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How 'Cliff' Talks Hit the Wall
WSJ ^ | December 21, 2012 | PATRICK O'CONNOR and PETER NICHOLAS

Posted on 12/22/2012 8:56:08 AM PST by yoe

Congressional leaders and President Barack Obama called Friday for a return to negotiations to avert the so-called fiscal cliff, a day after talks cratered in a very public fashion when Republicans abandoned House Speaker John Boehner's backup plan.

In truth, talks to secure a big deficit-reduction deal had already broken down Monday afternoon in the office of Mr. Boehner (R., Ohio)......

[snip]A review of the negotiations, based on interviews with a dozen aides and lawmakers, suggests the problems lay in Mr. Boehner's inability to coax his rank-and-file to support a deal that raises taxes on higher-income Americans. Another factor was what Republicans saw as President Obama's unwillingness to bend when a deal was in sight, jamming the speaker with a deal his party couldn't swallow.

[snip] At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, "I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?"

"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: bewarethefff; bushtaxcuts; fiscalcliff; johnboehner; misshimyet; obamacare; zerocare
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"""Mr. Obama repeatedly lost patience with the speaker as negotiations faltered..."""

Obama can't seem to understand that some congressmen will not break their promises to constituents for any reason...surely Speaker Boehner respects that and has tried to convey to Barry O. that bullying him is not the way to go....I urge the Congress to stand firm with their promises rather than appease this "my way or the high way" president...Arrogant little community organizer ain't he...

1 posted on 12/22/2012 8:56:13 AM PST by yoe
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To: yoe

http://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com/2012/12/21/obama-boehner-and-the-fiscal-abyss-evidence-from-the-market/


2 posted on 12/22/2012 8:59:41 AM PST by whitedog57
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To: whitedog57

Sorry. Hit the post button too quickly.

This economist points out that there isn’t enough income tax to fund government spending. Period. It HAS to be budget cuts.

Obama is a community agitator and boneheaded narcissist. He can’t comprehend why people don’t want to fund government waste and want to protect themselves.

http://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com/2012/12/21/obama-boehner-and-the-fiscal-abyss-evidence-from-the-market/


3 posted on 12/22/2012 9:02:24 AM PST by whitedog57
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To: yoe
Arrogant little community organizer ain't he...

Yep, as well as arrogant little Marxist bastard is how I'd put it.

4 posted on 12/22/2012 9:03:18 AM PST by Marathoner (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: yoe
...talks to secure a big deficit-reduction deal had already broken down ...

I like to think my self reasonably well informed so imagine my surprise to read that there was a "big deficit-reduction deal" being discussed. All I knew of was a symbolic screw the rich and a the perpetual spend the country to oblivion talks. Where were these talks and who was involved? Did Obama know they were happening? Did Boehner shut them down? Inquiring minds want to know.

5 posted on 12/22/2012 9:05:38 AM PST by DaveyB (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. -John Adams)
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To: whitedog57

The “Cliff talks” hit the wall because Obama wanted them to.

Boehner kissed Obama’s ass with the $800 Billion dollars in screwing the rich, and he got nothing in return for it.

Obama doesn’t intend to cut spending, That’s what bought him the election.Obama doesn’t care about the wall it works for him.Everybody gets screwed with higher taxes, the military takes it up the butt, and Obama blames it all on Republicans, while eating ice cream and dinking Mai Tai’s in Hawaii.


6 posted on 12/22/2012 9:06:51 AM PST by Venturer
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To: yoe

So, WSJ says that it’s all Boner’s fault for not forcing Obama’s destructive wishes down the throats of congress.

Well, I’ll agree that a lot of this mess is Boner’s fault, but not quite the way this article puts it. Rather the reverse, in fact.

But . . . let’s not spoil Obama’s vacation by bothering him with phone calls or anything! First things first!


7 posted on 12/22/2012 9:09:39 AM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: yoe
"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

You get that, America. No matter what you have your ass is destroyed and we have won. All hail, communists America. I am your leader.

Now just wail and cry. I'll laugh all the way to the bank with trillions to play and buy the rest of America.

Regret throwing Romney in the drink yet? America lost it.

8 posted on 12/22/2012 9:10:14 AM PST by Logical me
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To: yoe

Ladies and Gentlemen; let us pause for a moment to consider the FACT that President Pee Wee and the rest of our federal government (except for the really essential government workers) will not be at their jobs and somehow, miraculously, the country won’t fall apart! Thank-you President Pee Wee for giving your supporters four days off. Could you make it more....and without pay?


9 posted on 12/22/2012 9:18:29 AM PST by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: yoe

Push socialists/totalitarians over the cliff.

“Do not listen to this sophistry by vested interests. The acceptance of these arguments will build legal plunder into a whole system. In fact, this has already occurred. The present-day delusion is an attempt to enrich everyone at the expense of everyone else; to make plunder universal under the pretense of organizing it.” - Bastiat

DEFUND their collectives. DEPOPULATE from every body politic in the country. This is a socialist-induced fiasco.

We have the template to rebuild...

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_transcript.html

” —That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. “


10 posted on 12/22/2012 9:23:07 AM PST by PGalt
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To: yoe

anyone who criticizes Boehner for not being able to make a deal with (appease) barry has not lived with and tried to bargain with a spoiled pampered petulant 14 year old

Now imagine one as president of the US


11 posted on 12/22/2012 9:23:23 AM PST by silverleaf (Age Takes a Toll: Please Have Exact Change)
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To: yoe

If the GOP leader can’t get his people to vote for tax increases for earnings > $1 million how can anyone expect an agreement for tax increases for earnings < $1 million?


12 posted on 12/22/2012 9:24:06 AM PST by Mike Darancette (Through the woods and over the cliff ....)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; ColdOne; Convert from ECUSA; ...

Thanks yoe.
At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, "I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?" "You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

13 posted on 12/22/2012 9:24:55 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: Logical me

Bravo!!!


14 posted on 12/22/2012 9:31:15 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: Cicero

/bingo!


15 posted on 12/22/2012 9:31:19 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: yoe

/bingo!


16 posted on 12/22/2012 9:31:19 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: Mike Darancette

/bingo!


17 posted on 12/22/2012 9:31:25 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: silverleaf

/bingo!


18 posted on 12/22/2012 9:31:44 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: yoe

Wait until after Jan 3rd when we have a new Speaker and then renew negotiations.


19 posted on 12/22/2012 9:34:18 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: whitedog57; All

The tax increases will increase the taxes some individuals have to pay, but it will not increase tax revenues to the treasury and it will not improve the economy.


20 posted on 12/22/2012 9:36:29 AM PST by Son House (Romney Plan: Cap Spending At 20 Percent Of GDP.)
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To: yoe

“Mr. Boehner’s inability to coax his rank-and-file to support a deal that raises taxes “

Make him swim in ice water naked for his idiocy.
Make him stay in until he truly repents.
Then make him stay in there to make it a solid sure and certain repentence.


21 posted on 12/22/2012 9:37:32 AM PST by Darksheare (Try my coffee, first one's free.....)
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To: yoe
"I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?"

"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

This actually makes perfect sense.
Ubama, after all, was elected and re-elected primarily by lazy moochers. And Ubama is the king of the moochers. So while the bums, deadbeats, and parasites who comprise the Democrat party base settle for "free" food stamps, welfare, SSDI, SSI, Section 8 housing, WIC, cellphones, etc., Ubama, king of the moochers, shouldn't have to settle for less than $800 billion... "for free", should he? I mean, he's king of the moochers, after all.

22 posted on 12/22/2012 9:42:31 AM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Mike Darancette

Reminded of a Martin Niemoller quote, in this case;

When the Democrats came for the ‘millionaires and billionaires’, I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a millionaire or billionaire...
Then they came for me, and there was no one left to speak for me.


23 posted on 12/22/2012 9:44:41 AM PST by Son House (Romney Plan: Cap Spending At 20 Percent Of GDP.)
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To: Logical me

That line is all I need to know. (I don’t subscribe to WSJ and can’t read the whole thing)

It’s 0bama’s my way or the highway governing at a glance. It’s why, for the 2nd time in my life, I won’t be watching an inauguration or State of the Union address. In fact, I’d like to see Republicans walk off the floor during it. THAT would give me something to cheer about.

I’m sick to death wth this reign of terror on my country. I’m cliff jumping next Wednesday, eff it. Job is done next month as well. Taking my chips off the table and hunkering down until this country grows a set and gets rid of this criminal.


24 posted on 12/22/2012 10:11:10 AM PST by SueRae (It isn't over. In God We Trust.)
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To: Logical me
"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

Prior to the 2008 election, Stanley Kurtz exhaustively researched the career of Barack Obama -- an effort that eventually resulted in his book: Radical-in-Chief -- Barack Obama and the Untold Story of American Socialism.

One of his most meaningful discoveries, in my opinion, was that Obama left every job he ever held with the specific intention of seeking "more power". As an attorney, or a community organizer, a state senator, even a U.S. Senator, he found -- and was frustrated by -- the inability to simply decree a desired outcome.

Consequently, you can be assured that he literally hates negotiating -- with Boehner...or anybody else. He is no doubt frustrated by the fact that, as POTUS, he cannot simply decree the result that he wants. By "more power" he means dictatorial control -- megalomania is at work in the Oval Office.

The best way to deal with a man like this is NOT to appease him, under any circumstances, but to steadfastly refuse to do his bidding. There is no "compromising" to be done, only firm and principled resistance can succeed. His plans must be frustrated at every turn.

Eventually, it will drive him over the edge...

25 posted on 12/22/2012 10:13:33 AM PST by okie01
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To: okie01
He is no doubt frustrated by the fact that, as POTUS, he cannot simply decree the result that he wants.

He acts and behaves as if he is a "Potentate"...divinely appointed to rule...

Look at the number of he EO's ?

After all the "smartest man" in the room doesn't need to haggle over inferior political positions and self serving principles of representative government

One day I hope this unseemly character flaw will catch up with him, but somehow I doubt it...

26 posted on 12/22/2012 10:22:18 AM PST by Popman (Gun control will not really control guns, but it will give the illusion of controlling people)
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To: Popman
One day I hope this unseemly character flaw will catch up with him, but somehow I doubt it...

It won't...until the Republicans in the House and the Senate learn to fight back.

And, if they do, as night follows day, it will.

27 posted on 12/22/2012 10:32:20 AM PST by okie01
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To: okie01
Bingo!! And what you do, is pass bills zeroing out spending. Let put a zero for the destructive Dept of Education, for Obama's Czar's, for Labor Dept, for all the EPA's grants of money to enviro groups, etc, etc, etc.

What do we hear from Boehner? "[whine} We don't control the government, we only have 1/2 of 1/3 of the government." Well, use the constitutional authority you have, Boehner. You haven't done a darn thing for 2 years. Boehner, you were made Speaker with the job of stopping Obama. You've enabled Obama. You deserve to be replaced. If the House GOP had the survival instincts of an amoeba (the true symbol of the GOP), they would replace you.

The amoeba is spineless, colorless and sexless, which is why that is the symbol of the GOP.

28 posted on 12/22/2012 10:40:38 AM PST by Jabba the Nutt (.Are they stupid, malicious or evil?)
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To: SueRae
Taking my chips off the table and hunkering down until this country grows a set and gets rid of this criminal.

Self defense firearms sales have sky rocketed since Obomas Affirmative Action presidency started. Those who make bunkers and fall out shelters cannot keep up with sales. Business is booming. People fear for their families, their nation, and their lives.

People can sense danger, and they're taking the actions necessary to protect themselves from it.

This is a good thing. Those smart enough to save themselves (or at least try) from this monster are the ones who will come out on top in the end. All the worshipers will be on their own. Oboma will not save them. He and his family will flee to a safer place, and his followers will be left to starve alone.

(Bow down and worship me, and all the things of the earth shall be yours (for free) - Oboma....er....I mean Satan to Jesus in the wilderness)

29 posted on 12/22/2012 10:54:53 AM PST by concerned about politics ("Get thee behind me, Liberal")
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To: okie01
One of his most meaningful discoveries, in my opinion, was that Obama left every job he ever held with the specific intention of seeking "more power". As an attorney, or a community organizer, a state senator, even a U.S. Senator, he found -- and was frustrated by -- the inability to simply decree a desired outcome.

Consequently, you can be assured that he literally hates negotiating -- with Boehner...or anybody else. He is no doubt frustrated by the fact that, as POTUS, he cannot simply decree the result that he wants. By "more power" he means dictatorial control -- megalomania is at work in the Oval Office.

BINGO! The funny thing is, though, when you try to tell any of his supporters this kind of stuff (and believe me I've tried) they either look at you like you've just blasphemed God and/or just accuse you of racism and that's that.

30 posted on 12/22/2012 11:32:05 AM PST by Marathoner (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: yoe

Ironically, going over the fiscal cliff may be the one thing that keeps us from getting a second credit downgrade.

So far, neither Plan A or Plan B show any meaningful spending cuts that would give any rating agency cause for thinking we’ve learned how to deal with gubmint’s profligate ways.

And if a plan emerges that is more of the same...or they push some type of continuing resolution, I can almsot predict a second downgrade could hit before inauguration day.


31 posted on 12/22/2012 11:42:07 AM PST by SueRae (It isn't over. In God We Trust.)
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To: yoe; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; NFHale; Impy; AuntB; ...
RE : [snip] At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, “I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?” “You get nothing,” the president said. “I get that for free.”

That is how the game is played to win,

Obama gets on TV everyday playing to voters on how he is doing everything humanly possible to get a deal because it is so critical to save the American people while telling Bohner in private to go to hell .

Then next year after all the tax rates go up Obama gets on TV again and proposes a middle class tax cut(and he will call it ‘tax relief’), up to income earned of $200/250K , sound familiar? (and he demands that the house increase the debt limit, unemployment comp, FICA, ertc)

Then what can Bohner say on TV?

“No tax cut because I am against that” ?
Or “No tax cut because that is not big enough” ?
Or “No tax cut because you left out the ......aires” ?

I think no one will be beggin for THAT job.

32 posted on 12/22/2012 11:48:02 AM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: okie01

Bravo! At last some reasonableness on this thread.
I don’t believe anyone here could have lasted as
long as Boehner has, while fighting four wars
at the same time, i.e., the RINO’s, the TeaPartiers,
the Media and the well schooled Chicago street fighter.
This article made the top of the front page of the
WSJ this AM. It’s concise and fair. Obama has the
power. Boehner has drawn an un-winable hand, and
will not possibly be able to make all of you happy!


33 posted on 12/22/2012 11:53:34 AM PST by seenenuf ( Save the Right Supremes.)
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To: yoe; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; NFHale; Impy
RE : [snip] At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, “I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?” “You get nothing,” the president said. “I get that for free.”

This reminds me of near the end of the God-Father in Las Vegas Michael Corleone says to Moe Green : “You get nothing. You will even pay for my gaming license fee”

34 posted on 12/22/2012 12:08:18 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: Marathoner
The funny thing is, though, when you try to tell any of his supporters this kind of stuff (and believe me I've tried) they either look at you like you've just blasphemed God and/or just accuse you of racism and that's that.

Inside every liberal, there is a totalitarian. Since they know what is best for you -- and everybody else -- it would be so much easier to simply order you to do as they say.

In discussions with dozens of liberals, I am convinced that they would have no problem whatsoever with a dictator in the White House...so long as he was their's.

35 posted on 12/22/2012 12:45:22 PM PST by okie01
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To: yoe; Perkalong; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; NFHale; Impy; ..
OK. it was the Godfather II and it was Michael Corleone's answer to Senator Pat Geary:
You can have my answer now Senator, if you like. My final offer is this: nothing. Not even the fee for to the gaming license, which I would appreciate if you would put up personally

Compare with Obama's answer to Bohner:
At one point, according to notes taken by a participant, Mr. Boehner told the president, “I put $800 billion [in tax revenue] on the table. What do I get for that?” “You get nothing,” the president said. “I get that for free.”

Its uncanny.

36 posted on 12/22/2012 12:46:01 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: yoe
Obama can't seem to understand

that he is not King. He is not an Emperor. Every one of the people he is not negotiating with, also won an election.

37 posted on 12/22/2012 12:50:57 PM PST by LibertarianLiz
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To: yoe

Obama never had any intention of reaching any agreement. While Boehner may not have been the best negotiator in the world, it didn’t matter. Obama wouldn’t have budged no matter what. And now, of course, he’s blaming the GOP for even having offered a program.


38 posted on 12/22/2012 1:27:09 PM PST by livius
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To: yoe
"You get nothing," the president said. "I get that for free."

Not yet, you don't you paper-hanging Marxist SOB. And hopefully you never will.

39 posted on 12/22/2012 1:52:30 PM PST by Jim Robinson (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God!!)
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To: yoe

“You get nothing. I get that for free.”

End of discussion. Boehner should put every GOP congressman in front of a microphone to repeat that quote, then have each walk away. This is the message to whomever will listen that there is no negotiating with the Marxist. Over the cliff we go.


40 posted on 12/22/2012 2:10:18 PM PST by BlueStateRightist (Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2

Wait until after Jan 3rd when we have a new Speaker and then renew negotiations.

Not going to be a new speaker.


41 posted on 12/22/2012 2:16:11 PM PST by martiangohome
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To: sickoflibs

Where do you see the “end going”?


42 posted on 12/22/2012 2:43:44 PM PST by Perdogg (Mark Levin - It's called the Bill of Rights not Bill of Needs)
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To: yoe

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd3shl8kFuo


43 posted on 12/22/2012 2:55:11 PM PST by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today.)
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To: Perdogg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAqyWpBo9OU


44 posted on 12/22/2012 3:03:40 PM PST by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today.)
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To: Perdogg; yoe; Perkalong; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; ...
RE :”Where do you see the “end going”?”

Its always risky looking too far out, but it looks very bad right now.
You are not going to like it. This is why O will make sure we go off the cliff, which is an easy job for him because so many on R side are working to make sure they get blamed.

1) No one tries for Bohners job Speaker because they don't want to be in that seat leading to the 2014 midterms, they leave him as the 'blame goat'.
2) taxes go up, unemployment comp runs out, FICA... stock market tanks ,....all hell breaks loose.
3) GOP in house who is/are already getting the blame has the heat turned up on them at home by angry voters
4) Bohner EVENTUALLY takes Os terms of surrender to his House, he gets just enough R votes to pass it with Pelosi Dems, the others take the ‘principled’ stand. He claim she got something in return, a fig leaf.
5) Republicans lose House to Pelosi next midterm in 2 years, Reid picks up more seats, Democrats own DC again in 2015,
6) Obama completes his mission in his last two years, America is never the same.
But maybe todays voters get mad at Dems in four years after #6, but by then millions of new dreamers can vote Dem after immigration reform,

But it wasnt all a waste, this house passed 33 symbolic repeals of O-care. That made a difference,, right?

Fools!

45 posted on 12/22/2012 5:08:36 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: SunkenCiv

The Republican house members are not as easily moved as the MOTY selection committee at Time Magazine or the Nobel Peace Prize Committee.


46 posted on 12/22/2012 7:29:33 PM PST by Mike Darancette (Through the woods and over the cliff ....)
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To: Perdogg; yoe; Perkalong; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; ...

Llast year 2011 this GOP house took on three MAJOR confrontations with O and they got beat up on all of them, a fourth could be the election.
But unlike this one before hand most freepers were claiming that they would be wins because the voters would fall behind them. This one is different than that.

Most comments I read on this standoff the posters say they think that Republicans will be blamed for anything that goes wrong in this fight, and by coincidence, that is what Rush is telling them too, but its still full steam ahead,

I read lots of beer bravery :”I don’t care if Republicans get blamed and lose the election, its principle” lately. SO I made up a list of Os and Pelosis to-do list after taking full control of the congress in 2015:

Repeal DOMA (gays get federal marriage benefits)

Immigration reform (give poor illegal’s the vote(for Dem), and free Obama-care, and tax credits)

Gun Safety laws (your gun can hold the max five bullets and it costs $500 in taxes to register)

Obama care fixes (raise the uninsured fine and make it more progressive)

Retirement savings reform( remove tax deferment for 401Ks except if it invests in government bonds)

Reproductive freedom (Obama-care expanded to all (free) abortions for any reason)

Climate Change (Cap and Trade taxes)


47 posted on 12/22/2012 7:46:20 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: sickoflibs

Your predictions will come true if the GOP chooses yet again to throw conservatives under the bus and blame them for everything. Conservativism wins when genuine conservatives are not sandbagged by the GOP establishment. If we don’t want Pelosi to do these thing GOP must not compomise one inch with President Obama. The American people will support conservatives when they see REAL conservatives in Congress, not Scott Brown RINOs.


48 posted on 12/22/2012 10:22:17 PM PST by Perkalong (GOP 2012 = Whigs 1856)
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To: Perkalong; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; NFHale; Impy; ...
RE :”Your predictions will come true if the GOP chooses yet again to throw conservatives under the bus and blame them for everything. Conservativism wins when genuine conservatives are not sandbagged by the GOP establishment. If we don’t want Pelosi to do these thing GOP must not compomise one inch with President Obama. The American people will support conservatives when they see REAL conservatives in Congress, not Scott Brown RINOs.”

Well the polls all show most Americans blame Republicans and agree with Obama, but I guess we can say that those polls are all rigged just like the ones saying Romney would win.

But the proof in the pudding is that NO Republican in the House will challenge O to be speaker because they all know that is a losing job, be Os bitch for two years then be replaced by Pelosi in 2015.

If there was a single Republican in the House who believes what you say he would run for Speaker. But no its much easier to hide from that like a fwightened wabbit then make those symbolic NO votes while O gets everything he wants.

The 33 symbolic O-care repeal votes this house session were meaningless. What a huge waste of a God given opportunity. Rs are the loser party.

49 posted on 12/22/2012 10:45:17 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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To: Perkalong; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; Gilbo_3; NFHale; Impy; ...

Look, Scott Brown made a lot of brave votes for Republicans given the MA voters who voted him in. This bashing of him is BS. He was beat by a marxist.

You really think a Jim DeMint would win MA where Warren won? Hell, he got the hell out of the Senate knowing what is coming.

You really think a 15 state strategy will work?
If conservatives really believe in something they must make it popular in states like MA so Brown can beat a Liz Warren. Not lose and whine and self destruct.


50 posted on 12/22/2012 10:58:25 PM PST by sickoflibs (Dems know how to win. Rs know how to whine.)
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