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Will Muslims Outnumber Christians in the Year 2050?

Posted on 04/30/2013 11:41:30 AM PDT by pinochet

Before we talk about comparative birth rates in Muslim and Christian nations, we have to talk about a weakness that 21st Century Christianity faces in its competition with Islam. A Martyr in the Christian religion is one who dies for his faith. A Martyr in the Muslim religion is not just one who dies for his faith, but one who kills for his faith. How is Christianity going to compete with people who are not just willing to die for their religion, but to kill for their religion?

Birth rates among almost all Western Christian nations are below replacement, and that includes America. Eastern European birth rates are also below replacement. In the non-white areas of the world that have Christians, e.g. Latin America and Africa, they look to Europeans as their role models, because Europe brought Christianity to those countries. But Europe's greatest export is socialism, and many Latin American and African nations are embracing socialism. Latin America has Hugo Chavez and Bolivia has Evo Morales, while Africa has Mandela and Mugabe, all socialist/communist trend-setters for those regions.

One of the consequences of socialism is excessive use of contraception and abortion. The ANC legalized abortion in South Africa in 1997. You are going to see more use of contraception and abortion among third world Christians, because they see Europeans as their role models. Third world immigrants to Europe and America vote for left-wing political parties, which are pro-abortion.

What about the Muslim world? They encourage polygamy, which increases the number of children. Nigeria is today split 50-50 between Muslims and Christians. But Nigerian Christians are better educated, practice monogamy, and use contraception. The Muslims in Northern Nigeria impose sharia and burkas on their women, discourage contraception, and practice polygamy, which maximizes the number of children. What is significant about Nigeria? The country has the largest population of any country in Africa, of 160 million. Where Nigeria goes, the rest of Africa will follow.

With regard to India, I came across this anti-Jihad website that reveals that India's Muslims are out-breeding the Hindus: http://sioespain.wordpress.com/2010/11/25/study-shows-that-muslims-will-conquer-the-world-by-2050/

The website says that India's Hindu women are having 2.9 children per woman, while India's Muslims are having 4.1 children per family.

We need to remember that Turkey was once a Christian nation, the heart of the great Christian Byzantine Empire. The biggest Turkish City, Istanbul, used to be called Constantinople, a city named after a Christian emperor, Constantine. The North African nations of Morocco, Algeria, Libya, Tunisia and Egypt, were also, at one time, Christian nations.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Philosophy; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: birthrate; christendom; christianity; crusades; globaljihad; islam; jihad; muslimworld; vanity
Can Christianity compete? If we carried out a poll of Christians and Muslims, to find out who is more likely to die for the religion, what do you think the response would be? Muslims promote their religion in Christian nations, but make Christian missionary activity illegal in Muslim nations. Christianity is then forced to compete with one hand tied behind their back. God help us!
1 posted on 04/30/2013 11:41:30 AM PDT by pinochet
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To: pinochet

Doesn’t matter, we are going down WAY before 2050!

America is about to IMPLODE!


2 posted on 04/30/2013 11:43:35 AM PDT by chicagolady (Mexican Elite say: EXPORT Poverty Let the American Taxpayer foot the bill !)
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To: pinochet
For most well adjusted people considering one or the other its a no brainer.

To primative angry miserable violent people its a tough choice.

3 posted on 04/30/2013 11:44:53 AM PDT by skeeter
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To: pinochet

Nope...


4 posted on 04/30/2013 11:45:08 AM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: pinochet

The answer to the question is no. Christianity always thrives the most under persecution. The Roman Empire nor Communist China could prevent Christianity from thriving and expanding. Islam won’t be able to, either.


5 posted on 04/30/2013 11:45:46 AM PDT by Kazan
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To: pinochet
There will be a global economic collapse and subsequent global war long before 2050.

There will be billions of fewer human inhabitants then, too.

6 posted on 04/30/2013 11:45:53 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Islam is a religion of peace, and Moslems reserve the right to behead anyone who says otherwise.)
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To: pinochet

They count their numbers like Catholics do, if you are born into their territory (parents), then they count you forever.

So a lot of this is just inflated.


7 posted on 04/30/2013 11:47:40 AM PDT by ansel12 (Civilization, Crusade against the Mohammedan Death Cult)
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To: pinochet

Christianity will be silenced as we have seen already and will become increasing so ....

Itchy ears want to hear what they want to hear....and there are now more of them then those who seek truth.


8 posted on 04/30/2013 11:48:26 AM PDT by caww
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To: Kazan

from what I understand, Christianity in Africa and Asia is growing by leaps and bounds. From what I read in the mainstream media Christianity is on life support.


9 posted on 04/30/2013 11:49:16 AM PDT by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-hereQaeda" and its allies.)
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To: pinochet

Our secret weapon against Islam will be when we spring Feminism on them. They’re gonna wish we’d go back to dropping them Daisy Cutters.


10 posted on 04/30/2013 11:51:35 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Kazan
Islam already is in every nation....Islam has no defined nation...it is about conquest by population in other nations. The US is not exempt and they are in every form of governance now using our laws to to protect themsleves and to continue their agenda.

This is not something the average American is concerned with even if they are aware. They have nothing to fight back with except their representatives, who refuse to acknowledge there is an enemy “IN the house”.

11 posted on 04/30/2013 11:52:01 AM PDT by caww
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To: pinochet

They don’t need a majority to destroy any Western Civilized Country. They only need enough people to get the attention of liberals there and make the liberals pander for their votes. They only need enough to gather together in any city in enough numbers to overwhelm the police. They only need a complicit liberal media to make excuses for them, lie for them, dissemble for them, and keep their truth from the rest of the populations.

They only need a Muslim US President.....er, uh....wait......

Oh Shit!


12 posted on 04/30/2013 11:52:11 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: pinochet

The “growth” of Muslims will continue as long as Christians subsidize them. If Christians stop subsidize the procreation of Muslims, natural attrition will balance out things.

This is the same as the minority population in the US. Minorities will continue to have 12-14 children as long as whitey pays for them. (Meanwhile whitey only has one child because that is all they can afford).

If there is total economic collapse in the West, nature will take care of things.


13 posted on 04/30/2013 11:53:56 AM PDT by Cowboy Bob (Democrats: Robbing Peter to buy Paul's vote.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Many forget the oil revenues continue to flow, and with it the support of the Islamification of other countries. Other nations are are struggling economically...theirs are building and expanding....as well their agenda in all countries.


14 posted on 04/30/2013 11:54:51 AM PDT by caww
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To: pinochet

When Jesus claims His bride, Islam will be the dominant religion on earth... no question about that.

I seriously doubt we will have to wait for more than 3 years for the Christian population to “zero out” in the blink of an eye.


15 posted on 04/30/2013 11:59:43 AM PDT by Safrguns
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To: pinochet

No. Birth rates in Islamic nations have absolutely collapsed. Iran’s total fertility rate went from 6.5 in the 1980s to 1.3. (2.1 is the replacement rate.) Turkey’s went from 6.3 to 2.0. Syria is shedding population. Indonesia (the most populous) went from 5.6 to 2.1.


16 posted on 04/30/2013 12:00:32 PM PDT by dangus (Poverty cannot be eradicated as long as the poor remain dependent on the state - Pope Francis)
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To: elpadre

>>from what I understand, Christianity in Africa and Asia is growing by leaps and bounds. From what I read in the mainstream media Christianity is on life support.

Yep. To hear the liberal media, Christianity is dying off. But, talk to a convert from west Africa and you hear a different story. Once Obama’s Progressive “transformation” is complete, faith will become important again in America too (and probably illegal or at least discouraged—strongly). Most church-going Americans think that faith is what you do for one hour a week, maybe two if they are “really devout”. This nation will become the world’s ripest mission field in about 20 years—for Christianity and Islam. What will we choose when our luxury-filled comsumer lifestyle is gone?


17 posted on 04/30/2013 12:04:16 PM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: Safrguns

The Jews and the 144,000 will be seriously outnumbered.


18 posted on 04/30/2013 12:05:41 PM PDT by mountainlion (Live well for those that did not make it back.)
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To: elpadre
from what I understand, Christianity in Africa and Asia is growing by leaps and bounds. From what I read in the mainstream media Christianity is on life support.

Given how our own media is delinquent on things concerning our own country (Fast & Furious, Benghazi, Obama's history) why should we trust them to accurately report on things that don't concern the country?

19 posted on 04/30/2013 12:08:59 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: dangus
"Birth rates in Islamic nations have absolutely collapsed"

But they have not collapsed in the developing countries...in Europe their BRs are much higher than the national population...check out the muzzie BRs in Spain, England, (most popular boys name...mohammed).
That is the problem...European national BRs are below the 2.1 rate while the muzzies are breeding like flies...or roaches.

20 posted on 04/30/2013 12:12:25 PM PDT by Cuttnhorse
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To: chicagolady

Amnesty will finish us off by 2020.


21 posted on 04/30/2013 12:14:25 PM PDT by stephenjohnbanker
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To: Bryanw92

It is said Africans are now coming to America as missionaries to lead Americans back to Christ.


22 posted on 04/30/2013 12:22:50 PM PDT by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-hereQaeda" and its allies.)
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To: chicagolady

Yeah, I just hope that God is out there to help a little bit in the upcoming “Mad Max” world.


23 posted on 04/30/2013 12:24:13 PM PDT by Morpheus2009
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To: stephenjohnbanker

NO, we are gonna die, Just Like ROME!

Homosexual Marriage: Following in the Footsteps of Roman Emperor Nero

This isn’t the first time homosexual marriage has been embraced by civil officials and the general population. The book of Ecclesiastes declares:

That which has been is that which will be,
And that which has been done is that which will be done.
So there is nothing new under the sun.
Is there anything of which one might say,
“See this, it is new”?
Already it has existed for ages
Which were before us (1:9–11)

It’s what we do about these things that make all the difference.

The Greeks and Romans promoted and practiced homosexuality and the general population initially accepted it. Craig Turner offers a summary of the history:

“The practice of homosexuality in the Roman Empire had increased during the early years until the Romans accepted and adopted the pederasty [love of boys] of the Greeks (fornication with boys ages 12 to 18). Though at first the acts were considered acceptable only if the boy was a slave, the Romans eventually extended their tolerance of homosexual acts to adult men, both free and slave. Same-sex marriage, once unthinkable, was not far behind.

Read more: http://godfatherpolitics.com/10069/homosexual-marriage-following-in-the-footsteps-of-roman-emperor-nero/#ixzz2RybwV8ym


24 posted on 04/30/2013 12:28:29 PM PDT by chicagolady (Mexican Elite say: EXPORT Poverty Let the American Taxpayer foot the bill !)
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To: chicagolady

Well, we no longer teach history(now an elective), and not enough people read the Bible either.


25 posted on 04/30/2013 12:36:30 PM PDT by stephenjohnbanker
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To: Cuttnhorse

I think you mean in the developed countries?

In either case, you are still wrong. Data is slightly harder to come by, when referring to subpopulations, but the birth rate among North Africans in France — a fairly good proxy for religion, since most French Muslims are from France’s North African colonies — is less than 2.4. That’s marginally higher than France’s native (”cosmopolitan”) population (1.9), but not enough to skew anything crazily.

And yes, Mohammed is England’s #1 boy’s name, but that’s because it accounts for a third of all Muslims, whereas the most common boy’s names among everyone else accounts for less than 1% of the population. The days of everyone being named Joseph, Harry or George are long gone.


26 posted on 04/30/2013 12:36:40 PM PDT by dangus (Poverty cannot be eradicated as long as the poor remain dependent on the state - Pope Francis)
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To: stephenjohnbanker

Yes, But you’re smarter than that, I not worried about “EVERYBODY”

Well here’s a message to “EVERYBODY”

BEND OVER and KISS YOUR BUTT GOODBYE!

How is that for PLAIN ENGLISH?


27 posted on 04/30/2013 12:39:40 PM PDT by chicagolady (Mexican Elite say: EXPORT Poverty Let the American Taxpayer foot the bill !)
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To: Morpheus2009

He IS!


28 posted on 04/30/2013 12:41:52 PM PDT by chicagolady (Mexican Elite say: EXPORT Poverty Let the American Taxpayer foot the bill !)
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To: chicagolady

Loud & clear.


29 posted on 04/30/2013 12:44:40 PM PDT by stephenjohnbanker
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To: elpadre

>>It is said Africans are now coming to America as missionaries to lead Americans back to Christ.

I hear that too. I have met Korean missionaries that are working in the US. They are interesting and full of the Spirit, and most Americans just tell them, “Don’t worry. I know who Jesus is” and then tune out the rest. We need to lose our arrogance that this is a “Christian Nation” before we’ll be ready to hear.


30 posted on 04/30/2013 1:06:43 PM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: pinochet

One is free to advocate Communism in Capitalist nations.

Advocating Capitalism in a Communist nation meant your death.

We still beat the Communists.


31 posted on 04/30/2013 1:09:28 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: chicagolady

A historical curiosity - but homosexual “marriage” was legal in Rome for a long time - and they fell sometime AFTER they made it illegal.

Not that I think the two are in any way connected.


32 posted on 04/30/2013 1:13:35 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: allmendream

LOL, Then read THIS!

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3014166/posts


33 posted on 04/30/2013 1:47:26 PM PDT by chicagolady (Mexican Elite say: EXPORT Poverty Let the American Taxpayer foot the bill !)
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To: Kazan
"Christianity always thrives the most under persecution. The Roman Empire nor Communist China could prevent Christianity from thriving and expanding. Islam won’t be able to, either."

I'm sorry. Islam already has.

In just one century after Muhammad's death (roughly 632-750) the Rashidun and Umayyad Caliphates physically took over 1/2 of Christendom, drove out, forced the Islamization of, or destroyed the Christian communities therein, and have kept the territory to this day.

Christianity was "a" or "the" major religion of what is now the Middle East and SW Asia --- Anatolia/Asia Minor (now called Turkey), along the Caucasus, the Armenians, the Georgians, the Eastern Assyrians, Jordan, Lebanon, the Persians (now called Iran) the Chaldeans (now called Iraq), along the Silk Road to the Indus. We hardly know these people even existed --- communities founded by the Apostles and their first and second and third-generation successors --- because the Muslims destroyed, not only their communities, but every architectural trace of them, churches, monasteries, libraries, documents.

Christianity was "a" or "the" major religion of the people of Northern Africa --- Egypt, Libya, the Barbary Coast (al- Maghreb) --- as well as Ethiopia along the Red Sea. They didn't "thrive" under persecution. They survived in scattered, garbled fragments under dhimmitude; at this point, even the remnants--- Copts, etc. --- are disappearing before our very eyes.

If it weren't for astute archaeological and paleographic detective work by the historians of dhimmitude like Bat Ye'or, we wouldn't even know that we lost half a Christian world, and never recovered it.

The exception to this was the Iberian Peninsula --- Al-Andalus, now called Spain and Portugal --- where the Catholic Spanish fought a 700-year war to drive out the Caliphate: the only major territory, to my knowledge, that the Muslims once ruled but were pushed out of.

Which brings me to my second point. The Christians that are left, have for the most part succumbed, not to force, but to secularization. They've got themselves contracepted, spayed, buggered, aborted, and in every way rendered perverse and sterile. This by choice, not by force.

You think they'll struggle for Christ and be glorious martyrs, whose blood is the seed of the Church? Will they seize a Christian future? They've aborted their Christian future.

At this point, Islam is just surging into a vacuum.

Can God work miracles? Definitely. Usually, after the crucifixion.

34 posted on 04/30/2013 2:04:51 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o (My kin are given to such phrases as, 'Let's face it.' - Flannery O'Connor)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

Muslims are converting to Christianity in large numbers in Indonesia and if trends continue that nation will cease to be a majority Muslim country at some point.


35 posted on 04/30/2013 2:09:27 PM PDT by WashingtonSource
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To: Mrs. Don-o

Here’s a link to an article on the move to Christianity in Indonesia:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1982223,00.html


36 posted on 04/30/2013 2:10:55 PM PDT by WashingtonSource
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To: WashingtonSource
Thank you for the Time Mag article, which is of course encouraging. I would love to be proved wrong on Christianity's future.

Hard to get a good handle on facts, especially in a place like Indonesia, with its many, many islands, languages and peoples. However, let's think this through.

A high-side optimistic estimate would be one million conversions from Islam to Christianity per year. (Conversions don't all come from Muslims; they come from Animists and even from Chinese Communists in Indonesia, too.) The population of Indonesia is around 250 million, about 80% Muslim, 10% Christian, and 10% another including Hindu, Confucist and Animist. So, say 200 million Muslims. If one million convert from Muslim to Christian per year, that makes the annual conversion rate 0.5%.

Speaking carefully, five tenths of one percent is not what I would call massive.

(I am chastened when I think of a handful of people in my own family who have in practice exited Christianity. I would bet that many Freeper families know the sadness of seeing many -- well, use the term "backslidden" family members.)

I could well be wrong. I want to be wrong. I am open to the Holy Spirit's surprises.

37 posted on 04/30/2013 3:00:40 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("Jesus thrown everything off balance." - Flannery O'Connor)
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To: pinochet
I'd say it depends on whether Iran attacks Israel with nukes? If they do, Mooselimb population will be less than the Druids.
38 posted on 04/30/2013 4:12:03 PM PDT by HenpeckedCon (What pi$$es me off the most is that POS commie will get a State Funeral!)
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To: dangus
Yes, you are correct, I did mean developed countries.

And no, I am not wrong at least according to Mark Steyn in his excellent book, America Alone, The End of the World As We Know It.

From a review of the book:

Do you remember years ago forecasters urged population control? Europe heeded this warning and now faces two factors that will change it drastically: its population is aging and couples are not reproducing themselves.

According to Steyn, these are the statistics of the population under the age of 15: Spain and Germany--14%, United Kingdom--18%, the United States--21%. On the other hand Saudi Arabia's 15 and under is 39%, Pakistan--40%, and Yemen--47%.

Who is reproducing themselves: the US at 2.1 babies per couple, Saudi Arabia at 7.46, Mali at 7.42, Somalia at 6.76, Afghanistan at 6.69, Ireland at 1.9, New Zealand at 2.11. There are Germany and Austria at 1.3, Russia and Italy at 1.2, and Spain at 1.1. Those with birthrates over 2 are Muslim; those under Caucasian Christian.

With an aging population and declining birthrate and a swelling benefits package supplied by the government, who will pay for this social welfare?

Sorry, I'll go with Mark's assessment.

39 posted on 04/30/2013 4:43:13 PM PDT by Cuttnhorse
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To: Cuttnhorse

Not sure why, but Mark Steyn is using terribly dated data. Saudi Arabia’s TFR was 7.46... in the 1960s. Today, it is 2.26. He’s chosen precisely the worst data to make his point, whether it comes from the 1960s, 1990s, or today.


40 posted on 04/30/2013 5:36:57 PM PDT by dangus (Poverty cannot be eradicated as long as the poor remain dependent on the state - Pope Francis)
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To: dangus

And the remainder of the countries? Outdated as well?


41 posted on 04/30/2013 5:51:35 PM PDT by Cuttnhorse
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To: Cuttnhorse

Mostly, yes.


42 posted on 04/30/2013 7:01:53 PM PDT by dangus (Poverty cannot be eradicated as long as the poor remain dependent on the state - Pope Francis)
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To: Mrs. Don-o

There are many Muslims converting to Christianity in Indoneisa — which is a doubled-edge sword for the transformation of Indonesia.

Here’s another story on the phenomenon:
http://my.news.yahoo.com/christian-indonesia-big-threat-to-malaysia-says-muslim-052831228.html

Muslims are worried and they claim that TWO MILLION Muslims convert to Christianity in Indonesia every year — and here’s a YouTube video the Muslims made to counteract this trend:

http://www.yanabi.com/index.php?/topic/426269-2-million-people-in-indonesia-leave-islam-for-christianity-every-year/

Indonesia has the world’s largest Muslim population. A transformation here would be a huge defeat for Islam and a huge victory for Christianity.


43 posted on 05/01/2013 1:57:57 PM PDT by WashingtonSource
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To: WashingtonSource

Thank you for these links. I’d like think they are reacting to a real wave of conversions, and not just using “Alarm” for fundraising purposes. Wonderful to think of these kids coming to Christ!


44 posted on 05/01/2013 3:29:16 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o ("In Christ we form one body, and each member belongs to all the others." Romans 12:5)
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To: WashingtonSource

It is nice to hear about how at least in some parts of the world. It’s still sad to see how America pretty much has kicked it’s founding heritage to the curb, when it’s founders wanted to set up a place that somewhat avoided the pitfalls of Europe. It’s the tragedy of America pretty much trying to bite the divine hand that fed it, and gave it prosperity.


45 posted on 05/03/2013 6:48:08 PM PDT by Morpheus2009
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To: Kazan

If anything there is out there I would say, I would rather face the oppression of Islam at this point, then deal with the crude, vulgar, and extremely blasphemous disregard for God that so much of the extreme secularism in the Western World entails


46 posted on 05/03/2013 6:50:14 PM PDT by Morpheus2009
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