, and them come after Christians.


21 posted on 02/28/2014 11:59:40 AM PST by afsnco
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To: Phillyred
Why do we bother having a constitution at this point?

Or as H.R.C. would put it: What difference at this point does it make?

22 posted on 02/28/2014 12:01:32 PM PST by mc5cents (Pray for America)
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To: afsnco
They’ll likely go after them first, and them come after Christians.

The Mohammedans will likely go after the Jews second. There are far fewer Jews than Christians, and Christians have been known to kick their a$$.

5.56mm

23 posted on 02/28/2014 12:03:18 PM PST by M Kehoe
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To: C19fan
Our constitutional rights, those actually written down and enshrined in the US Constitution, have been superseded by newly minted "Rights"
discovered floating around in the ether by liberal politicians and judges.

Eight died on that bridge at Concord, back in 1775. How many will it take this time?


24 posted on 02/28/2014 12:04:50 PM PST by Iron Munro (Albert Einstein: The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits)
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To: C19fan

What is doomed is freedom.


25 posted on 02/28/2014 12:06:01 PM PST by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: C19fan

precisely


26 posted on 02/28/2014 12:08:37 PM PST by Nifster
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To: RIghtwardHo
Polls make it clear most people have no problem with it.

Proof that the indoctrination, brain washing and bullying of youngsters in the government schools works !!!


27 posted on 02/28/2014 12:09:06 PM PST by Iron Munro (Albert Einstein: The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits)
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To: tet68

spot on


28 posted on 02/28/2014 12:09:55 PM PST by Nifster
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To: edcoil

Good point about the possibility of a baker doing a bit of creative sabotage to a forced gay cake. As a teacher, I used to tell the kids if I suspected them cheating: “Don’t mess with the guy who has the red pen.”


29 posted on 02/28/2014 12:33:11 PM PST by Migraine (Diversity is great -- until it happens to YOU..)
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To: C19fan

NONE OF THESE LAWS APPLY TO CHRISTIANS.

They apply to CORPORATIONS.

They are not rulings about religious rights. They are rulings about letting a corporation use a religious rights argument for particular discriminations.

The rulings state that:

1) Corporations have no rights; and

2) It is in the best interest of the State to let homosexual preference trump religious preference, and therefore as a legal agent of the interests of the State, the corporation’s request for a policy allowance is denied.

Liberals and Leftists know this game and work it to their advantage.
Muslims know this game and work it to their advantage.
So why don’t Christians at least let themselves ADMIT that this is the game, instead of wondering WTF is going on all the time?


30 posted on 02/28/2014 1:15:54 PM PST by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: C19fan

Yep. And the so called Republican Party sits with their hands folded as the cultural degenerates try to take Christianity away.


31 posted on 02/28/2014 1:17:59 PM PST by CountryClassSF
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To: C19fan

I will send money to Westboro Babtist Church to fund their adventures in to gay owned shops and insist they provide services.

Oh wait, that won’t be allowed. The liberal once way valve of intolerance is installed.


32 posted on 02/28/2014 1:36:43 PM PST by Organic Panic
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To: RIghtwardHo

Trying to think of an election where voters approved. Mostly judges and legislatures.

The tide may be turning though.


33 posted on 02/28/2014 1:53:07 PM PST by dhs12345
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To: Phillyred

So the WH toilet paper budget does not get too high.


34 posted on 02/28/2014 2:01:37 PM PST by lastchance ("Nisi credideritis, non intelligetis" St. Augustine)
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To: bagman

One could certainly hope that were the case (gay baker bring forced to bake for Westboro Church)..... but won’t happen, just like Christians being forced to pay for abortion drugs but Muslims don’t have to, it’s against their religion


35 posted on 02/28/2014 6:15:00 PM PST by zerosix (Native Sunflower)
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