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Federal Workers to Congress: Leave Us Out of Deficit Deal
The National Journal ^ | November 20th, 2012 | Eric Katz

Posted on 11/20/2012 11:25:03 PM PST by Abiotic

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To: Abiotic

Cross the board 10%, every dept., every agency.


51 posted on 11/21/2012 6:59:48 AM PST by servantboy777
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To: V_TWIN

Afraid I just lost any sympathy for you, after taking a look at BC Federal plan benefits. You have better and cheaper health insurance than I’ve ever had. Furthermore, I’ll be you get a pension, which is pretty much unheard of in the private sector. As for going without raises, join the club! Many of us running businesses have had to take pay cuts or go without pay.


52 posted on 11/21/2012 7:16:23 AM PST by dinodino
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To: V_TWIN
I understand.

We need to have some people do the things in the Fedgov that need doing. The danger is that everyone thinks that their little area is the most important (and from what you alluded to, yours is).

But at some point the costs get to great. We are starting to field mercenaries. That is not a good sign for the fiscal health of the state.

53 posted on 11/21/2012 7:18:44 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: Hulka
Your not being rude at all. First I'd like to thank you for your service to your country, it is appreciated. A lot of folks I work with are ex military and I am proud to work with them. When I say I cannot discuss what I do I don't mean I am some black ops cloak and dagger type. If thats the way I portrayed it I apologize, nothing could be further from the truth. james bond 007 I ain't or do I pretend to be.lol. What I meant was we are trained and warned not to make public (like on the internet) a lot of personal info details or about what we do for the fed gov. It may sound dramatic but I'm just stating what we are told and how we are instructed/trained. We receive continuous training on this subject so it gets kind of drummed in. As for being an unclassified description, of course it is but that doesn't mean I can or should provide a lot of detail about it. Yes I am a “run of the mill” worker bee GS rate but as you probably know there are many different gov rates. I spent many years as a WG. I think GS just happens to be what most people have heard of.
Anyway I hope I cleared up any misconception about what I was trying to say....... I'm proud and to work for the American taxpayer, it is my honor and privilege. I would just like people to know we're not all sluggo parasites sucking the US dry.

Regards, V_TWIN

54 posted on 11/21/2012 7:34:50 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: johnthebaptistmoore
A civil war between The Right and The Left. That’s, probably, where we are all heading towards.

You say that likes it's a bad thing.

55 posted on 11/21/2012 7:41:47 AM PST by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: dinodino

Maybe this will get some sympathy back, I do not have a pension unless you consider a TSP (goverment 401K) a pension. Fed gov used to do pensions but that has been a thing of the past for quite some time. I put $ in, the fed gov does match a certain amount of that but don’t most 401ks do that? (and yes I understand where the matching comes from.)

As far as ins. goes I’ll take your word for that, Ive never done a comparison. Like I said, maybe pay freezes for us are the correct thing, I’m not complaining. Considering the current economic climate in the US, I know anyone who is gainfully employed nowadays is fortunate.


56 posted on 11/21/2012 7:45:31 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: trebb

I’m not being snarky (much), I really am trying to recall a story from last year about federal employees owing a very large amount of unpaid taxes. That’s what struck me as amusing about the way the article was written, I have an appreciation for irony.


57 posted on 11/21/2012 7:50:14 AM PST by thescourged1
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To: Heart of Georgia
Thanks for the response. Most of my civilian co-workers are conscientious and diligent with solid work ethics. One is a hard-core lib and I have been chiding him lately due to his efforts to discipline a civilian who is part of the union. My co-worker was a union rep before a promotion took him out of the union dealings and now the union is causing him no small amount of headaches trying to protect a guy who needs to be gone. He still voted for Zero and cannot seem to understand why I despise the Left so much.

Most of the government workers that cause so many problems are in the various Washington-connected agencies and they give us all a bad name. Most of my co-workers spent 20 or more years of honorable military service and it was a a natural move to go back to the same base they retired from to fill a civilian slot - they get to leverage their military experience when it comes to training new recruits and over the last 4 years, it was either fill a civilian vacancy or go on unemployment - not much choice there. I spent 24 years in the AF and my 13 years as a DOD civilian makes 37 years in/around the military and the folks I love so much.

Not all the civilians are like my co-worker; he can't convince me so he goes to other. I overheard him asking a young civilian what he thought it meant that Obama got so much of the vote - the young man looked at him and said, "Because so many people are stupid?" It was a good moment to see the look on his face.

58 posted on 11/21/2012 8:06:40 AM PST by trebb (Allies no longer trust us. Enemies no longer fear us.)
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To: thescourged1

I understand - those you talk about do exist and they are generally administration-connected bureaucrats vs. mush of the civilian workforce that supplements the various bases. Most of the folks like me have spent 20 or more years in uniform and many of us are in the training area teaching new recruits their basic career field courses. We are mainly patriots who love the country and the military and the job is looked at much like any private-sector person looks at his job. Working around the military and the military in uniform we came to love is a lagniappe. We also understand that even though our pay comes from tax dollars, we pay taxes the same as everyone else and we hate to see them wasted. I understand and agree that we shouldn’t be getting special favors and I understand and accept that even my pay is on the table in these times. Like anyone else, we have lost much spending power (although we are grateful for our jobs) during the Obama melt-down and like anyone else, we are human and selfish enough to hope for raises vs. cuts, but many of us are willing to share in the pain if the idiots in the Congress will actually stop flushing America’s future down the toilet. God Bless


59 posted on 11/21/2012 8:21:42 AM PST by trebb (Allies no longer trust us. Enemies no longer fear us.)
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To: Abiotic
The Federal-Postal Coalition -- a group representing more than two dozen federal employee unions -- pleaded with Congress on Monday to spare their members in any deal related to the "fiscal cliff."

Fine, then they can have a substantial layoff instead.

60 posted on 11/21/2012 8:39:48 AM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: Carry_Okie

Just for the record, we (fed gov) don’t call ‘em layoffs, we call ‘em RIFs. “Reduction in force”. I’m not trying to be a smarta$$ but RIFs do happen. Personally if that’s what it takes then so be it. Problem with the fed gov is, seniority means everything, you could be the brightest most efficient worker in your dept. if the sluggo POS in your office has more time in sevice (comp date) than you and a RIF comes guess what, he stays you go. How do I know? It happened to me. That’s how fed gov employment is structured. Oh and by the way, before that happens, every contractor working at that facility has to go first.

Just doesn’t sound efficient does it?


61 posted on 11/21/2012 8:52:46 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: central_va

This civil war, if it, actually, happens, could last a long time, and it could go on for several decades. I would be surprised if it’s quick.


62 posted on 11/21/2012 8:54:12 AM PST by johnthebaptistmoore (The world continues to be stuck in a "all leftist, all of the time" funk. BUNK THE FUNK!)
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To: V_TWIN
Just doesn’t sound efficient does it?

It's not meant to be efficient; it's meant to be stable.

63 posted on 11/21/2012 8:55:18 AM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: Carry_Okie

Having been a fed employee for 23 years, not sure it’s that either.

My only goal in contributing to this thread was to try and let folks know all federal employees aren’t a POS.

V_TWIN


64 posted on 11/21/2012 9:00:27 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: V_TWIN
Having been a fed employee for 23 years, not sure it’s that either.

If you go back to its origins, the purpose of the Civil Service Act was to stop Andrew Jackson's "spoils system" wholesale replacement of the government every time there was a Presidential election with a win by the opposite party. It was chaos.

65 posted on 11/21/2012 9:03:04 AM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: TurboZamboni

“retire at 55 with 80% of their highest salary”

Would you mind providing me with where you got that information?


66 posted on 11/21/2012 9:19:55 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: Abiotic

Last line: “-—and a pay raise would be instituted.” Oh, yeah, I can see that happening from my house. They just couldn’t stand to omit the whine and bellyache.


67 posted on 11/21/2012 10:35:52 AM PST by cherokee1 (skip the names---just kick the buttz)
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To: trebb

“Most of the government workers that cause so many problems are in the various Washington-connected agencies and they give us all a bad name.”

Agree with that. I also hate the fact that it’s difficult, if not impossible, to fire a fed employee. That aspect also hurts the hard working ones. There needs to be a threshold they cross where they lose their job as anyone would.

“Most of my co-workers . . . honorable military service.”

My husband fits into that category. He left active duty during the Carter administration and the times for finding work were hard to say the least. Also, we didn’t look at a federal job the way we do now - and sure didn’t realize some could keep their pay coming no matter what they did.

My husband’s field (both college and Air Force) is electronics, so I’m sure he could have found something in the Carter economy eventually, but after years of starving in the service, we were pretty desperate for a bit of security. Fast forward to today and here we are with the broad-brushed govt employee label.


68 posted on 11/21/2012 10:39:59 AM PST by Heart of Georgia
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To: thescourged1
Would these be the federal workers that owe billions in unpaid income taxes? They would be. Plus they are Federal Union Employees......Unions are the primary reason America cannot compete for the market of foreign goods from cloth to automobiles...unions. A quick read of how the Bakers Union closed down a good business is fresh off the press and it is a scandal...hear the union workers pathetic cries of 'how can I feed my family....?' while they are picking up unemployed checks and food stamps. These people have lost America for all of us...Unions are not good for the economy.
69 posted on 11/21/2012 11:20:18 AM PST by yoe
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To: central_va
I think johnthebabtistmoore's remark....The Right and The Left meant, Between a Republic and Communism.
70 posted on 11/21/2012 11:24:03 AM PST by yoe
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To: V_TWIN

Thanks for clearing up that point.

Yes, it did appear to me, at least, it was a 007-type of “if I tell you I have to kill you” thing. No worries.

I would like to say what I did in an agency near Wash DC with no public name, but in my case, they would kill me and THEN kill you. Ha!

Cheers.


71 posted on 11/21/2012 12:24:33 PM PST by Hulka
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To: V_TWIN
RIFFs are usually the result of reduced hiring, not actual lay-off’s of government employees.

The government usually lets retirements, deaths and resignations “reduce” the work-force.

Can you recall when the last time the “government” walked through the office pointing out various GS employees and saying, “you, you there, you are laid off.”

Contractors in government service are now actually being downsized through lay-offs.

72 posted on 11/21/2012 12:30:50 PM PST by Hulka
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To: Hulka

Perhaps he is one of the new army of IRS agents or diversity coordinator’s being hired.


73 posted on 11/21/2012 2:16:03 PM PST by MSF BU (n)
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To: Hulka
The government usually lets retirements, deaths and resignations “reduce” the work-force.

Attrition.

74 posted on 11/21/2012 2:41:08 PM PST by Max in Utah (A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within.)
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To: V_TWIN

“Not sure what that’s supposed to mean, I’m a federal employee and I pay my taxes every year.”

No offense, perhaps I should have said ‘net taxpayer’. Since you derive a salary from the gov, you’re not a net taxpayer...unless you pay in taxes more than you earn!

I read your other posts stating you were with Dod. I don’t think people like me have a problem with that, Defense along with the POST OFFICE is a Constitutionally mandated job of the fedgov.

Perhaps if Energy, Education, HHS were scrapped there’d be more money and less deficits for the fedgov’s proper tasks.


75 posted on 11/21/2012 3:40:09 PM PST by JPJones (I wish the buck(s) WOULD stop with me.)
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To: V_TWIN

“Not sure what that’s supposed to mean, I’m a federal employee and I pay my taxes every year.”

No offense, perhaps I should have said ‘net taxpayer’. Since you derive a salary from the gov, you’re not a net taxpayer...unless you pay in taxes more than you earn!

I read your other posts stating you were with Dod. I don’t think people like me have a problem with that, Defense along with the POST OFFICE is a Constitutionally mandated job of the fedgov.

Perhaps if Energy, Education, HHS were scrapped there’d be more money and less deficits for the fedgov’s proper tasks.


76 posted on 11/21/2012 3:40:40 PM PST by JPJones (I wish the buck(s) WOULD stop with me.)
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To: V_TWIN

“Not sure what that’s supposed to mean, I’m a federal employee and I pay my taxes every year.”

No offense, perhaps I should have said ‘net taxpayer’. Since you derive a salary from the gov, you’re not a net taxpayer...unless you pay in taxes more than you earn!

I read your other posts stating you were with Dod. I don’t think people like me have a problem with that, Defense along with the POST OFFICE is a Constitutionally mandated job of the fedgov.

Perhaps if Energy, Education, HHS were scrapped there’d be more money and less deficits for the fedgov’s proper tasks.


77 posted on 11/21/2012 3:41:18 PM PST by JPJones (I wish the buck(s) WOULD stop with me.)
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To: JPJones

The Post Office is Constitutionally AUTHORIZED, not MANDATED. Get it straight! They are not the same thing.


78 posted on 11/21/2012 4:16:29 PM PST by dinodino
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To: V_TWIN

“Also fyi, I am on my third year of a pay freeze, no COLA, no bonus of any kind, nothing”

My husband who works for the private sector had his pay cut along with his co-workers by 20% three years ago. No pension. No matching 401K. Nothing. My daughters working for the same company have since left the company. My husband can’t because he is 65 years old. We have no idea when he can retire until Obamacare is implemented and we see how bad it is.


79 posted on 11/21/2012 5:06:35 PM PST by Wisconsinlady ("When injustice becomes law, then resistance becomes duty." Thomas Jefferson)
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To: dinodino

Remove yer mail box, dipshit. I’m weary of delivering your porn to ya! I’ll be sure to endorse “No Mail Receptical”.

That being said, a standing U.S. Navy, and her Corps of Marines, and the Post Office are the ONLY Federal Departments authorized by the Constitution. YOU get the Constitution amended, and YOU can get rid of my lazy ass...’til then STFU, and get rid of yer mailbox.

You know you can buy your porn a couple blocks from your house....


80 posted on 11/21/2012 5:12:20 PM PST by SgtBob (Freedom is not for the faint of heart. Semper Fi!)
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To: SgtBob

I can well believe that you are a Postal Worker, based on the way you write and your lack of reading comprehension. You incorrectly stated that the Constitution mandates a Post Office, and I pointed out your error. You responded with an idiotic tirade about porn. Are you telling us that your job consists of delivering porn? Gee, that sure sounds worthy of taxpayer subsidy.

As for my mailbox, I don’t use it. All of my bills are electronic and I have blocked most junk mail. At my company, I *never* send anything through USPS if I can avoid it. Certainly all critical paper correspondence goes FedEx.


81 posted on 11/21/2012 5:31:30 PM PST by dinodino
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To: Abiotic

Sleep with digs you wake up with fleas.

Start scratchin.


82 posted on 11/21/2012 6:30:43 PM PST by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal The 16th Amendment!)
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To: Abiotic


83 posted on 11/21/2012 7:47:31 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: johnthebaptistmoore; central_va; Fred Nerks

This civil war, if it, actually, happens, could last a long time, and it could go on for several decades. I would be surprised if it’s quick.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The civil war is happening already. It is a demographic war
using illegal aliens, federal non enforcement of laws already on the books, a failure to follow the constitution, and thugs who pose as politicians, who espouse the view that other thugs, like Hamas for example, are freedom fighters, and so on. We now are in a civil war but the American people are asleep, conned by a Main Stream media that has repeatedly refused to inform America of the truths
that will bring various issues forward for solution.

I mean Eric Holder, our so called attor4ney general helped the president commit an act of war through gun running ( Fst & Furious) to Mexico in which hundreds of Mexicans died, and its not even news?

We are now in a civil war, and the opresident derogates to huimself authority via executive order which would make the greatest tyrants throughout history envious in the extreme.

You bet we have a civil war. The trouble is that only a few of us are fighting it.The federal government is about to feed on its own people and kill many of them.The organization to do so is in place. The first shots will soon be fired but the jockying to establish a federal tyranny have been going on for years. Look at the FEMA concentration camps, look at thousands of railway cars with shackles for human cargo in them.Look at the ammunition purchased by various federal agencies which are non military, or so we thought.Look at the fact that a census was conducted in 2008 in which every citizens home GPS location was gathered to form a precensus database capable of secret usage by the feds.

We are no longer a free nation, electoral fraud was conducted in all swing states, with turnouts exceeding the numbers of registered voters in many jurisdictions.

Yes we have a civil war now. Its just that the shooting has not yet started.We have thugs in charge of the executive arm of government. THUGS!

Things will get quite ugly.


84 posted on 11/21/2012 7:55:40 PM PST by Candor7 (Obama fascism article: http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/05/barack_obama_the_quintessentia_1.html)
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To: Candor7
Easier said than done I know, but may I suggest you turn your back on what's behind you and look forward...this mess could take a lifetime or more to sort out.

And it's Autumn already.


85 posted on 11/21/2012 9:08:04 PM PST by Fred Nerks (fair dinkum)
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To: dinodino

Lacking reading comprehension seems to be your forte. Show me in my post were I said “the Constitution mandates a Post Office.”.....dipshit. I posted the Constitution authorizes a standing Navy, and the Post Office...if you need more education, it also authorizes an executive, legislative, and judicial branches....all others need not apply.

Your “Barely 18” magazine is a periodical...if the postage is paid, I will deliver it to you...unless you take down your mail box.


86 posted on 11/21/2012 9:19:42 PM PST by SgtBob (Freedom is not for the faint of heart. Semper Fi!)
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To: dinodino

Yer still a dipshit....just sayin’...


87 posted on 11/21/2012 9:22:40 PM PST by SgtBob (Freedom is not for the faint of heart. Semper Fi!)
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To: Fred Nerks

Yes.I have already filled up 4 bushel baskets with lovely Cortland cooking apples. Crisp and juicy. I am so glad to have moved back to the British Commonwealth.The pile of crap in the USA is horrible. ....a nation consuming itself.

You are indeed correct in more than you know. The fall of America is here, and a long bleak winter will ensue.


88 posted on 11/21/2012 9:33:06 PM PST by Candor7 (Obama fascism article: http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/05/barack_obama_the_quintessentia_1.html)
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To: Candor7
NICE!
89 posted on 11/21/2012 10:15:17 PM PST by Fred Nerks (fair dinkum)
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To: SgtBob

You’re doing a bang-up job of representing your fellow Postal Workers. Here, exactly, is where you said that the Constitution mandates the Post Office:

“I don’t think people like me have a problem with that, Defense along with the POST OFFICE is a Constitutionally mandated job of the fedgov.”

Do you see the word, “mandated?”

No wonder I receive so much misdelivered mail. You and your colleagues can’t read the addresses on the envelopes.


90 posted on 11/22/2012 4:52:16 AM PST by dinodino
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To: JPJones

Just for the record please let me state that I do not think fed employees deserve to be exempted from any cuts. If that’s what it takes and will help the country then it needs to be done.

My main goal on this thread was just to let people know all of us aren’t slugs draining the US taxpayer $$.

As for the post office, if the quality of my mail service is what most folks get I dont think its worth supporting.

best regards, v_twin


91 posted on 11/22/2012 5:47:41 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: Hulka
“Can you recall when the last time the “government” walked through the office pointing out various GS employees and saying, “you, you there, you are laid off.”

Yep, it's been a while but it happened to me in 1992. Fortunately I was able to regain a position later, but I beg to differ with your RIF definition, the one I got caught in was called exactly that and I was handed an envelope with a cover letter that stated "we regret to inform you"............6 weeks later I was gone. As you probably know It's all about seniority and I had very little. As far as what you did in DC, i don't want to know! lol see you around FR. v_twin

92 posted on 11/22/2012 6:00:36 AM PST by V_TWIN (obama=where there's smoke, there's mirrors)
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To: Abiotic
According to the coalition, federal employees have funded $60 billion in budget savings in 2011 and 2012 as a result of their ongoing pay freeze and an additional $28 billion in savings will be derived from the freeze extension through March 2013.

Wah wah wah. The private sector has effectively had a pay freeze OR reduction for nearly a decade. Don't cry because you're not getting huge automatic increases based on your ability to show up for work.

93 posted on 11/22/2012 6:08:20 AM PST by DouglasKC
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To: Heart of Georgia

“Out of all the federal workers I know personally (including my husband), only one is a loon as far as politics goes. The loon amongst them always votes for the weirdest third-party candidate there is and won’t vote for dems.”

Politics and voting are not the reasons to get rid of Federal employees.

We simply cannot afford them. They are overcompensated, over-benefited compared to the private sector (that pays for it all) and most of all they all retire as defacto millionaires.

So whether a federal employee “earns” their money or not, we can’t afford them. Your husband should figure out what he could do in the private sector, because he’ll need to know this in the likely event that a substantial number of federal employees lose their jobs.


94 posted on 11/22/2012 6:16:34 AM PST by RFEngineer
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To: dinodino

I’m glad you aren’t a Mail Man, dipshit...I’m not Freeper JPJones. Who is misdelivering what?

I suggest you learn to read. You might actually figure out who you are posting to. I’ll bet you address your electric bill to your gas company.

PULL DOWN YOUR MAIL BOX!....dipshit.

Please read MY posts and I will eagerly await your apology.


95 posted on 11/22/2012 6:29:52 AM PST by SgtBob (Freedom is not for the faint of heart. Semper Fi!)
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To: SgtBob

You’re absolutely right—JP Jones is the one who incorrectly claimed a Constitutional mandate for the Post Office, and you piled on defending his position. I was mistaken in thinking you were the original poster, and you were mistaken in defending the original poster’s erroneous position.

Have a Happy Thanksgiving.


96 posted on 11/22/2012 11:29:04 AM PST by dinodino
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To: V_TWIN

The fact that seniority, rather than competence, is the main criterion for employee retention during RIF speaks volumes about government workers.


97 posted on 11/22/2012 11:31:01 AM PST by dinodino
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To: dinodino

1. FReeper abiotic is the original poster.

2. My ping was to YOU...nobody else. I was resonding only to YOU...I was NOT defending anyone; I WAS attacking your ignorant rant. Why YOU think I was defending anyone, I know not. The answer lies in your small mind.

3. Recap: YOU were mistaken thinking I was the OP, And YOU were mistaken thinking I was defending anyone when all I was doing was stating facts.


98 posted on 11/22/2012 7:13:37 PM PST by SgtBob (Freedom is not for the faint of heart. Semper Fi!)
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To: oldenuff2no; All
Sure... and these same people will tell you that it is OK to cut the benefits of the retired military. They can stick that. I did 13 of my 23 years overseas away from my home and family. I have already earned what I have and paid the price in full. Now they think they should be exempt from any cuts. Bull Crap.....

I suspect that retired military, retired civil service, and retired postal workers will all be put in the same boat for cuts before this is finished.

99 posted on 11/22/2012 7:45:13 PM PST by marktwain
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To: Abiotic

In this country, we now have the Government Party.

It is those connected with or living off the Government, its rule-making and enforcement ability, tax policy, and especially, the Government’s printed money. It includes many groups, from federal employees, to welfare recipients to large corporations.


100 posted on 11/22/2012 7:49:34 PM PST by PGR88
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