Russian military presence in Syria poses challenge to US-led intervention

Guardian (UK) ^ | Sunday 23 December 2012 16.30 EST | Julian Borger

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Russian military advisers are manning some of Syria's more sophisticated air defences – something that would complicate any future US-led intervention, the Guardian has learned.

The advisers have been deployed with new surface-to-air systems and upgrades of old systems, which Moscow has supplied to the Assad regime since the Syrian revolution broke out 21 months ago.

The depth and complexity of Syria's anti-aircraft defences mean that any direct western campaign, in support of a no-fly zone or in the form of punitive air strikes against the leadership, would be costly, protracted and risky. The possibility of Russian military casualties in such a campaign could have unpredictable geopolitical consequences.

Meanwhile, near-daily atrocities have kept western governments under pressure to act. A Syrian government air strike on a town near the central city of Hama on Sunday killed dozens of civilians queueing for bread, according to human rights activists.

Amateur footage from Halfaya showed mangled human remains strewn along a street where people had been blown off scooters and out of cars. One video showed a boy with his feet blown off. Piles of corpses could be seen beneath rubble outside a two-storey building the cameraman described as a bakery. It was unclear how many bodies were in the smoking ruins.

Human Rights Watch has previously accused the regime of targeting bakeries. The group warned the Assad regime that such targeted bombing of civilians represented war crimes. However, in the face of a Russian veto at the UN security council, the international criminal court has not had a mandate to investigate the atrocities committed by either side. The UN has put the death toll at more than 40,000 as the war continues to escalate.

[BullDog108]

ROTFLMAO!!!

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

fyi

[BullDog108]

This is one of those conflicts that I pray for BOTH sides to loose!

[Dr. Pritchett]

I DON’T UNDERSTAND ANY OF THIS!! I thought BO and Hillary were going to make all this go away because everyone around the world loves him (and not that crazy cowboy we had before). What is going on?? Why isn’t the world responding to his dashing leadership????

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

H/T to the Drudge Report.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Won't happen according to this:

Office of The Special Adviser on The Prevention of Genocide

The Responsibility to Protect

******************************************EXCERPT*****************************************

Prevention requires apportioning responsibility to and promoting collaboration between concerned States and the international community. The duty to prevent and halt genocide and mass atrocities lies first and foremost with the State, but the international community has a role that cannot be blocked by the invocation of sovereignty. Sovereignty no longer exclusively protects States from foreign interference; it is a charge of responsibility where States are accountable for the welfare of their people. This principle is enshrined in article 1 of the Genocide Convention and embodied in the principle of “sovereignty as responsibility” and in the concept of the Responsibility to Protect.

The three pillars of the responsibility to protect, as stipulated in the Outcome Document of the 2005 United Nations World Summit (A/RES/60/1, para. 138-140) and formulated in the Secretary-General's 2009 Report (A/63/677) on Implementing the Responsibility to Protect are:

1. The State carries the primary responsibility for protecting populations from genocide, war crimes, crimes against humanity and ethnic cleansing, and their incitement;
2. The international community has a responsibility to encourage and assist States in fulfilling this responsibility;
3. The international community has a responsibility to use appropriate diplomatic, humanitarian and other means to protect populations from these crimes. If a State is manifestly failing to protect its populations, the international community must be prepared to take collective action to protect populations, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations.

[Marine_Uncle]

Of course I don't want to see it happen. But if the US has to
get involved, the Russians had better vacate their how should
I put it, advisers from the SAM/AAA sites before they are
all picked off during air to ground interdiction missions.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Earlier thread:

Gas used in Homs leaves seven people dead and scores affected, activists say

[COBOL2Java]

But I thought, after the election, Bronco Bama told the Russkies he’d have more flexibility!

[pacpam]

Russia has a naval port in Syria. They will never give it up.

[Navy Patriot]

However, in the face of a Russian veto at the UN security council, the international criminal court has not had a mandate to investigate the atrocities committed by either side.

What? The glorious, democratic, US backed rebels have been committing war crimes?

Also convienently not mentioned is the same FIVE vetoes on the Security Council have made US intervention or interference in any way a violation of International Law and an Act of Aggressive Warfare, (a crime against humanity), as we are assisting a rebellion against an internationally recognized legal government of a sovereign nation.

Russia, on the other hand is legally operating by existing legal treaty with the Syrian government.

Should serious hostilities occur, the Russian use of force would be legal, and the US would be a rogue criminal state.

[COBOL2Java]

Russia has a naval port in Syria. They will never give it up.

Have no fear. Bronco Bama has never met a world leader to which he wouldn't capitulate.

[Navy Patriot]

...the international community must be prepared to take collective action to protect populations, in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations.

Exactly that, the Charter contains the Security Council, and there must be no veto from any member of the Council.The UN cannot authorize any action under International Law if there is any SC veto.

The entire Korean War (Police Action) was enabled because Russia (Soviet Union) walked out of the Security Council in a huff, and wasn't present to VETO the UN Police Action.

[DesertRhino]

If we HAVE to get involved? WHy do we HAVE to get involved? I couldn’t care less which side wins there. Well, actually thats not true. Assad would be better than the Al Qeida Moslem Brotherhood rebels.
I cannot believe anyone wants to risk a war with Russia, so we can join in on the side of Al Qeida. Is there any war we cannot find an excuse to get involved in?

[DesertRhino]

If we HAVE to get involved? WHy do we HAVE to get involved? I couldn’t care less which side wins there. Well, actually thats not true. Assad would be better than the Al Qeida Moslem Brotherhood rebels.
I cannot believe anyone wants to risk a war with Russia, so we can join in on the side of Al Qeida. Is there any war we cannot find an excuse to get involved in?

[Navy Patriot]

This is another one of those conflicts that we should amass troops at the Mexican border to deal with, and then leave them there.

Interestingly , the same left that hated LBJ (& loved Communists) and drove him from office for operating within our treaty with the legal government of South Vietnam, is the left that loves Obama's illegally sending US troops to fight and die for the Muslim Brotherhood Al-Queda terrorists building the World Caliphate.

Wouldn't want any Muslims to die when we can kill Christians with US assets.

[justa-hairyape]

Russia has a naval port in Syria. They will never give it up.

And Assad is not leaving as long as he can still fight. Note the article linked below is offered once for free then requires a registration the second time.

Assad isn't afraid of breaking the chemical weapons taboo in Syria

And BTW - The media always claims Assad's missiles are scuds. Unfortunately, he also has quite a few more accurate missiles. Can see him wasting the scuds on the rebels, and saving the more accurate missiles for the western invasion which is coming.

[Marine_Uncle]

Your questions are valid as well as very serious in nature, and I do share your sentiments. At least with Assad's military state in command there was some resemblance of partial peace in the area. Now things may get totally out of hand.
Merry Christmas.

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks Ernest. The French have had no trouble working as peacekeepers in southern Lebanon, and the Hizzies have been stockpiling missiles for years.