Skip to comments.Marines shift focus to get women to front line
Posted on 05/01/2013 1:52:06 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
PARRIS ISLAND, SC (WMBF) - The next war fought by American troops will be fought by men and women on the front line.
Today, women are allowed - even encouraged - to serve wherever they're needed. And that has every branch of the military racing to develop a plan to make sure they are not only willing to fight, but ready for the job physically and emotionally.
At Parris Island the new role of women in the Marine Corps is changing tradition and attitudes about training at one of the nation's premier boot camps.
It has never has been training for the weak hearted or the weak spirit. As the only boot camp for women enlisting the Marine Corps, Parris Island has a well earned reputation.
No sooner did the Pentagon open the door for women serving in combat rolls then something else changed here on Parris Island that had been in the works for months. And that is the way they train female recruits.
Yes, shifting the role means shifting the training. And you can bet, the newest female recruits here are already feeling that victory where it hurts. For starters, there are more sit-ups, push-ups and pull-ups.
It's about time, says retired Army Lt. Colonel Wanda Robinson. She's a South Carolina teacher now, here at Parris Island for a workshop on how to talk honestly to her students, male and female, about the joining the military.
"I've always wanted to do some type of combat, you know I'm not saying I'm Rambo or Rambett. But I always wanted to do something like that. So, I'm applauding it for the females that are in now. "
One of those females also represents a historic first for Parris Island. The commanding general here is yet another sign of an evolving Marine Corps. And she will tell you her goal is to produce combat ready men and women.
"From my perspective sitting here at Parris island," says Brigadier General Lori Reynolds. "What we're gonna do here is not gonna change. We're gonna make sure that we turn out the best basically trained Marine that we can for whatever the Corps has in store for them next."
Staff Sgt. Latoya Moffitt is a senior drill instructor who has never seen a difference in dedication between the sexes. She in one who has always been ready for the front line.
It's just sincere passion that we have here sir. You want to make a difference. You want to influence that next generation of Marines that are going to be taking your place. And when you come here you give 110 percent because that's what you want to see once you get back to the fleet."
She is the female recruit's first impression here. It was the same for this group of 80 teachers invited to spend 4-days on Parris Island. They'll return to their schools from Myrtle Beach to Memphis a target for students wanting to know if the Marines Corps is right for them.
"Most of the female educators in this workshop will tell you their biggest influence will be on female students at their respective schools. So, with the Marine Corps made up of just 6-percent females, how likely are they to direct their students here to Parris Island.
Most of these teachers say the student will determine that.
You'd be amazed at how many girls are interested in military," says Kim Saylors, an Abbyville high school English teacher. "You know a lot of times I'll say well what are your goals, what do you want to do when you graduate? Do you even know? And a lot of times they'll say, military."
McBee High School career specialist, Terri Rhoad says she likes what she's seeing here at Parris Island. "I was just in awe of how many females were pursuing it now. So it's great that they're allowing them that opportunity to do as much as the males and not saying 'no' you can't do this."
The battalions of female recruits here at Parris Island today are here because of the opportunity to serve at every level, not in spite of it.
The Pentagon mandate authorizing women to serve in combat roles only offers women that option. The expectation for all branches of the military is that most women will choose other careers in the military that will not require them to fight on the front lines.
If women are equal to men on the front lines now just use women only. That seems fair, right?
Lets go fight the Russians or Chinese. And let them use all men while we use all women. Since it makes no difference ya know....
Oh, wait, Nobama will just institute compulsory abortions.
Technology will help to some extent. E.g. battlefield robots, and exoskeletons may soon enable female soldiers (or Marines) to pack as much gear as their male counterparts.
Considering they already do that just to avoid rear echelon deployments, probably quite a few. Commanders will attempt to implement policies to prevent them losing soldiers downrange from pregnancies, and will be attacked by the media.
The Russians experimented with using women in front-line positions, and quickly learned that it is a VERY VERY BAD IDEA.
Russian hard line troops against girls and panzies.
Not going to be a good fight for US.
As a Vietnam veteran with 2 PH..I can tell you this...there is not a woman on earth that would fit in on the front lines in combat. My wife was also a Marine and is confident, tough when needed, and she will tell you the exact same thing. I don’t give a rats a** what the Liberal box checkers say. BTW we both went through Parris Island.
Great, Million dollar wheel chairs welded to forklifts with little red wagons behind them for the gear instead of soldiers, great idea till the batteries run down.
I think I will bet on the Marines who will get the job done rain or shine, with or without support on Grit and Honor.
And Godless to boot. The end of the United States.
The women pushing for it are commie-lesbos who are devoid of common sense.
They also don't care how a policy they have endorsed will effect future women who will actually have to go and fight on the front line.
Unlike themselves who will spend the war in their air-conditioned offices stateside.
Who is taking odds, cause the bet is your familys lives.
Standards at PI have already been lowered. Expect them to be further lower so that women can succeed.
My $0.02 is that it's not a question of dedication, it's a question of ability. Doesn't particularly matter how much you want to do something...if you can't do it, then that's that.
For the moment, set aside social issues, sexism, chivalry, medical and hygiene issues, and anything else that I'm not sharp enough to think of at this moment. Any one of these issues would be enough to derail the entire experiment....but let's set them aside for now.
I'm sure that there are exceptions. However, in general, average women are not just slightly weaker, or less physically able than average men. They're catastrophically weaker, with less physical ability, size, muscle mass, and endurance.
Feminists can argue the issue all day. But, bluntly, you can't teach someone to be 5'10" tall and 180 pounds.
AFAIC, that's pretty much the end of the argument.
First, let me say I am the mother of a Special Forces soldier now in Afghanistan. He also was in the 82nd earlier. Please note this from the article. “Yes, shifting the role means shifting the training. And you can bet, the newest female recruits here are already feeling that victory where it hurts. For starters, there are more sit-ups, push-ups and pull-ups.”
It does not sound as if they are diluting the training at this time. Also, any woman who chooses to do this is not going to get pregnant to get out of combat. We women don’t invest major efforts in something just to wimp out. Remember, especially in earlier years, every time a woman had a baby, she risked death and a lot of pain.
Dempsey is evil.
So much for what was supposed to be the primary mission of the military. Never thought I’d see the day when, say, football or hockey respected reality over pc more than the military. The object is to win, now sports recognise that objective more clearly than the forces which are supposed to defend the nation.
I don't think any women will be passing the “Q Course” and getting their Green Barets anytime soon. Don't get me wrong, plenty of women wear Green Barets. I was stationed at Fort Devens with the 39th Engineers and we shared the same mess hall as 10th Special Forces. Plenty of women in supply, clerks etc... They didn't have the Special Forces tab though.
“As the only boot camp for women enlisting the Marine Corps, Parris Island has a well earned reputation.”
PI had a “well earned reputation” long before a group of traitors/idiots/social engineers (take your pick) ever thought of putting women in combat.
They just relieved the CO of OCS at Quantico because three of his enlisted died in a love triangle murder-suicide. Once Obama finishes, there will be “love quadrangles” and worse.
If they are going to fully integrate front line troops, let them start at boot camp. Line ‘em up for their physicals in their skivvy shorts with their laundry numbers drawn on their chests in magic marker. Male-female-male-female-whatever-notreallysure-female-male “back to chest”, “close it up”. We will find out very quickly how well this abomination works.
If you’re going to have love triangles & fights in the ranks, sort it out on the drill field, not when you’re getting shot at and someone’s life is depending on you doing the competent, unselfish thing.
“Technology will help to some extent. E.g. battlefield robots, and exoskeletons may soon enable female soldiers (or Marines) to pack as much gear as their male counterparts.”
You’re kidding, right? The cost of that would be?
Also, how many meat-robots can you pack into an APC?
They already pack about twice as many Marines in one of those than they ought. So much so you have to crap and piss in jars inside the APC, in front of your mates.
Combat is hard enough without adding 120 lbs of dead female weight to the squad.
You’re going to bring them back in body bags.
Stupidest idea ever. Ever. Women in combat.
Send them to the CIA, the NSA, or the DIA. Do not, DO NOT send them to the front.
When a female gets herself killed trying to carry off a 6’3” 185 pound Marine (that’s my son’s size) and gets him killed as well, there shall be hell to pay. BOOK IT!!
They can make excellent urban snipers. Just ask Sixth Army, Wermacht. The Red army deployed about 2,000 during WWII.
God’s almighty hand be upon your son as he serves his country in such capacity. I’ll respect your opinions without offering a rebuttal. We shall see in due time how this new military directive works out.
That’s the ticket. Let’s show how really assbackward a nation we are!
I was referring to the choice, not the actuality, although before modern medicine and anesthesia, the actuality was certainly more comparable. Think about choosing to be in agony possibly for many hours with a fair chance of dying at the end.
With all due respect ma’am, combat is different. Nobody should be subject to it, but the role has fallen to men. Nobody should aspire to combat either. There’s nothing glorious about it. It is demeaning. Just dealing with the MOP gear alone is a matter of having to strip naked out in the wide open in front of all your mates. Then there is the shit, the piss, the bad feet, the smell - all before you get to fight.
Now, having said all that, if you have to fight, you take the people with the very best chance of surviving it, and in every case that person is not going to be female.
Combat is a fraternity nobody should have to join, but if you do, the love you build between the members of that fraternity shouldn’t result in either of two things:
1. Hemhorroids from having been engaged in anal coitus, or
2. A battlefield pregnancy
It’s just not a place for social experimentation. It’s a place where you go to exterminate the guy on the other side of the objective, period. If you do it right.
I think it is a lot harder to train a female to kill and live in dirt for weeks. But I was a WW II infantryman and we had females for pin-ups and memories. Maybe today’s gals are different but I doubt it.
God will not be mocked.
I so disagree with Women on the frontline/combat military...its so unnatural imo.
That said...as a women I WILL ALWAYS be ready to defend hearth and home..and godhelp whoever comes after mine...god help him because I will be merciless.
I appreciate your son’s service, as well as your view from a woman’s perspective. I served in a fairly demanding combat field (jet pilot) and had enough cross-training and exposure to infantry that I felt I could have done it, but chose not to. Supporting grunts with high explosives from above was my challenge of choice.
I have no doubt that a small percentage of women could set out from the get-go to be infantry Marines, condition themselves physically, mentally, and emotionally to be grunts, and do it at least adequately. Extreme combat conditions being the exception rather than the rule, the very few to succeed in training (The Basic School hasn’t passed any infantry women so far)might very well have successful careers, at least for a while if other life interests superceded their desire to be combat grunts.
But exceptions to the rule don’t mean this is a good policy for all women. Upper body strength, stamina under duress, long-term strength when wounded, and aggressive instinct are all natural factors and, thank God, women are different from men. Also, they don’t chew/spit and try to out-fart their buddies.
uh, I've taken care of Army females that outnumbered men 9:1 with low back pain, sore knees, "stress", ankle sprains on a HIKE!!!
When they have to slog through some brush, sprint across some dirt and lay cover for their unit or try flanking a position in the dark after humping it for miles with all your gear.... tell me how many of them are going to crap out and die. My problem isn't with them dying, my problem is if they're supposed to cover my son's flank and they didn't, HE'S dead and the feminist will only care about combat not "being fair".
My oldest daughter was in the Marines. Shortly after boot camp, she joined her brother (Army) in a party. There was an Army guy there, my daughter drank a bit too much, got in an argument with him, and challenged him to a fight.
He picked her up with one hand and tossed her across the room on to the couch. Then he said, “You’re cute when you’re mad...”, and she decided maybe she should flirt instead of tempting him to throw her someplace without any cushions. Even drunk, she realized there was something about being 12 inches shorter and 110 lbs lighter that put her at a disadvantage!
My oldest daughter think it is incredibly STUPID to put women on the front lines. Support? Sure! Front lines? Nope!
“It’s about time, says retired Army Lt. Colonel Wanda Robinson. She’s a South Carolina teacher now..”
Teacher. That’s where you belong, you dumb turd. You could never don an 80-pound combat pack - with a rifle - and do a 15-mile force-march into a combat zone. And after you arrive, have the physical stamina to engage the enemy in a firefight that might last for days.
Ask the Marines who took sugar loaf hill in Okinawa in 1945. It wasn’t a place for women. Those Marines who survived suffered for months and years after that battle.
I don’t want women in combat. Go teach.
You go that right!
Very well put. I agree 100%.
Here are the Marines involved in that, one Marine looks different from the others, he just looks a little more like he fits into the Corps.
You saw what I saw, it is amazing.
This is Orwellian.
Insane...says this former Marine.
I am not suggesting that women be allowed to qualify with lower standards. However, I recently read John DelVecchio’s very “real” book on the Vietnam War, “The 13th Valley”. In it you have the heavy machine gun being carried by the biggest strongest guy in the unit, and the smaller guys serving as the tunnel rats. My late husband, a Korean War infantry combat vet, wanted to take a course on motor repair. We had an old rum runner with a V-8 engine, and he didn’t want it to quit on him out at sea and not know how to fix it. The men’s mechanics class was full, so he signed up in the women’s class that had some vacancies. He had a somewhat superior male attitude, but at the end of the course he said it worked really well. He partnered with a woman and said when something heavy needed to be done he did it, but when something intricate or in a tight spot needed doing she did it. I realize this is not an exact analogy, but I also think that a few women can do as well as the average or slightly below average Marine. And I realize that anyone who makes Marine is already above average.
I don’t think the military or women think this is a good policy for all women, just as it doesn’t work for all men. Incidentally, the average man farts 14 times a day, and guess how man times the average woman farts (14). Incidentally, eating yogurt drastically reduces the stink factor. As I discovered with great gratitude when I first gave hubby some yogurt.
While I never had any great desire to enter the military myself, being only 5’5”, 123 lb. when young, after a summer spent helping my family move at 16, furniture, many boxes of books and 4 tons of lumber pop had salvaged for projects, I took the physical fitness test at my new school and was the most fit girl of 150. My son was in a high school ROTC Rangers unit, and I noticed that most of the guys had strong aggressive mothers, including me. I never encouraged my son to go into the military, but he liked it. He came out for a few years but could not find a job he liked. I asked him once what the problem was. “Well,” he said, “I like getting up at 6 am and running 5 miles.” I could see his point and after a while his Reserve commander talked him back in. He is almost finished with his 20 now.