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Massive pileup shuts I-10 in Texas; 2 dead
Yahoo News / AP ^ | November 22, 2012 | unattributed

Posted on 11/22/2012 8:20:56 PM PST by prairiebreeze

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Terrible. Prayers for these victims and their families.
1 posted on 11/22/2012 8:21:02 PM PST by prairiebreeze
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To: prairiebreeze

Yes, prayers


2 posted on 11/22/2012 8:32:37 PM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: prairiebreeze
Is there supposed to be a tractor on the front of those FedEx double trailers?


3 posted on 11/22/2012 8:41:28 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: prairiebreeze

4 posted on 11/22/2012 8:43:28 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: prairiebreeze

Every time I read about another 100+ car pileup in Texas I just can’t figure out how it could happen. I mean, if the roads are icy, don’t you slow down? If there is limited visibility from fog, don’t you slow down?

/puzzled headshake


5 posted on 11/22/2012 8:55:48 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: prairiebreeze

Fog like that on a busy multilane interstate, you don’t know what to do. Keep moving and hit somebody, stop and get hit. I guess you could try to pull over as far right on the emergency lane as possible, exit the vehicle and get behind the guardrail until the fog clears. Not much else you can do.


6 posted on 11/22/2012 8:57:07 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: Lancey Howard
I've always associated large pileups with Florida, smoke from forest fires used to do it more often than not. Particularly fog prone areas in NC have digital speed limit signs with visibility sensors, on mountain interstates at least. I've seen them reading 5 mph before, it's vertigo inducing, fog that thick.
7 posted on 11/22/2012 9:01:43 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry

I have been in one white-out here, in which I could not figure out what to do - luckily I was NOT on a highway, and it soon passed, but I literally could see nothing outside my cr except white everywhere, and it all looked the same. It was very dis-orientating. I imagine thick fog would be similar. BTW, these things (fog) happen in other parts of the country too. One thing that MIGHT help is for everyone to slow down, but not too suddenly (or no one vehicle should slow down too suddenly, unless all do).


8 posted on 11/22/2012 9:04:24 PM PST by PghBaldy (Pete Hoekstra RE: Petraeus scandal - "There's more here than meets the eye.")
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To: Lancey Howard
Driving skill in Texas seems to be water soluable.

/johnny

9 posted on 11/22/2012 9:07:22 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: PghBaldy

I’ve only experienced whiteout conditions once in my life while driving, it is similar. I was on whatever interstate goes north from Minneapolis to St. Cloud, wind kicked up and boom, couldn’t see a blessed thing other than the tail lights of the car directly in front of me. Followed them off the edge of the pavement and nearly got the rental stuck.


10 posted on 11/22/2012 9:11:02 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry
Particularly fog prone areas in NC have digital speed limit signs with visibility sensors

LOL!
Do people really need speed limit signs to have half a brain when road conditions are crappy?

11 posted on 11/22/2012 9:13:25 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Lancey Howard

The fog was an issue, but all things considered really a rather minor one until the sun in all its glory popped over the east horizon. The unusually and immediate bright light, hitting the fog blinded the drivers and it was impossible for them to see anything. Initial reaction under these extreme circumstances is fear and I am sure people’s first instinct was to hit their breaks. From there on it was all downhill. Spotty ground fog is pretty common all throughout our area, not a really big deal and something you adjust to. This situation was more like something you might see every 20 years or so.

I-10 is a major artery across the U.S. and has a WHOLE LOT of truck traffic, sometimes wall to wall. The drive to/from Houston and Beaumont has never been one for the faint of heart.

Fortunately we don’t have a whole lot of ice in Houston but when it gets to around 40 degrees we have black ice on all of the overpasses and bridges, of which there are many. There presents a whole other set of problems.


12 posted on 11/22/2012 9:16:18 PM PST by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: Lancey Howard

Reduced speed limit precedes the fog bank, so yes, it’s reduced injuries and fatalities considerably. It serves as a warning system, seeing the speed limit drop and if it drops a lot, you know it’s bad before you’re in the thick of it, can’t even see the lines on the road and can’t decide whether to keep moving so you won’t get hit, or stop so you won’t hit somebody.


13 posted on 11/22/2012 9:18:17 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: prairiebreeze

So sorry for those who died or were injured.

We deal with something called Tule Fog here in California’s Central Valley — when I first saw this story I assumed that was where the pile-up took place. The fog is SO thick you can’t see to the end of the hood of your car!! I remember my father once getting out of the car and walking along the right side front fender guiding my mother until we could exit the freeway.

Highway Patrol says to move over to the right as quickly and carefully as possible, put your tire on the white line along the right side of the right line and follow it until you find an exit and then get off the freeway. They also
recommend NOT getting out of your car, apparently you’re safer inside than out.


14 posted on 11/22/2012 9:44:10 PM PST by Bon of Babble (The Road to Ruin is Always Kept in Good Repair)
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To: prairiebreeze

Back in my truck driving days I had a similar situation in Oklahoma. Visibility went from great, to none. It’s a very lonely feeling. On one hand, I knew I could pull over to the shoulder and I would be fine but if I pulled over, there was a decent chance a car would rear-end my trailer. I did not want to be partially responsible for killing anyone.

I never did pull over, I slowed to 50 and prayed. Got lucky....


15 posted on 11/22/2012 9:47:56 PM PST by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: Lancey Howard

The pile ups happen because someone slowed down. As much as you want to, you don’t slow down in fog. I hate driving in dense fog. It is the worst. One time I just took a chance that what I saw was an exit. Luckily it was. Until then I just followed the tall lights of a truck in front of me at 50 mph.


16 posted on 11/22/2012 9:55:22 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: Sporke

50 seems to be the speed


17 posted on 11/22/2012 10:08:04 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: gunsequalfreedom

Doesn’t it depend on the extent of the fog? The incident I described as having experienced (in the EXACT same vicinity of SE Texas, thirty years ago), you could not SEE the road in front of the car’s hood. The hood ornament was almost unseeable. Seriously. The only way to even stay on the road was going around ten miles per hour, with my head half-outside the car window, just to spot the stripes on the road. And the highway was a virtual levee, with swampy marshlands on both sides. Nowhere to turn off. Hair-raising experience. Worst I’ve ever encountered, bar none. Unreal.


18 posted on 11/22/2012 10:11:33 PM PST by greene66
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To: gunsequalfreedom

Wow.. Good luck, pal.


19 posted on 11/22/2012 10:12:01 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: gunsequalfreedom
As much as you want to, you don’t slow down in fog.

Advise that at least 98 drivers in this wreck followed.

20 posted on 11/22/2012 10:24:18 PM PST by OrangeHoof (Our economy won't heal until one particular black man is unemployed.)
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To: Lancey Howard

I’ve been in it before. I could see one stripe in the road in front of me and the tail lights intermittently of the truck in front of me. If someone had stopped, or if I had stored it would have been a pile up. You don’t stop in fog.slow, don’t stop. It ain’t a great option but there is no other.


21 posted on 11/22/2012 10:32:58 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: OrangeHoof

I should have said you dont stop, not that you dont slow


22 posted on 11/22/2012 10:35:06 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: Lancey Howard
From the Weather Channel

•Drive with lights on low beam. High beams will only be reflected back off the fog and actually impair visibility even more.

•Reduce your speed -- and watch your speedometer. Fog creates a visual illusion of slow motion when you may actually be speeding.

•Listen for traffic you cannot see. Open your window a little, to hear better.

•Use wipers and defrosters as necessary for maximum visibility.

•Use the right edge of the road or painted road markings as a guide.

•Be patient. Do not pass lines of traffic.

•Do not stop on a freeway or heavily traveled road. If your car stalls or becomes disabled, turn your vehicle's lights off, and take your foot off of the brake pedal. People tend to follow tail lights when driving in fog. Move away from the vehicle to avoid injury.

From another source,http://www.drive-safely.net/driving-in-fog.html

Sometimes, foggy conditions just becomes too thick. You know your limits. If you find that you're exceeding your comfort zone, it might be best to stop until the fog lifts. But this is an extremely dangerous situation! If you can't see, either can anyone else. Try to get as far off the road as possible. Pull into a driveway, parking lot, rest area, side street, or any other place where you can get away from heavy traffic flow. But if the roadway shoulder is your only option, pull way over. Go into the grass if necessary. If there's a curb, drive over it and park on the other side of the curb. Stay buckled up and turn your lights off! If you leave your lights on, people might think you are driving on the roadway and rear-end you. Make sure your foot is off the brake pedal, and do not use your flashers. Keep all your lights off. If there is shelter nearby, try to get there quickly. Otherwise, stay in your car and stay buckled up.

23 posted on 11/22/2012 11:00:15 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: gunsequalfreedom
The pile ups happen because someone slowed down. As much as you want to, you don’t slow down in fog. I hate driving in dense fog. It is the worst. One time I just took a chance that what I saw was an exit. Luckily it was. Until then I just followed the tail lights of a truck in front of me at 50 mph.

I had two occasions like that: one was in Spain, where I had to look down through my opened driver's door to look down to follow the center line. While creeping along, it didn't occur to me that someone else—coming from the opposite direction—could have the same idea!

The other was recently in Florida, needing to cross a 4-lane highway. I rolled both windows down and listened for traffic before crossing. :-/

24 posted on 11/23/2012 2:48:08 AM PST by Does so (Dims don't think ... they PLOT!)
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To: prairiebreeze
Just yesterday I ran into a fog bank on I-90.It seemed to come out of nowhere,as is often the case.Good thing traffic was light in that area.Very sad to see so many folks hurt on Thanksgiving Day.
25 posted on 11/23/2012 5:14:19 AM PST by Gay State Conservative (Benghazi: What Did Baraq Know And When Did He Know It?)
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To: Lancey Howard

Here is a link describing the various state DOT efforts and countermeasures dealing with highways prone to poor visibility, fog in particular.

The automated, visibility controlled variable speed limit system in use for decades on I-40 west of Asheville, NC is described in some detail including early bugs in the system as well as cost of implementation.

Many states have similar efforts.

Texas had no countermeasures in place, according to the study.

http://www.ops.fhwa.dot.gov/weather/best_practices/USfogSysSummary-VaTech.pdf


26 posted on 11/23/2012 6:33:05 AM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: prairiebreeze
If anyone is interested ....

An 84 Photo Clip of the event

In Jan of this year Hwy 73 which is a few miles south and runs parallel to IH-10 had a major pileup of vehicles (79 or so). Apparently fog and smoke from burning marsh grass causing limited visibility was a factor.

27 posted on 11/23/2012 6:53:10 AM PST by deport
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To: deport

Is there a paper mill nearby? That’s one thing I noticed reading through the link I posted, just how many fog prone areas were near paper mills.


28 posted on 11/23/2012 7:14:29 AM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: floralamiss

The road J&P traveled to see their sister, Sarah?


29 posted on 11/23/2012 7:15:57 AM PST by presently no screen name
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To: RegulatorCountry
Until someones been in that type of fog they simply can't grasp what you are talking about.

Zero visibility in a matter of seconds does not compute with most people.

30 posted on 11/23/2012 7:17:40 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: RegulatorCountry

Twice I have seen a fog hit so quick and heavy, that it obstructs your visibility
to half way down your hood, and within seconds.

Once it was in a very rural area northwest of Houston by about an hour - but
in a low lying area, and the other time it occurred about 45 miles outside of
Amarillo, Tx.

Both times it lifted enough to see 10-15ft past the hood within minutes,
but both hit so rapidly there was barely enough time to pull off onto the shoulder.


31 posted on 11/23/2012 7:17:40 AM PST by Verbosus (/* No Comment */)
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To: RegulatorCountry

Lot of rice fields in that area.


32 posted on 11/23/2012 7:21:10 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: RegulatorCountry

Closest mill would be some 35 miles or so north but dense fog is a fairly common thing all along the IH-10 corridor TX, LA, MS, etc when the atmospheric conditions are right.


33 posted on 11/23/2012 7:28:06 AM PST by deport
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To: JRandomFreeper

They call it an interstate highway for a reason.

When you are smart enough to know what that means, they maybe we’ll listen to your comments.

Now go back to your tricycle, and don’t leave the driveway.


34 posted on 11/23/2012 7:32:17 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: IMR 4350
Having lived in Texas all of my life, I think I can safely say that I've observed that when rain or snow starts, driving skills go away.

You might want to lay off the insults unless you know who you are talking to.

/johnny

35 posted on 11/23/2012 7:57:15 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Sorry, I didn’t know you were commenting on your own driving skills, I thought you were commenting on the driving skills of the rest of us in the state.

Stick to your tricycle when there’s fog. The rest of us will be safer.


36 posted on 11/23/2012 8:06:21 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: IMR 4350
I've observed a lot of drivers in Texas that can't manage a little rain, fog, or sleet. Lots of them.

Every light rain causes accidents in all the large cities on the interstates.

You might want to lay off the insults.

/johnny

37 posted on 11/23/2012 8:14:49 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: IMR 4350
Tis better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are an idiot, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Considering the proximity of Beaumont to the LA border, and the fact that IH-10 is the southern route for truck traffic and vacationers, I'll bet you a dollar to a donut that there were numerous casualties from non-Texas residents.

38 posted on 11/23/2012 8:15:18 AM PST by Night Hides Not (The Tea Party was the earthquake, and Chick Fil A the tsunami...100's of aftershocks to come.)
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To: JRandomFreeper

You might want to take your own advice.

A light rain on city streets is far worse than a heavy rain.

A heavy rain washes the crap off the street, a light rain turns it into what can best be described as grease.

It happens everywhere, not just Texas.


39 posted on 11/23/2012 8:26:49 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: RegulatorCountry

There’s a spot south of Flagstaff (AZ) where this periodically happens... You’re on an 8,000+ foot mountain with just a little guard rail to keep you from going over the edge. The fog came up on us so fast that we could barely get over to the edge of the road. Luckily, someone was pulled off ahead of us too and we just had enough shoulder. It was the scariest thing ever. We kept our seatbelts on and just prayed we didn’t get hit (well, not like the seatbelts would have helped much going over that much mountain, but still).


40 posted on 11/23/2012 8:41:02 AM PST by Borax Queen
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To: Night Hides Not
This happened about 30 miles from me.

Yesterday morning, because of the lay of the land, visibility from my front porch was about a half mile looking east and less than 100 yards looking west. I could make out the top of the trees at 75 yards.

Patchy fog in this area is like hitting a wall, it's just that fast and people just don't get it.

If it's a ground fog a truck driver in his cab may be above the heavy fog line. His visibility will be completely different than a driver in a small car.

Even the best driver isn't prepared for it.

With the number of trucks involved most probably were from out of state.

Doesn't stop the snarky comments though does it.

41 posted on 11/23/2012 8:52:34 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: prairiebreeze

I was behind this pile-up yesterday, going to a relative’s house for Thanksgiving. I can’t say what the fog was like at the point of the pile-up, because we never made it that far, but the fog we went through was NOT zero visibility. We could see at least a quarter of a mile, and had no problem seeing the cars in front of us for a good way.

Perhaps 30 minutes before we came upon the road block and were diverted onto another highway, my husband commented that people were driving too fast in the fog and he made it a point to back off and leave a greater distance between our vehicle and the ones ahead of us.

There were at least 5 cars of people at our Thanksgiving dinner that had planned to travel that stretch of highway that morning, not in a caravan, all separately. Fortunately, we all made it through without being involved, and were just detoured and delayed by few minutes.


42 posted on 11/23/2012 9:04:19 AM PST by RedWhiteBlue (Mama tried)
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To: IMR 4350

Closest I can come to describing it would be to imagine everybody’s headlights suddenly shut off, there are no street lights, no light of any kind, you’re just in a sort of limbo, you get disoriented and couldn’t tell whether you were up, down or sideways. You can hear tires screeching, crashes and people yelling, but you have absolutely no clue where they are.


43 posted on 11/23/2012 9:28:44 AM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: Night Hides Not

Latest U-Haul Index Shows Californians Leaving for Texas
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2962357/posts


44 posted on 11/23/2012 10:51:02 AM PST by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
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Ideally, we need every member and regular user to contribute to keep Free Republic up and running strong.

45 posted on 11/23/2012 5:18:23 PM PST by RedMDer (May we always be happy and may our enemies always know it. - Sarah Palin, 10-18-2010)
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To: Does so
The other was recently in Florida, needing to cross a 4-lane highway. I rolled both windows down and listened for traffic before crossing. :-/

Wow, I don't think I would have been brave enough to cross that four-lane highway.

What I always loved when I lived in snow country was not being able to see past the inside of the windshield. when that happened I would drive looking out the passenger side window to guage how close I was to the guarde rail to make sure I kept driving straight.

Really glad I no longer have to drive all those miles for a living.

46 posted on 11/23/2012 7:34:45 PM PST by gunsequalfreedom (Conservative is not a label of convenience. It is a guide to your actions.)
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To: gunsequalfreedom
Wow, I don't think I would have been brave enough to cross that four-lane highway.

Well, I was driving to a major automobile race track to instruct beginning race car drivers. ;)

47 posted on 11/24/2012 2:43:45 AM PST by Does so (Dims don't think ... they PLOT!)
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To: Borax Queen

Yeah, I’ve had that happen to me just south of Flagstaff too.

But the worst case I ran into was just south of Denver on I-25 on Monument Pass. Not much of “pass” by Colorado standards, actually pretty similar to interstate just south of Flagstaff, just windy enough that there’s some blind corners where you can enter the corner in full clear and run into a zero visibility fog bank in the middle of the turn.

And just like Flagstaff, just a little band of Armco between you and a several hundred foot drop.


48 posted on 11/24/2012 1:17:01 PM PST by RatSlayer
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To: RatSlayer

Yikes! I forgot to say that was I-17 (as you know) — and you’d think it would be marked. There are so many spots marked “icy bridge” or “watch for ice” or whatever — maybe “watch for fog” would be helpful. I had no idea it was so common there, until after it happened to us and then all of our friends said “oh yeah, that happened to us too.” (We only go up there about once every couple of years.)

Oh, scary about Denver.


49 posted on 11/24/2012 4:09:41 PM PST by Borax Queen
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To: presently no screen name

I’m sorry I’m replying so late to your comment, PNSN. After Sarah’s passing, I gradually felt the energy drain out of my body, and I’ve been resting for long periods. Yes. This was the same section of I-10 on which Joe and Paula were traveling, although they were farther west when the pileup occurred. If they had departed from home a little later, they might have been involved. I will never forget the wonderful outpouring of prayer and concern over the past few days and neither will they. There is much to be done in El Paso, as the body must be transported to New Mexico for the funeral. Paula is the eldest, the executor, and an attorney, so she is busy and that is good. I will have some final news and “thank you’s” from the family in a few days. You are on my ping list for Sarah, PNSN. Thank you, and God bless!


50 posted on 11/24/2012 8:13:46 PM PST by floralamiss ("For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.")
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