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Hagan demands review of NC voter law
thehill.com ^ | August 13, 2013 | Mario Trujillo

Posted on 08/13/2013 2:47:48 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe

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To: fieldmarshaldj; BillyBoy

Civil service now there is a “reform” that backfired. Chester Arthur’s folly. I’m with you 100% on that, the damn government worker unions and career bureaucrats are perhaps our biggest problem. They are all 100% loyal to the left and there’s not damn thing we can do cause they can’t be summarily canned.

The idea doesn’t seem to be on anyone’s radar.


81 posted on 08/14/2013 1:30:44 PM PDT by Impy (RED=COMMUNIST, NOT REPUBLICAN)
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To: Impy

Don’t get me wrong, I understand the reasoning behind it and the national impetus to push for it following Garfield’s assassination (although just because a job-seeking lone nutter did a heinous act shouldn’t have been the main motivating factor). What I’m not sure is how many could’ve envisioned that replacing patronage with what turned out to be armies of government bureaucrats whom are almost impossible to terminate.


82 posted on 08/14/2013 1:40:46 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: Impy; fieldmarshaldj
Fieldmarshaldj makes a good point that state senators basically are elected the same way, but none of these anti-17thers are making any effort to abolish their state senates, or have state Senators appointed to represent individual counties in their state. And THAT reform (at least, the latter one) would actually make sense if they REALLY wanted to get back to state legislatures the way the "founders" envisioned them and "restore our Republic". When the constitution was ratified in 1788, the founders would have never dreamed the Illinois state legislature would be gerrymandered so half the Illinois Senators were controlled by Chicago, regardless of whether their district was suburban-based. It would be an epic disaster to have 21st century legislatures, as they exist now, appointing U.S. Senators under 18th century laws. Might as well try to "restore our Republic" by cramming the entire current U.S. population (illegal aliens included!) into the original 13 states.

Of course I don't favor a unicamerial legislature at the federal level. Even if the misguided anti-17th loons were correct that Senators and Congressman had the same purpose, having two houses of Congress makes it more difficult for them to pass legislation (especially right now when the two houses are controlled by different parties), and that's a good thing, IMO.

The anti-17th argument that "Congressman and Senators now serve the same function and are redundant since they're both elected from the same state" is also ridiculous when you look at the House delegations and Senate delegations from various states. They obviously represent VERY different constituencies. Congresswoman Shelia Jackson-Lee of Texas would NEVER be Senator Shelia Jackson-Lee of Texas, and Congressman Roscoe Bartlett of Maryland would NEVER be Senator Roscoe Bartlett of Maryland. The demographics and interests of their district's constituents is vastly different than the state as a whole.

Field's suggestion of abolishing the 26th amendment is a worthy idea. It would never pass, but given that most 18-20 year olds don't vote anyway, and most of the ones that do are too ill-formed and ignorant to vote (not to mention they tend to be overwhelmingly liberal and pro-Obama), it would probably benefit our country if we limited voting suffrage to people age 21 or over. I was a conservative, informed voter at age 18, but unfortunately I was in the extreme minority at that age.

83 posted on 08/14/2013 1:48:06 PM PDT by BillyBoy (Liz Cheney's family supports gay marriage. Do you?)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

Hell I probably would have been for it at the time. Meritocracy sounds good. But it turned out to be a frying pan into fire situation.

With human nature being what it is I don’t know if a meritocracy is even possible.


84 posted on 08/14/2013 1:51:38 PM PDT by Impy (RED=COMMUNIST, NOT REPUBLICAN)
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To: fieldmarshaldj; Impy
>> I can tell you that there was a movement recently in my state legislature to try to remove our right to vote on our Senators, and it went over like a lead balloon. <<

The anti-17thers are extremely outspoken and would have us believe that trusting big government to appoint politicians for us is the "true conservative" position and one that the "tea party" embraces, but it's interesting how they NEVER poll grassroot conservatives and tea party members to gauge the level of support for it.

I think they probably fear what most of us suspect would be the results... you'd get around 20-25% of conservatives to endorse the idea, and the 60-70% or more opposed (with everyone else "undecided"). They can't sell people on this kool-aid, so they just run around screaming that you have to agree with Mark Levin on everything or you're a liberal RINO progressive Woodrow Wilson fan who "hates the constitution" and "doesn't understand the founders".

I see a similar attitude with the "only allow creationism in public schools" crowd. They'd you believe that they speak for conservatives as a whole, but their viewpoint is actually opposed by most conservatives and it only seems more popular than it is because they're screaming about it constantly and demanding everyone else accept their worldview.

There are other such fringe positions around (there are numerous Christian conservatives who still believe alcohol is the root of all evil and the prohibition should be re-instated, for example). The difference is, they're not running around on talk radio and yelling at the top of their lungs that they speak for the Tea Party, so we don't have to worry about them embarrassing us.

85 posted on 08/14/2013 2:04:36 PM PDT by BillyBoy (Liz Cheney's family supports gay marriage. Do you?)
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