Posted on 10/02/2013 2:46:20 AM PDT by SkyPilot
Pope Francis cranked up his charm offensive on the world outside the Vatican on Tuesday, saying in the second widely shared media interview in two weeks that each person “must choose to follow the good and fight evil as he conceives them” and calling efforts to convert people to Christianity “solemn nonsense.”
The Vatican’s head seemed intent on distancing himself from its power, saying church leaders “have often been narcissists” and “clericalism should not have anything to do with Christianity.”
The interview with atheist Italian journalist Eugenio Scalfari set off another round of debate about what the pope meant: Was he saying that people can make up their own minds, even if they disagree with church teachings? Or was this self-described “son of the church” just using casual language to describe classic church teaching about how people need to come to Catholic doctrine of their free will?
A top official with the Southern Baptist Convention, the largest Protestant denomination in the United States, took the unprecedented step of rebuking Francis, writing that the pope’s interview was “a theological wreck” and that Francis was dabbling dangerously in relativism.
“What these interviews seem continually to do is what evangelical theologian Carl Henry warned Protestants of in the 20th century, of severing the love of God from the holiness of God,” wrote the Rev. Russell Moore, a past dean of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary and head of the convention’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission. “We must speak with tenderness and gentleness, but with an authoritative word from God.”
Some conservative Catholics were also taken aback by the interview.
“My e-mail is filled with notes from people who need to be talked off the ledge,” wrote the Rev. John Zuhlsdorf, author of one of the more popular blogs for Catholic conservatives.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
I aim my epithets very carefully at the misuse of words and unless somehow you’re now doing “clarification” for the Pope “doublespeak” is just the right word.
Calling me a troll? I understand the tactic and it doesn’t work.
You have made up your mind that you are going to catch the Pope criticizing Jesus, and you aren’t going to let anything get in your way.
Ummmm...nope. Didn't come to mind, not my mind anyway. My criticism was solely about the misuse of the word “proselyte” and the attempt to make it a pejorative term.
And since you say, “You have made up your mind...” I'll point out that mind reading is not permitted.
“If you think the Cardinals pick the right man under the guidance of the Holy Spirit every time, then what about the times when the Papacy was bought and sold under simony? Were the Cardinals correct in taking bribes? Was the winning Cardinal who became Pope through simony the choice of the Holy Spirit??”
The obvious response is that the Holy Spirit isn’t involved at all, and that’s why the Papacy changes hands with perverts, murderers, psychopaths, and, today, by effeminate relativists with sympathy for communists who deny that salvation is through Christ alone, but is open to infidels so long as they “seek the good” according to their conscience.
““Proselytism” is disrespectful of people’s intellects.”
Outside of brain dead infidels who think that seeing a cross on the side of the road is an assault on their freedoms, no one of sound mind actually thinks like this.
So basically your Pope has conceded the fight to the infidels. But you’re wrong to claim, as you do without any evidence, that the Pope favors the same thing under another name.
When he responded to the infidel about conversion, the answer and all the follow up answers confirmed beyond any doubt that Francis isn’t holding anyone up to any particular truth. You need only “follow the Good’ according to the dictates of your conscience, because there is no “Catholic-God,” just a God who loves loves loves.
Your blasphemous, worthless Pope is preaching damnable sin and encouraging atheists to remain exactly what they are.
“It’s time to get Pope Benedict off the bench. Every time Francis opens his mouth, his words need to be clarified. Each person needs to discern what is evil on their own??? Sounds like moral relativism to me.”
If a person believes abortion is ok, I guess this Pope thinks it is okay. Cannibalism, polygamy, incest, etc. have been considered okay throughout history. It sounds like the Pope doesn’t think we should teach them any different. Its all okay as long as the person thinks it’s not evil.
Baloney. You portrayed the Pope as dissing Jesus, on the basis of the “fact” that “proselytizing” carries no negative connotations.
There is no “attempt” to make “proselytizing” a pejorative term. Rightly or wrongly, it has long been a pejorative term.
Here is an article by a man who holds that it should not be a pejorative term, but which documents that it has been for a long time. Your insistence that that is simply unheard of is idiosyncratic and perverse.
http://www.firstthings.com/article/2007/01/donrsquot-call-it-proselytism-16
“Your insistence that that is simply unheard of is idiosyncratic and perverse.”
Nope. I didn’t say anything about “unheard of” just that that as a pejorative it was wrong, s misuse of the language and appealed to a dictionary.
But I do like the use of words like, “idiosyncratic”.
Well said!
I think this Pope offers Christians a great example of why a church organization that is a centralized hierarchy is so bad. All it takes is one misguided leader and all those that think they are obligated to follow are led away from the truth.
Wet.....
But otherwise good.
Well, there's an example of wishful thinking if I ever saw it.
If the church isn't protected from the wrong man being elected pope, then it isn't protected from him making bad pronouncements.
Besides, the doctrines of the perpetual virginity of Mary, or the Real Presence, or other teachings were not always held by the church as being true. They were changed when the church made them official teachings.
One of the advantages of many different churches.
The very thing Catholics criticize Protestantism for, that of being many different denominations and no centralized authority, is one of its strengths for the very reason you mention.
It prevents massive deception on the scale of 1.2 billion, if memory serves me correctly on the number of Catholics that Catholics claim there are.
We are wet in Texas as well...with humidity though. Blech!
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