Skip to comments.Bye-Bye London-The future disappears for Jews in England
Posted on 01/23/2013 5:39:24 AM PST by SJackson
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Posted By Caroline Glick On January 23, 2013 @ 12:33 am In Daily Mailer,FrontPage | 21 Comments
In an interview with Haaretz in November 2010, British novelist Martin Amis said the following about discussions of Israel in his motherland:
I live in a mildly anti-Semitic country, and Europe is mildly anti-Semitic, and they hold Israel to a higher moral standard than its neighbors. If you bring up Israel in a public meeting in England, the whole atmosphere changes. The standard left-wing person never feels more comfortable than when attacking Israel. Because they are the only foreigners you can attack. Everyone else is protected by having dark skin, or colonial history, or something. But you can attack Israel. And the atmosphere becomes very unpleasant. It is traditional, snobbish, British anti-Semitism combined with present-day circumstances.
After participating last week in a debate in London about Israeli communities beyond the 1949 armistice lines organized by the self-consciously pretentious Intelligence Squared debating society, I can now say from personal experience that Amis is correct. The public atmosphere in England regarding Israel is ugly and violent.
The resolution we debated read: “Israel is destroying itself with its settlement policy. If settlement expansion continues Israel will have no future.”
My debating partner was Danny Dayan, the outgoing head of the Yesha Council.
We debated Daniel Levy, one of the founders of J-Street and the drafter of the Geneva Initiative, and the son of Lord Michael Levy, one of Tony Blair’s biggest fundraisers; and William Sieghart, a British philanthropist who runs a non-profit that among other things, champions Hamas. Levy has publicly stated that Israel’s creation was immoral. And Sieghart has a past record of saying that Israel’s delegitimization would be a salutary proces and calling for a complete cultural boycott of Israel while lauding Hamas.
We lost overwhelmingly. I think the final vote tally was something like 500 for the resolution and 100 against it.
A couple of impressions I took away from the experience: First, I can say without hesitation that I hope never to return to Britain. I actually don’t see any point. Jews are targeted by massive anti-Semitism of both the social and physical varieties. Why would anyone Jewish want to live there?
As to visiting as an Israeli, again, I just don’t see the point. The discourse is owned by anti-Israel voices. They don’t make arguments to spur thought, but to end it, by appealing to people’s passions.
For instance, in one particularly ugly segment, Levy made the scurrilous accusation that Israel systematically steals land from the Palestinians. Both Dayan and I demanded that he provide just one example of his charge. And the audience raged against us for our temerity at insisting that he provide substantiation for his baseless allegation. In the event, he failed to substantiate his allegation.
At another point, I was asked how I defend the Nazi state of Israel. When I responded by among other things giving the Nazi pedigree of the Palestinian nationalist movement founded by Nazi agent Haj Amin el Husseini and currently led by Holocaust denier Mahmoud Abbas, the crowd angrily shouted me down.
I want to note that the audience was made up of upper crust, wealthy British people, not unwashed rabble rousers. And yet they behaved in many respects like a mob when presented with pro-Israel positions.
I honestly don’t know whether there are policy implications that arise from my experience in London last week. I have for a long time been of the opinion that Israel shouldn’t bother to try to win over Europe because the Europeans have multiple reasons for always being anti-Israel and none of them have anything to do with anything that Israel does. As I discuss in my book, these reasons include anti-Semitism, anti-Americanism, addiction to Arab oil, and growing Muslim populations in Europe.
I was prepared to conduct a civilized debate based on facts and reasoned argumentation. I expected it to be a difficult experience. I was not expecting to be greeted by a well-dressed mob. My pessimism about Europeans’ capacity to avail themselves to reasoned, fact-based argumentation about Israel has only deepened from the experience.
One positive note, I had a breakfast discussion last Wednesday morning with activists from the Zionist Federation of Britain. The people I met are committed, warm, hardworking Zionists. I wish them all the best, and mainly that means, that I hope that these wonderful people and their families make aliyah.
While their work is worthwhile, there is no future for Jews in England.
I knew England was subverted by eastern European thinking when the Gods of the headlines stopped calling it England.
British and European Jews should bring their capital and their talents to TEXAS.
>>British and European Jews should bring their capital and their talents to TEXAS.<<
They’d turn it into another California in a decade. Hitler had his Jews working for him and they succeeded in defeating their own people. Today, the majority of Jews in Israel are begging for more socialism. They’ll get it too.
If there ever was a country trying to commit suicide faster than we are, it’s Israel. They must be driving poor Bibi to drink.
I hope that the sorry bastards will be happy when the New World Order in firmly in place with their Agenda 21 Programs. Thankfully, I should be long dead and gone by the time that happens.
It sure looks that way.We'd hope everyone at the least has their helmet on and has the sword at the ready.
They - Europeans - used to hate the Jews for being The Other in their societies, or being simply different. So after WW II and their near extinction, they went off with the sabras and Sephardic Jews and founded Israel. Now they hate them for that instead!
‘The public atmosphere in England regarding Israel is ugly and violent.’
Most English and British people actually couldnt care less about Israel or Palestine. We are sick of it. The people this woman talks about are a vocal minority.
And that minority is anti-israel. NOT antisemitic. I am fed up with Jewish-American commentators who equate leftwing UK criticism of Israel with anti-semitism. Its a cheap, nasty trick. The vast majority of this vocal minority may be loudmouth idiots, but they arent antisemitic.
‘First, I can say without hesitation that I hope never to return to Britain. I actually dont see any point.’
Good. Because we dont want hysterical Jews ranting that a whole nation of 60 million people are antisemites, when they clearly know nothing about Britain. Or its Jewish British history or culture.
‘Jews are targeted by massive anti-Semitism of both the social and physical varieties. Why would anyone Jewish want to live there?’
An utter and disgusting lie.
The Jewish population of Great Britain lives happily without any major anti-semitism. In fact, Judaism is openly celebrated as a long standing and vibrant part of British culture. British TV ran Jewish documentaries across all five of its network channels last year.
British Jewish entertainers, writers, politicians and businesspeople openly celebrate their Jewishness. The London East End Jew, with his sharp wit and mouth is as well loved and known a cultural icon as the Glaswegian or the Cockney.
The current British Prime Minister is part Jewish. As is the deputy PM. As is the leader of the opposition party(Labour). So you have Jewish-descended people in the three most important political positions in the UK.
Are Obama, Biden and Romney Jewish?......
This idiot woman is disgusting. Her comments about Britain are simply obnoxious. They are a disgusting slander on the vast, vast majority of the British people. Who are no more antisemitic than their American cousins.
THIS is the nation that rejected the naked antisemitism of the 1930’s Fascists, and continues to reject the antisemitism of the BNP and other fringe neo-nazi parties and groups.
THIS is the nation that stood alone against Hitler, while America and others stood by. And the nation that liberated Belsen and saved Jewish lives.
To suggest that the British people are antisemitic OR that the Jews of Britain are victims of mass cultural or physical antisemitism is a downright lie.
I am so f*cking angry at this woman.
She should be ashamed.
From Ms Glick’s own website:
‘By KO on January 22, 2013 4:05 PM
This article from Caroline Glick is both emotive and myopic in my strong opinion.
She attends a privileged ‘debate’ in the heart of the capital amongst a selected few half-wits and, surprise surprise, she finds that they’re anti-Israel and is shocked. These people have been biassed against jews since time immemorial and nothing’s changed.
But, what about the average indigenous British person? I’m talking about the ones who haven’t got time to attend fancy ‘debates’ in London because they’re out working for a living. And how do they usually feel? As a workman myself (tree surgeon and landscape gardener) I can testify that I have never heard any overt anti-semitism in my life from common, working people. We leave that to the illustrious ones in the media and in Parliament. At the worst, indigenous English people are indifferent about jews and Israel. Probably that’s wrong, and I myself do what little I can in trying to address this problem, but CG does them a grave injustice by her ill-informed comments about their perceived anti-semitism. Her co-religionist, Levy, and the foreign-named Sieghart, are undoubtedly anti-semites. What else is new? So was Marx and so is Soros and so was Amos Oz. Let Glick go and fight with her fellow jews, most English people would be quite happy to be left alone.
As a final word, I presume she is referring contemptuously to the ordinary Englishman when she speaks of the ‘unwashed rabble rousers’. My goodness me, if Caroline Glick wants to gain respect for having a clear and fair mind then she needs to break free of the closed circle of ‘debaters’ and experience the real world before she attempts to make a judgment.’
Nonsense. "This woman" (who has a name you refuse to use) is talking specifically about British elites and academics. I would extend this view to its entire diplomatic corps, which is virulently anti-Israel to the bone, William Hague being the latest example, bashing Israel nonstop while expecting NOTHING from the Arabs. She didn't label the average landscaper or truck driver an anti-Semite. Relax, and learn something about Caroline Glick, who is an amazing, and brave journalist, who routinely puts herself is tough spots like this and has also produced incredible YouTube videos skewering Hamas and its supporters.
You are probably correct on the same reaction on US campuses. But it is a mistake to attribute it to BHO.
The leftist inculcation of our universities began in the 1960’s and has continued ever since. To make matters even worse for attitudes towards Israel and in favor of Muslims, the oil rich Gulf States have endowed universities all over the US so now they are spewing Islamist propaganda from their newly created Middle East Departments.
This is important to comprehend because even when Obama is gone, even if Conservatives take back the government, the problem will continue as it did for decades under more conservative governments. The right has abandoned this front and the result is a more and more leftist population.
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