Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

U.S. #1 By Far In Gun OwnershipóBut Only 28th In Gun Murder Rate
Cybercast News Service ^ | February 6, 2013 | Stephen Gutowski

Posted on 02/06/2013 11:05:54 AM PST by Olog-hai

One of the most obnoxious liberal talking points on guns involves the idea that guns, in and of themselves, cause gun violence. Apparently, as this argument goes, guns or “gun culture” cause law-abiding citizens to transform into murderous nuts. In other words, more guns must mean more gun violence. The argument was famously made by sports writer Jason Whitlock and forwarded by Bob Costas on Sunday Night Football after a player reportedly murdered his girlfriend and killed himself. …

According to the latest Small Arms Survey conducted by the Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies, the U.S. tops the world in civilian gun ownership. …

If Whitlock, Costas, and their allies are correct, that must mean that our gun murder rate is by far the highest in the world, right? We must be first in gun murders. But, according to information provided by the UN’s Office on Drugs and Crime and compiled by the Guardian, the answer is an emphatic “No.” … Instead, the U.S. has the 28th highest homicide by firearm rate of the countries in the report. …

(Excerpt) Read more at cnsnews.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: armedcitizen; banglist; donttreadonme; guncontrol; gunownership; lawabidinggunowners; murderrate; nocompromise; secondamendment; youwillnotdisarmus

1 posted on 02/06/2013 11:06:05 AM PST by Olog-hai
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

Factor the illegals out of the statistics and the United States would be even further down the list of gun-related (and other forms of) violence. With over 20,000,000 illegals swarming all over the land, that’s more than sufficient to grossly inflate the numbers to make America appear more dangerous.


2 posted on 02/06/2013 11:14:22 AM PST by re_nortex
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai
WOULD BANNING FIREARMS REDUCE MURDER AND SUICIDE?, Harvard Journal of Law and Public Policy, Volume 30, Number 2, Spring 2007 (pp. 649-694)

OF HOLOCAUSTS AND GUN CONTROL, Washington University Law Quarterly, Volume 75, Number 3, Fall 1997 (pp. 1237-1275) (PDF of article)

3 posted on 02/06/2013 11:17:07 AM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (TYRANNY: When the people fear the politicians. LIBERTY: When the politicians fear the people.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

We have 89 guns for ever 100 residents?


4 posted on 02/06/2013 11:18:35 AM PST by Java4Jay (The evils of government are directly proportional to the tolerance of the people.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

We have 89 guns for ever 100 residents.


5 posted on 02/06/2013 11:20:43 AM PST by Java4Jay (The evils of government are directly proportional to the tolerance of the people.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai
Guns keep America's free and guns will free America from Tyranny again. Soon it will be needed as the communists continue takeover.
6 posted on 02/06/2013 11:21:31 AM PST by Logical me
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Java4Jay
My guess is that would be a low side figure.
7 posted on 02/06/2013 11:23:07 AM PST by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: re_nortex

You forgot the big elephant in the room: the largely black inner city cesspools of homicide and violent crime.


8 posted on 02/06/2013 11:23:15 AM PST by SpaceBar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

I don’t really care about how someone is murdered but rather whether they are murdered.

The U.S. ranks 98th overall in the world in murder rate, putting us on the better side of midpack.

That said, a quick look at that list shows African/S.American countries with the highest murder rates and European/Asian countries with the lowest rates.

European-Americans have a murder rate comparable to Europeans, while African-Americans have a murder rate comparable to Africans.


9 posted on 02/06/2013 11:25:12 AM PST by SampleMan (Feral Humans are the refuse of socialism.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: re_nortex

Factor out Chicago, DC, Detroit and East St. Louis. We wouldn’t be on the list at all.


10 posted on 02/06/2013 11:27:12 AM PST by Augie
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: E. Pluribus Unum

Bookmark. Thanks for posting!


11 posted on 02/06/2013 11:30:15 AM PST by EdReform (Oath Keepers - Guardians of the Republic - Honor your oath - Join us: www.oathkeepers.org)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Augie

That’s Racis!


12 posted on 02/06/2013 11:33:28 AM PST by Uncle Miltie (Of the government, by the government, and for the government.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

2nd Amendment bump for later..........


13 posted on 02/06/2013 11:34:27 AM PST by indthkr
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Augie
Factor out Chicago, DC, Detroit and East St. Louis. We wouldn’t be on the list at all.

Very well said. I'll also add that East St. Louis is a most interesting case. Take a look at the crime data for Granite City, IL, an index of 329 and zero murders, just a few miles north of neighboring East Saint Louis, IL with an astronomical index of 2089 and 25 murders in just a single year.

Both towns are around the same size (under 30,000) and neither is wealthy, with average incomes and household values below that of entire state of Illinois. So what's the difference between the two?


14 posted on 02/06/2013 11:40:00 AM PST by re_nortex
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

The price to pay to ensure freedom from tyranny. The people of the United States own more firearms than most of the world’s armies combined. And that’s just the stuff they know about. There’s a reason our founding fathers created the second amendment, with it’s absolute certainty.


15 posted on 02/06/2013 11:45:21 AM PST by factoryrat (We are the producers, the creators. Grow it, mine it, build it.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai


Gloria: Do you know that sixty percent of all deaths in America are caused by guns?

Archie Bunker: Would it make you feel any better, little girl, if they was pushed out of windows?
16 posted on 02/06/2013 11:46:16 AM PST by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai
The only way to slow our gun violence is to select citizens of good character that can pass a strict background check, and then issue them a permit to carry a weapon. From then on the gang bangers will be very cautious when they haul out their shooter.
17 posted on 02/06/2013 11:51:43 AM PST by ANGGAPO (Layte Gulf Beach Club)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SampleMan
The US white murder rate ~ white on white ~ is lower than that of Europe

The US black murder rate ~ black on black ~ is lower than that of any African nation.

We have inter-racial rates because, lo and behold, we have every race known on the face of the Earth ~ in plentiful numbers.

Even in those categories we are lower than the rates found elsewhere for inter-racial murder.

See those gun ownership rates? Americans are friendly and polite. Foreigners are nasty, churlish and murderous.

Obama wants us to be more like them.

18 posted on 02/06/2013 11:52:16 AM PST by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: SpaceBar
You forgot the big elephant in the room: the largely black inner city cesspools of homicide and violent crime.

Please see my post a bit later in this thread on that very subject. I was probably in the process of collating the irrefutable data and tracking down the links for my response just as you wrote this. You're absolutely right, the numbers don't lie and my hope is that the hard truths about black crime get publicized beyond Conservative venues such as Free Republic.

This is the type of material that should be the lead story on every network newscast and on the front pages of every newspaper and magazine. But it's not because it most definitely is, to borrow a phrase from (believe or not) Al Gore:

AN INCONVENIENT TRUTH

I'll also add that, even as bad as the black crimewave of murder has been, it doesn't even come close to the non-stop black genocide due to the Godless abortion industry:


19 posted on 02/06/2013 12:06:35 PM PST by re_nortex
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: SpaceBar

yeah, and they voted almost 100% for Obama.


20 posted on 02/06/2013 12:24:21 PM PST by EyeSalveRich (Obama: usurper leader of the violent)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: SampleMan

bookmark


21 posted on 02/06/2013 12:37:35 PM PST by BillGunn (Bill Gunn for Congress district one rep. Massachusetts)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Sopater

Classic!


22 posted on 02/06/2013 12:45:04 PM PST by Inyo-Mono (NRA)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Augie

67% of firearm murders took place in the country’s 50 largest metro areas.

The 62 cities in those metro areas have a firearm murder rate of 9.7, more than twice the national average. Among teenagers the firearm murder rate is 14.6 or almost three times the national average. Those numbers are from six years ago. They have grown worse since.

Those are the crowded cities of Obamerica. The places with the most restrictive gun control laws and the highest crime rates. These are the places where the family is broken, money comes from the government and immigrants crowd in from some of the most violent parts of the world bringing with them their own organized crime. These are also the places that have run by Democrats and their political machines for almost as long as they have been broken.

Obama won every major city in the election, except for Jacksonville and Salt Lake City. And the higher the death rate, the bigger his victory. He won New Orleans by 80 to 17 where the murder rate is ten times higher than the national average. He won Detroit, where the murder rate of 53 per 100,000 people is the second highest in the country and twice as high as any country in the world, including the Congo and South Africa. He won it 73 to 26. And then he celebrated his victory in Chicago where the murder rate is three times the statewide average.
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/52538


23 posted on 02/06/2013 12:51:26 PM PST by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Java4Jay

I don’t know who these Graduate Institute—— geniuses are but they come late to the party with only half a six pak. It sounds more like they’re downplaying how magnificantly well armed the American population is. The real number would be more like 125 guns per 100 folks. Going clear back to WW II the number was one-to-one with the total gun count being around 150 million. At the turn of the 21 st century there were over 300 million privately owned guns in the US and we’ve been making over 10 million per year since with 2012 setting a record over 14 million. Whatever the exact ratio might be REMEMBER this: There are more privately owned firearms in the US than there are guns of every sort in the entire rest of the world especially including all the other militaries. And it’s going to stay that way———armed to the teeth-——Semper Fi


24 posted on 02/06/2013 1:05:01 PM PST by cherokee1 (skip the names---just kick the buttz)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Java4Jay

That is way too few.
Everybody needs a side arm, a shotgun, and a militia rifle.


25 posted on 02/06/2013 1:16:04 PM PST by Little Ray (Waiting for the return of the Gods of the Copybook Headings.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

“U.S. #1 By Far In Gun Ownership—But Only 28th In Gun Murder Rate”

Sounds like we’ve got alot of catchin up to do.


26 posted on 02/06/2013 1:16:40 PM PST by Mashood
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

Remove black on black gang crime and we would drop out of the top 50.


27 posted on 02/06/2013 1:21:25 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (There is no requirement to show need in order to exercise your rights.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

“the U.S. has the 28th highest homicide by firearm rate of the countries in the report. …”

I know we can do better than this...U!S!A! U!S!A!


28 posted on 02/06/2013 2:01:40 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (Pray for revival. <BCC><)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

The top 3 Countries on the U.N. list are Honduras, El Salvador, and Jamaica. The U.S. is #28 on the U.N. list.


29 posted on 02/06/2013 3:21:23 PM PST by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

Thank you for posting this.

I am going to use it on several forums where I’m debating with people from various foreign countries who can’t figure out why Americans don’t just go ahead and ban private firearms because it would reduce our crime rate.

Facts are stubborn things and it looks like the facts are on our side here.


30 posted on 02/06/2013 4:12:46 PM PST by darrellmaurina
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Augie; All

The Elephant in the room nobody will address:

Per Department of Justice statistics, between 1976-2005 blacks accounted for 12% of the US population yet 52.2% of all homicides committed. That number is not debatable.

Using back of the envelope numbers and anecdotal evidence, we can say that half of that 12% population can be taken out of the equation, as women virtually commit none of these murders (some, but not many). Now we are at 6%. More back of the envelope numbers show that toddlers do not commit murders and neither do those in their 90’s, 80’s, or 70’s. Take off about another 3%. So approximately 3% of the population (black males between the age of 15 and 35) is responsible for 52.2% of all homicides in this country.

Calling this a National Epidemic would be an understatement. But instead of dealing with it honestly, many of these people are paroled or get plea bargains for their violent behavior because a distant relative of theirs may have been oppressed hundreds of years ago. It is insanity, but it is the current “justice” system, one which ignores empirical data in favor of the god of Political Correctness.


31 posted on 02/06/2013 4:58:32 PM PST by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Red in Blue PA

I found a USDOJ report on Homicide Trends from 1980-2008 that claims 27 percent of all homicides for 2008 were committed by just one percent of the population - young black males under age 25.


32 posted on 02/06/2013 6:04:35 PM PST by GreyHoundSailor
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai
Here's a very nice video my son sent me...

It may have be already posted somewhere here at "FR" but it's worth seeing again...

Sometimes the little things can give you heart...

33 posted on 02/06/2013 6:11:54 PM PST by unread
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: re_nortex
OOPS...Forgot the link.. :)

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=39e_1360125919

Can't seem to get links to work...Just copy and paste...

34 posted on 02/06/2013 6:15:07 PM PST by unread
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: SampleMan; All
“I don’t really care about how someone is murdered but rather whether they are murdered.

The U.S. ranks 98th overall in the world in murder rate, putting us on the better side of midpack.”

Exactly correct. “Firearms Homicide” or “Gun violence” or “Gun murders” are all propaganda metrics. It does not matter to a homicide victim if they are murdered by stomping or a petrol bomb. They are dead. If nasty controls on guns results in less gun murders, but more stompings, you have made things worse, not better.

To look at “firearms crime” is to stack the deck. It is propaganda from the start.

35 posted on 02/06/2013 6:33:01 PM PST by marktwain (The MSM must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Blue Collar Christian; Olog-hai
“the U.S. has the 28th highest homicide by firearm rate of the countries in the report. …”

I know we can do better than this...U!S!A! U!S!A!

When they ban guns and try to confiscate them enmass we will be number 1. (And I helped)

36 posted on 02/06/2013 6:52:41 PM PST by bigheadfred (wogga wogga)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

Every time I meet somebody who claims that gun control will make America “safer,” I remind them that for the past several years, Mexico has had one of the highest per capita murder rates in the world, and it’s impossible for a civilian to own a handgun in Mexico and very difficult to own long arms.

Gun control sure made Sinaloa and Juarez safe!


37 posted on 02/06/2013 8:00:38 PM PST by ek_hornbeck
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Olog-hai

More than 50% of USA gun murders are committed by Blacks.

Hispanics commit about 20% of gun murders.

Whites commit only 25%-30% of gun murders.

The gun murder rate by White Americans is about 2 per 100,000.

The gun murder rate by Whites in Switzerland is about 1 per 100,000.


38 posted on 02/06/2013 11:47:17 PM PST by zeestephen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Red in Blue PA
Re: “That number is not debatable.”

Red,

In fact, that 52.2% for Black murderers is almost certainly larger.

The DOJ does not disclose that about 30% of USA murders go unsolved each year.

Most of those unsolved murders occur in large urban areas, and many of them involve gang murders.

And here's another statistical issue...

Since about 1990, almost all federal crime statistics combine Whites and Hispanics as one race.

There are about a dozen academic studies on Google that claim the Hispanic murder rate is at least 2 times higher than the White murder rate.

39 posted on 02/07/2013 12:37:38 AM PST by zeestephen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: ek_hornbeck

“Safe in Mexico”

A couple of European newspapers are reporting a horrific crime in Acapulco.

A large group of young Spanish tourists were renting a beach side house.

A heavily armed group of Mexican males broke in, tied them up, robbed them, and ganged raped all the women.

For some unknown miraculous reason, the Mexicans didn’t kill any of the young Spaniards, and just fled the scene instead.

First thing I thought about was the American tourist who was thrown in a Mexican jail for months for possessing an antique shotgun.

Every criminal in Mexico KNOWS that tourists and most citizens have NO way to defend themselves.


40 posted on 02/07/2013 12:53:01 AM PST by zeestephen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: re_nortex
With over 20,000,000 illegals swarming all over the land, that’s more than sufficient to grossly inflate the numbers to make America appear more dangerous.

There's a huge negative trickle down across the board from opening up the border and it's treasonous to not enforce border security, especially when we're supposedly at war here and there around the world.

The jobs the illegals take puts a lot of lower income Americans out of work, leaving them with growing needs, especially if they have family to support, and a lot of time on their hands. Not good.

That number increases dramatically when you add the artificial minimum wage, child labor laws and now, the need to avoid obamacare punishments, whereas before these government "fixes" we had much higher employment, but especially from high school age on up. Idle youth, not good.

Learning about work, acquiring skills, learning a good work ethic and good work habits early makes for a better life and a better country. That's how it used to be here.

We've legislated those benefits away and have created higher unemployment along with higher crime and murder/suicide rates as a bonus.

Amerika: Progressive social engineering at it's best. Beware the two horned lamb!

41 posted on 02/08/2013 7:30:51 AM PST by GBA (Here in the Matrix, life is but a dream.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Red in Blue PA
.
.

Well done -

I used to use the 1999 FBI/DOJ (Reno-Clinton) Uniform Crime Reports stats with racial and sex breakdowns

Using lying liberal democrat numbers whacks the anti-gunners in the head with a 4x4

Black male teenagers in Washington DC had a higher murder-perp rate per 100,000 (about 250/100,000) than in Rowanda during the tribal wars there

Another fact jumped out:

A number of states had totals of only 0-3 murders with guns in a whole year

But large urban high-minority cities like DC, Gary, New Orleans, NYC, LA, Saint Louis, etc. were killing fields

White middle-aged men in rural areas had a firearm/perp kill rate of under 1/100,000

Obamaville in Chicago and Detroit today are great examples

Is a 15% smaller brain to blame?

Don't ask me! I am not a doctor or an anthropologist!

.
.

42 posted on 02/08/2013 2:14:42 PM PST by devolve ( -------- -- --It is not where Obama was born that is the problem - it is where he's living now--)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: re_nortex




1994 - White on White = 1,178 TOTAL HOMICIDES

-

1994 actual homicides with population = 260 million:

Whites & Hispanics = 219 million x 3.22 homicides per 100k = 7,056

WHITES = 198 million x 0.7 homicides per 100,000 Whites = 1,386 homicides = 20% of White and Hispanic homicides

HISPANICS = 21 million x 27 homicides per 100,000 Hispanics = 5,670 = 80% of White and Hispanic homicides

BLACKS = 31 million x 52 homicides per 100,000 Blacks = 16,120

"OTHERS" = 10 million x 1.24 homicides per Other = 124

These are Official 1994 US GOVT CRIME STATISTICS DURING THE CLINTON Administration with US Department of Justice Attorney General Janet Reno and FBI Director Louis Freeh





43 posted on 02/08/2013 6:34:16 PM PST by devolve ( -------- -- --It is not where Obama was born that is the problem - it is where he's living now--)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Red in Blue PA

Thanks for the new tag line.


44 posted on 02/08/2013 6:48:35 PM PST by ctdonath2 (3% of the population perpetrates >50% of homicides...but gun control advocates blame metal boxes.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson