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Sunday Morning Talk Show Thread 25 November 2012
Various driveby media television networks ^ | 25 November 2012 | Various Self-Serving Politicians and Big Media Screaming Faces

Posted on 11/25/2012 5:07:30 AM PST by Alas Babylon!

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To: lodi90

I could not agree with you more!!!


101 posted on 11/25/2012 9:15:35 AM PST by mtnwmn (Liberalism leads to Socialism)
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To: Bernard
Agree with your analysis on pre and post crash. The welfare state is unsustainable and its collapse is inevitable. Unfortunately, it could take a long time to happen as long as the Dems can tax and spend and eviscerate the military--guns versus butter. In the meantime, the rapidily changing demographics of this country fueled by immigration and minority birthrates will make the Dems the permanent majority party at the federal level.

I really see no way the Reps win in 2016 regardless of how Obama performs in office. Hillary will be the next President barring some health issue or something else preventing a run. She is next in line and Obama will support her. Bill's enthusiastic support on the campaign trail was just building up the chips for an Obama endorsement in 2016.

102 posted on 11/25/2012 9:41:56 AM PST by kabar
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To: Fishtalk
If you believe in majority rule buys, accept that gubmint health care is here to stay. The best we can do is get busy fixing every damn thing wrong with it.

That's a fool's errand. "Fixing it" will make it worse. Medicare costs nine times what the USG estimated. Obamacare is a huge new entitlement program. It is going to wreck the healthcare system and bankrupt the country even faster.

Once the "pain" of Obamacare kicks in next year and in 2014, there will be a huge public outcry to ameliorate the pain. The doctors and hospitals will revolt against the reduction in payments that make up much of the $716 billion taken from Medicare. The employers will shift tens of millions of their employees off of their plans and put them into state and federal exchanges. And the individual mandate will not work in terms of putting more people into insurance plans.

The result will be tremendous public pressure on the politicians to fix things. So like the doc fix, the lower reimbursement rates for doctors and hospitals will be postponed. Penalties on employers to keep employees on the rolls will be increased so that people don't lose their current healthcare providers. On and on it will go to "fix" a 2700 page monstrosity. There will be plenty of unintended consequences. And the Reps will be blamed.

It is a lose-lose proposition for the Reps to get involved in fixing Obamacare, which was always set up to fail eventually so we can move into a single payer system. Obama said that himself. Obamacare is just an interim step.

103 posted on 11/25/2012 9:57:57 AM PST by kabar
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To: Fishtalk
I don't believe abortion is a losing issue. We just need to frame it in an emotional way. To sell pro-life to younger people we should try something like this.

You are lucky to be alive. When you are enjoying your Christmas dinner with the whole family, appreciate your parents for they could have aborted you. In fact, they may have aborted an older brother or sister. There might have been more family members to share in the joy of the season. For 2 generations now, Americans have been choosing to abort their unborn children at the rate of over a million a year. You may have had more aunts and uncles or cousins if not for the ease in which democrats think that human life should be ended for convenience.

Democrats are so concerned with a woman's right to choose to be kill their unborn babies, that they don't think of the harm they cause to us all. They'll bring up rape and incest - and those are legitimate quandaries - but the majority of abortions are performed on women who simply don't want to be pregnant. Liberals have taught your generation it's normal to have sex before marriage, to hook-up, to be sluts, to experiment. They appeal to people's basest instincts. Abortion is so easy, and Abortion is big business and abortionists are big democrat donors. So abortion is good. What they haven't told you is there are consequences - diseases, unwanted pregnancies, and shattered lives.

They say they want abortion to be legal, safe and rare. Well, it is legal, but not safe and certainly not rare. 1 and a half million babies are killed in the womb every year. Your nieces, nephews, sons and daughters are being murdered every year. That is a tremendous waste of potential brain power. 50 million future Americans wiped out under the surgical techniques of democrat donors. Who can even argue that this is a good thing? Yet some elected officials act as though lives are just collateral damage.

Democrats teach you it's your body and you can do what you want. They are making it acceptable for you to be no more than barnyard animals, who have no control over their natural desires. Liberals have made children disposable, which led to fathers being disposable. Many of you grew up with no dads. Women were taught they don't need a husband and children don't need fathers. Children of divorce and children of single moms, do you agree? How different would your life had been if your dad had been there?

They say they're open minded when they encourage us to do what we know in our hearts is wrong. It's not true, but they say it anyway. Ask yourselves why. Why is it so important to them that teenagers have sex? What is their agenda in saying it's ok to experiment? Why does it bother them that some people encourage abstinence? Why should they care if some people want to be chaste? Ask yourselves why is abstinence education so threatening to their agenda? Why do they want you to act like animals? Which position is better for you and society in the long run? Ask yourself, if children are the future, why do democrats advocate the killing of the children?

104 posted on 11/25/2012 10:03:44 AM PST by Betty Jane
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To: mtnwmn
We have to figure out a way.

Long term, start with cutting off the propaganda routine in the public education system. The easiest thing in the world is to be a liberal - it is a little child that throws temper tantrums when they don't get what they want and what they have been told they deserve. It takes hard work and understanding of freedoms to be a conservative.

As Rush says, how can you go up against Baraq O'Clause and expect to win?

60 years in the making - go back and read the " THE 45 COMMUNIST GOALS AS READ INTO THE CONGRESSIONAL RECORD, 1963"

OBAMA WON BECAUSE HE BOUGHT HIS ELECTION WITH FREE TAXPAYER FUNDED "STUFF" - I don't know any GOP candidate that can win against that. The entire system has to be blown up and started anew - just my opinion.
105 posted on 11/25/2012 10:06:42 AM PST by Cheerio (Barry Hussein Soetoro-0bama=The Complete Destruction of American Capitalism)
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To: Twotone

Pro-life Republicans would have a better case if they used a human rights arguement. Abortion butchers physically weak and politically powerless living human beings in American society simply because these weak and powerless living human beings are an inconvenience to the permanent ruling aristocracy in Washington D.C. and their ministers of truth in America’s newsrooms and faculty lounges.

Pro-choice Republicans would offer irresponsible parents the choice of which doctor fixes them (vasectomy/tubectomy) when they become parents for the second time without the ability to provide basic needs for the child they produce.

Every federal judge and judicial nominee should be able to explain the difference between a living human being and a human being that isn’t alive. Same with U.S. Senators and Representatives.


106 posted on 11/25/2012 10:17:47 AM PST by sforkjoe57 (How much longer must Americans be slaves to the stupidity of John Maynard Keynes?)
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To: Betty Jane

All I can say is that you worded it beautifully.

Never will one of those Blue Blood elites say such a thing.

I think emphasizing humanity, the importance of the MALE in all this.

And so for a surprise I will tell you why that birth control thing for free is so important to women. Well, SOME women, but I can give you a perspctive, thank me very much.

Say you’re a young woman, mid to late 2’0’s, single, pursuing goals, looking for Mr. Right. Taking birth controls pills is great for married women, women in a long relationship. She goes to GYN once a year, gets scrip, takes pills, six/seven bucks a month...easy enough.

A single woman, she don’t want to take birth control pills ALL the time. Chances are better than even she’ll only be in a relationship involiving intimacy once every six months or so.

But if she don’t take birth control pills, or happens to run into Mr. Right during a long term dry spell, as concerns intimacy...romance, let’s not be crass about it. Millions of young women out there in that position. Make fun of Fluke all you want but there IS a logic working here, just need a former wommins libber like me to splain.

So she’s got to wonder should she go to GYN to get the scrip, then she has to pay deductible, rule of thumb, sex on third date....hmmmmmm.

And a young single female looking for the right guy is in this position maybe three times or so a year, paying deductible for scrips, paying for GYN.

Now they could, just throwing out common sense, NOT MAKE IT NECESSARY FOR GYN TO BUY BC PILLS!

But GYNs they give the politicos lots of money.

The young female voter, who does vote, feels like men get a break cause they don’t need a doctor/scrip, deductibles, to use a condom. And if she gets preggers cause the planning didn’t c ome out quite right, then the right wings gives her a fit for getting an abortion .

I emphasize...know your enemy. I’’m helping out here.


107 posted on 11/25/2012 10:18:08 AM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: carenot

I appreciate all that info. Unfortunately, I have no TV.


108 posted on 11/25/2012 10:21:00 AM PST by upchuck (America's at an awkward stage. Too late to work within the system, too early to shoot the bastards.)
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To: kabar
Can't agree on Hillary in 2016; she has been caught napping in public again, this time by herself. As she gets older and more vulnerable, it's less likely that the other ethnic groups who think they make the difference for the Dems are going to wait their turn, whenever that night be.
109 posted on 11/25/2012 10:22:16 AM PST by Bernard ('He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else' - Benjamin Franklin)
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To: kabar

Ok, one more than I’m done.

I’m not disputing a word in your comment. Indeed I take as close to true ever statement you made.

Though you seem to think the pubs should just let it go as written till it ends up where planned...or till the public has had enough....well you could be right on that as well. I’m given pause to the concept.

Why?

I’ve read a lot of the provisions of Obamacare, how it will be enforced, how it will work.

Frankly, it’s not all that bad.

Okay, hear me out.

I dare, double dare, a single one of you to take self-righteous umbrage at the fact that discipline over the new Obamacare plan will be made via your paycheck or income tax return.

How dare you be outraged when paychecks have FOR DECADES been used to enforce the following laws: child support, debts from taxes or judgements, alimony. For decades employers have been charged with doing, for no recompense, enforcing social laws because what better way to get first dibs at the spigot than the person’s very paycheck?

Oh, employers are charged with other social tasks, such as checking immigration, notifying the IRS that subject wants to claim 99 exemptions, goodness I’ve had thirty years of experience and I know this, yes I do.

So if a person does NOT have health insurance as required by Obamacare, they will take your tax refund and attach your paycheck to pay the penalty.

Do not get sniffy about it, the private sector will once again be forced to do the gubmint’s work.

It works. Attaching paychecks work.

It’s why all the extra IRS agents. They will be issuing judgements and such. Indeed, it does not surprise me.

If subject does NOT have health insurance their paycheck will be attached and only if they work thereonin under the table will subject be safe from gubmint attachment.

Again, thank me very much.

This WILL happen, count on it.

Whether pubs should get involved, whether public will get incensed enough to get it outta there, I dunno.

But we lost the battle.


110 posted on 11/25/2012 10:31:47 AM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: Alas Babylon!

So, the propaganda boils down to:

Republicans are for the Rich
-A Rich that is evil and lucky (no hard work involved here, unless you’re a movie or rock star—and they CARE!), and is taking from the PEOPLE

Republicans are RACIST
-A party of rich, evil white guys who HATE blacks, Mexicans, Orientals and Arabs

Republicans are Religious Fundamentalists
-A party of women getting raped and forced to have babies; prevented from buying birth control and forced to pray to Jesus

Republicans hate Mother Earth

Republicans love big oil buddies

Republicans love war

Goosh, I could keep this up all day. Still, all of it is lies—but we cannot overcome this level of media involvement in the POLITICAL process. Moreover, it’s moved into our schools, music, culture... I don’t have a single answer to fix it.


I echo your frustration...This premise is exactly correct. Rush isn’t the leader of the RNC, but instead, articulates our beliefs to a large audience which the RNC, does not believe for their insulated, limited by the Beltway, arrogance.

We will win when we have consultants who are willing to stealthily re-educate the electorate in what it means to be American, that is, Hispanics and Blacks as well. This means do it with boldness, not avoiding dictators like 0bama in the national election...Mitt, with all his faults and past liberal Rebuplican tendencies would have won had he had a staff who would have “gone with boldness” as Rush mentions almost daily.

How do we get a candidate who will be bold? Who acatually runs the RNC? Who “elects” Reince Preibus? While what I am saying sounds like we need a Third Party, I am in no way saying this...that is Perot all over again. Convincing those in charge to do the bold, re-education route and have Palin& West as your ticket is the way to go.

It’s kinda like sending a letter to the RNC that says, I will promise to send X$ to you if Palin&West are the ticket, but will boycott otherwise...

Here’s an example of my frustration. I have been married 17 yrs interracially. My wife’s family upper scale black with 100% voting record D. 0bamma would have had to kill someone personally - and even then - they’d still vote for him.

I called the Columbus RNC and volunteered as well as the Cincinnati/Hamilton County RNC to volunteer...that is, as a consultant to help understand what it would take to convince blacks...what language, what triggers, etc....

I have a huge plethora or cornucopia of what would and would not work...inside info if you will...did they listen to me? Nope. Were they interested? They didn’t know where to file it. I won’t give up, however. I’ll approach them again in a different way and talk to the right people.

You see, we are dealing with old school RNC; we have to be smarter...the DNC wants us to start a 3rd party; they know that is a civil war amongst ourselves...we need to takeover the RNC...that is the way.


111 posted on 11/25/2012 10:54:36 AM PST by CincyRichieRich (Keep your head up and keep moving forward!)
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To: Fishtalk
I’m signing on to the Libertarian ticket

Sorry, I can't abide those smug, drug-addled, baby-killing packers, pretending to be conservatives

up to and UNTIL the Tea Party finally forms.

The TEA party had better be bustin-butt right now, to take over the GOP, or they are certainly guaranteed to be relegated to the ash heap of history.

If they run separately they will doom all of us to a continuation of this socialist wrecking ball.

112 posted on 11/25/2012 11:23:26 AM PST by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves" Month)
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To: Bernard
If Hillary gets the Dem nomination, she wins the general election hands down. She will be our first woman President, a rebuke to the Reps WOW. Hispanics love Hillary more than Obama. Hillary could choose an Hispanic or black to be her VP.

Bill Clinton enjoys a 65% approval rating despite his daliances with Monica and others and being only the second President ever impeached.

I believe we have reached a tipping point. It no longer matters how well you performed in office as long as you have a D after your name.

113 posted on 11/25/2012 12:08:23 PM PST by kabar
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To: Fishtalk
I’ve read a lot of the provisions of Obamacare, how it will be enforced, how it will work. Frankly, it’s not all that bad.

I question your understanding of Obamacare and how it will work. Leaving aside the onerous and odious Big Government approach to healthcare that never works anywhere it is tried, putting something down on paper is no guarantee of success. The real world has a way of intruding on the utopians who fail to grasp what motivates people and human behavior. I forgot who said it, but essentially only Americans can make communism work.

So if a person does NOT have health insurance as required by Obamacare, they will take your tax refund and attach your paycheck to pay the penalty.

The law provides a phase in for the individual mandate and its penalties: In 2014, $95 penalty or 1.0% of individuals’ income. It rises to $325 or 2.0% of income in 2015, and $695 or 2.5% of income in 2016.

I can see many healthy adults choosing the penalty and not getting insurance, which will raise the costs of medical care since the insurance companies are planning on an infusion of healthy enrollees who will pay into the system and thereby decreasing overall costs. Since you can get health care coverage with preexisting conditions, why not wait until you really get sick before enrolling?

If subject does NOT have health insurance their paycheck will be attached and only if they work thereonin under the table will subject be safe from gubmint attachment.

I wonder how that will work at hospital ERs that must treat all patients, including the 12 to 20 million illegal aliens. And aside from the government attaching earnings, there is no criminal penalty. I can see enforcement being fraught with all kinds of problems. How much government intrusion into one's life and how large a bureaucracy will be necessary to enforce these provisions? Very few tax returns are audited now. I can see fraudulent paperwork to substantiate that one has health insurance.

But we lost the battle.

You can lose the battle and not the war. In any event, if you really want to inform yourself about the real impact of Obamacare, take a look at this analysis by the Heritage Foundation. This isn't only about how the IRS will enforce the individual mandate, it is about how Obamacare will destroy our economy and lower the quality of and access to health care. You have a rather narrow view of what this is all about or how estensive the impact will be on all of us.

The Case Against Obamacare:

114 posted on 11/25/2012 12:40:20 PM PST by kabar
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To: kabar

Kabar,

please.

Do not question my understanding of Obamacare and how it would work, you’re smart but damn you’re a bit smug.

I understand plenty about Obamacare. You know a lot but you don’t know EVERYTHING.

You make points, points that need long discussion, not just a quick snide on a FreeRepublic thread.

This country will never turn away people from an emergency room, insurance or no insurance, even with the illegals using ER’s as a doctor’s office.

We, implicitly to be sure, agree that it is better to err on giving care as called for than to have ER people sorting out who has insurance, who has not. That is a job for God.

I understand the law provides a graduated entrance into OBama care, what’s your point? The law also gives those making under $97,000 or thereabouts a subsidy on their annual cost of health insurance.

See Kabar, I KNOW that Obamacare is a crappy law, about a big a piece of crap ever crafted. It HAD to be to get it passed.

Now it’s the law of the land and I really don’t care if you don’t like it. It’s been run through the Supreme Court, it’s been run by the voters, it’s been discussed, mocked and debated. Ryan offered an alternative and the voters didn’t buy it.

Just cause Kabar don’t like it won’t make it go away.

Sure the House could not fund it, try some tricks. It’ll just make the pubs look small, appear to be thwarting the will of the people.

You provide a lot of facts and figures, and good arguments, but there’s so MUCH you leave out.

You must be a Blue Blood Republican or something.


115 posted on 11/25/2012 1:23:14 PM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: bray
Exactly, my theory is that you can only fool people for so long.
116 posted on 11/25/2012 1:28:47 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: chiller

You gotta remember Mitt was not a 100% candidate few are.
Were it not for traitorous rinos in the party I think Mitt could have won.


117 posted on 11/25/2012 1:31:06 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: Alas Babylon!

My Gators came through somehow too.I still don’t quite know how they pulled it off.!
To celebrate we just went to see “Skyfall” it was really good.


118 posted on 11/25/2012 1:33:54 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: Cheerio

Greta catch Cheerio.I think my biggest objective would be to make the DBM afraid of us. Once they are afraid of pissing us off instead of the left we win they lose.we also have the power of the purse. If we stop supporting their advertisers we can effectively call their bluff.


119 posted on 11/25/2012 1:36:52 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: bray

Smart move a few weeks ago I made a couple of hundred calls on behalf of getting the vote out. We only called from a pubbie list. Big mistake.Next time we need to call indys first and pubbies second. Most on our side had already voted.


120 posted on 11/25/2012 1:39:27 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: lodi90

Romney tried that he was overwhelmed by adds from colin powell supporting zero,by photos of the fat busturd holding zero’s hand and other issues dreamed up by the bent axel. Contraception, class warfare,big bird, you name it anything to stay away from the real issues. The inane,stupid party was successful in getting the drivebys to run out the clock until zero could win. Even Benghazi was not the issue it should have been.
When you think about it the Sunday shows are a mini-microcosm of what happens in an election.
They give our side precious little time never a follow up and change the topic immediately whenever we get any traction. They did it today with Linda Graham after he hammered Stuffy.Control is a scary thing and they have it.
Takes guts to stand up and shout from the roof tops that you are mad won’t take it anymore and demand that we balance a non-existent budget or stop the crazed spending.


121 posted on 11/25/2012 1:49:24 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: lodi90

We need Freepers instead of luke warm pubbies on the air to shout out what the problems are and hold the commies accountable.


122 posted on 11/25/2012 1:51:08 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: CincyRichieRich
we need to takeover the RNC...that is the way.

You hit it Richie. That is the only way. A turd party assures our destruction which is what the left would love.

123 posted on 11/25/2012 1:59:44 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: Fishtalk

Kabar has 30 years experience in the State Dept. This guy knows the inner workings of govt.


124 posted on 11/25/2012 2:01:50 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: TomGuy

Problem is Tom there are only a few that can raise the money necessary to run have any charisma at all and are house hold names.
I count mitt Sarah and Marco hard to come up with many others. None are 100 per centers.I think if Marco realizes the many issues involved in immigration/amnesty et. all he will keep our views in mind.I see him as a conservative first.


125 posted on 11/25/2012 2:07:32 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin our secret weapon)
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To: rodguy911

And how is your charismatic household name leader who can raise a billion bucks realistically and win for our side?


I don’t see anyone who fits this category who can get nominated by the Republicans. Can you?


126 posted on 11/25/2012 2:07:32 PM PST by PaleoBob
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To: rodguy911

Are you chiding me?

Do we all lose rebuttal rights for Kabar’s experience?

I offered good arguments. And you put me down?

I should shut up when Kabar speaks?


127 posted on 11/25/2012 2:09:39 PM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: shalom aleichem

I believe most newspapers were once owned by conservatives. Maybe they were simply overwhelmed by the flood of brash investigative “journOlists” from libery schools, and literally sold out?


There was a time when newspaper profits were linked to circulation. Owners tended to be businessmen, looking to make a buck.

Most BigLib newspapers today are small segments of mega publishing/broadcasting empires. They lose oodles of money but the owners don’t care — in part because the lefty flagships help them maintain their liberal bona fides, which is worth plenty to them in terms of influence and Washington dealmaking.


128 posted on 11/25/2012 2:12:38 PM PST by PaleoBob
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To: rodguy911

Man....to stand tall and state that the government should have a budget, that everyone has a budget even if not written, even if only based on supply of money versus demand....you think that takes guts?

Seems like common sense.

Give Mumbles McConnell a stiff drink or something afore he has to go admitting in public that the senate hasn’t voted on a budget AS REQUIRED BY LAW....for yea long.

If that action takes guts, and you may be right, but damn, we’re lost.


129 posted on 11/25/2012 2:12:48 PM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: Fishtalk
You argue like a Democrat. Lots of emotion but short on facts. When you state that, I’ve read a lot of the provisions of Obamacare, how it will be enforced, how it will work. Frankly, it’s not all that bad. then I must take exception to your understanding of Obamacare and its impact on this country. If that is being "smug," then so be it.

You make points, points that need long discussion, not just a quick snide on a FreeRepublic thread.

I provided you with an excellent analysis of Obamacare by The Heritage Foundation. It goes into plenty of detail as why the numbers don't work on Obamacare and the impact it will have.

This country will never turn away people from an emergency room, insurance or no insurance, even with the illegals using ER’s as a doctor’s office.

SCOTUS has made that decision for us. The ERs can't turn people away even if the medical conditions are really not an emergency. It is why so many ERs have shut down near our Southern border. And ER usage even went up in MA under Romneycare. Obamacare was supposed to get everyone covered but an estimated 30 million in this country will remain uninsured.

We, implicitly to be sure, agree that it is better to err on giving care as called for than to have ER people sorting out who has insurance, who has not. That is a job for God.

LOL. Yeah and who picks up the tab? And if Obamacare results in clogging up our ERs with non-emergency conditions, how does this affect access with those who have emergencies. I have been to the ER in the metro DC area and waited for hours for treatment for myself or my family. You just have to look around the waiting rooms to see who is there.

FYI: Four out of every ten children born in this country are paid by Medicaid. Obamacare will add another 18 million to the 70 million in this country on Medicaid. The states pay about half the costs of Medicaid patients. Eventually, they will have to pick up half of those costs added under Obamacare after the first few years, which is why some states have decided not to expand their Medicaid programs per the SCOTUS decision that allows them to do that and not be penalized by the Federal government.

Now it’s the law of the land and I really don’t care if you don’t like it. It’s been run through the Supreme Court, it’s been run by the voters, it’s been discussed, mocked and debated. Ryan offered an alternative and the voters didn’t buy it.Just cause Kabar don’t like it won’t make it go away.

You can make this personal all you want, but it is not about my opinion. Obamacare will cost hundreds of thousands of jobs, reduce actual access to health care, undermine the quality of our healthcare and bankrupt us. I don't have to accept such a law even if it won't go away.

You started your rambling discourse by advocating that the Reps do their best to fix it. I disagree because it can't be fixed and certainly not according to what conservatives want. Obama and the Dem controlled Senate will ensure that any fixes meet their criteria and philosophy. The Reps would be dumb to have their fingerprints on it. If you weren't allowed to participate at the takeoff, then you sure as hell shouldn't be there when it crashes. SS and Medicare are already in the red and adding a third huge failed entitlement program is the last thing this country needed.

Sure the House could not fund it, try some tricks. It’ll just make the pubs look small, appear to be thwarting the will of the people. You provide a lot of facts and figures, and good arguments, but there’s so MUCH you leave out.

I would be happy to discuss it in further detail if you want. If the Reps are afraid to stand on principle and don't want to look small, then they are part of the problem. Most Americans still do not support Obamacare. The Dems intentionally delayed the "pain" parts of Obamacare until after the 2012 elections and scheduled the implementation of the carrots prior to 2012.

You must be a Blue Blood Republican or something.

No, I am an informed conservative who would never say that Obamacare was "not all that bad." I have noticed that you are one of those so-called conservatives who loves these Big Government services and believes that you have actually paid for them. The reality is that the average Medicare recipient receives three times more in services than they paid into the system. It is this entitlement mentality that is destroying this country.

This graph shows that the average man and woman (average defined in the study as average income over their working lives and living to the average life expectancy) who start receiving benefits in 2010 get over 3 times more in benefits than they pay in to the system! Of importance, the study accounts for inflation by calculating all past taxes and future payments in 2010 dollars to provide an accurate comparison.

If the notion that Medicare recipients are simply "getting back what they paid in" is false then where is the money coming from? Simply, the excess received is being borrowed from younger generations and the cost is more than we can bear.

130 posted on 11/25/2012 2:47:33 PM PST by kabar
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To: kabar

Good chart. That’s why the ObamaCare Death Panels are so vital to the govt.
Cutting the lifespan helps both Medicare AND Soc Sec.


131 posted on 11/25/2012 2:49:19 PM PST by nascarnation (Baraq's economic policy: trickle up poverty)
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To: kabar

Kabar, you get the last word.


132 posted on 11/25/2012 2:53:14 PM PST by Fishtalk (http://patfish.blogspot.com/)
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To: rodguy911

My in laws are all from Florida and moved up here and are homesteading on my land. About half are FSU and the other half UF. So last night we had a two TV party—the den had the Iron Bowl and the Living Room the ? ‘Noles vs Gators Bowl.

After the Iron Bowl was over I put up the last of the Floridas game and the Gators fans were very happy until I burst their bubbles.

Now on to yours, Rodguy!

Alabama vs Georgia in the SEC Championship. The winner goes to the BCS Title Game to play Notre Dame. I think that winner will be Alabama. One thing for sure: Not Florida. Sorry!

Florida will not be #1, and won’t even get a chance to be #1 this year. They are 4th in the BCS, and with the outcome of the SEC Championship, the top 2 teams are already a done deal.

BTW, I had my bubble burst during the start of the season as I work at Auburn Univ!


133 posted on 11/25/2012 3:05:29 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: rodguy911
When you think about it the Sunday shows are a mini-microcosm of what happens in an election. They give our side precious little time never a follow up and change the topic immediately whenever we get any traction.

Yup. Excellent point!

134 posted on 11/25/2012 3:07:51 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: rodguy911
By treasonous, do you refer to those R's who withheld their vote because Mitt wasn't conservative enough ? I'd kill to know how many fit that category. And Christians who couldn't go Mormon.

I keep wondering if Mitt's pulled punches in the later debates hurt him and how much, and conversely if he gained anything with moderates who might have thought of him as a mean and nasty war monger.

135 posted on 11/25/2012 3:08:41 PM PST by chiller (Do not consume any NBCNews;MTPTodayNightlyNewsMorningJoeMSNBCBrianWilliams)
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To: acapesket; A.Hun; Aleya2Fairlie; aligncare; altura; Bender2; Bernard; bray; cajungirl; Carley; ...

And now (drum roll please)... The Sunday Talk Show Transcripts!

Fox News Sunday: http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/fox-news-sunday-chris-wallace/2012/11/25/sen-john-mccain-talks-egypt-gaza-and-libya-fiscal-cliff-vs-consumers-investors

Meet the Press: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/49954812/ns/meet_the_press-transcripts/t/november-peter-king-carl-levin-gregory-meeks-david-cote-carly-fiorina-al-sharpton-david-brooks-ken-burns-andrea-mitchell/

Face the Nation: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57553944/face-the-nation-transcripts-november-25-2012-presidential-and-fiction-authors/

This Week: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/week-transcript-sen-lindsey-graham-sen-dick-durbin/story?id=17779232#.ULJ2qeTO2cw

State of the Union: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1211/25/sotu.01.html


136 posted on 11/25/2012 3:23:16 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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Since we all didn't really discuss the Shows at all, I did read the transcripts and here's one for you. From CNN:

CROWLEY: And yet, you're also zen about it. So I am -- let me ask you. Because, you know, this is like, oh, the fiscal cliff is coming, and, oh, my gosh, unemployment is going to skyrocket, and the recession is going to come back. So I'm wondering does it not -- does the heat not feel as intense here, because you're --

FRANK: The fact is, there is no decision maker. If there was a decision maker who was being complacent in the face of this, you should be very critical. But the American Constitution and the American people have put people into a shared power situation who have had very different views.

Now, one thing is different. Maybe I'm being a little (inaudible) here, but it does seem to me that in 2010, some people came to the Congress, particularly in the House, who said compromise is a bad thing. I hope that as the result of the last election, there's going to be less of that, and every one of us has to be prepared to vote for something we don't like.

Barney, Barney, Barney you Banking Queen! Where was this little (inaudible) when Obama told the Congressional Republicans back in 2009 that "I won." and "Elections have consequences."?

The spirit of compromise has to come from the White House--meaning Obama--and your Leaders Pelosi and Harry Reid, too.

Of course, we all know that when a member of the Big Media Democratic Party speaks about compromise, they mean Republicans must bend to the Leftist postion.

137 posted on 11/25/2012 3:36:40 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!

Thank you very, very much!
I missed all the Sunday shows today, save for the first part of Fox, (McCain) during its first replay.


138 posted on 11/25/2012 4:28:21 PM PST by onyx (FREE REPUBLIC IS HERE TO STAY! DONATE MONTHLY! IF YOU WANT ON SARAH PALIN''S PING LIST, LET ME KNOW)
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To: Fishtalk

The disappointment most of us feel is betrayal. RINOs are not something we are interested in. I would be happy to vote for someone who had principles.

The biggest buyers regret in this election, is that Mittens, did not have any principles and we are the ones feeling regretful for having voted for a looser we NEW did not fit the bill.


139 posted on 11/25/2012 4:41:55 PM PST by DanZ
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To: Alas Babylon!
The spirit of compromise has to come from the White House--meaning Obama--and your Leaders Pelosi and Harry Reid, too.

Too?

Why should ANY Republican EVER "compromise" with the communists?

140 posted on 11/25/2012 4:45:28 PM PST by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves" Month)
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Some make more than one donation
Many make none

141 posted on 11/25/2012 5:22:02 PM PST by RedMDer (Please support Toys for Tots this CHRISTmas season.)
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To: rodguy911

RG, if you really want to win some local elections I can send you my manual.

Pray for America


142 posted on 11/25/2012 6:36:18 PM PST by bray (Nov 6, tell Obama to Stand Down!)
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To: Alas Babylon!
thanks, for the transcripts. :-)

143 posted on 11/25/2012 7:00:06 PM PST by skinkinthegrass (Anger a Conservative by telling a lie; Anger a Liberal by telling the truth....RWR 8-)
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To: ROCKLOBSTER; All
Why should ANY Republican EVER "compromise" with the communists?
True...it's like pouring a cup of "muddy" water...
into a pitcher of potable water...unusable for drinking...
Are you listening Linda / Juan / Chambliss?

144 posted on 11/25/2012 7:10:26 PM PST by skinkinthegrass (Anger a Conservative by telling a lie; Anger a Liberal by telling the truth....RWR 8-)
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To: Alas Babylon!

> Frankly, I’m not impressed by any of these names. Maybe Paul Ryan, but I don’t see how we can beat the coalition of democrats and media acting together so completely.

Keep in mind that Ryan was hobbled by the Romney camp. I think if Ryan runs on his excellent ideas he’d be an amazing frontrunner.


145 posted on 11/26/2012 8:47:07 AM PST by VictoryGal (Never give up, never surrender! REMEMBER NEDA)
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To: Alas Babylon!

I have been tuning in to those ridiculous Sunday shows for years now, have not tuned into any since election until this Sunday just for 5 minutes between Fox and MTP,,,,\

What a bunch of nonsense and childishness! From Fox to the rest...a utter joke, do not understand why I wasted so much time over the years

They are all a bunch of losers, I am done with them all


146 posted on 11/27/2012 9:53:16 AM PST by Friendofgeorge (SARAH PALIN 2016 OR BUST)
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