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Mitt Romney’s Mormon faith tangles with a quirk of Arkansas history (Mountain Meadows card played)
Washington Post ^ | May 20, 2012 | Sandhya Somashekhar

Posted on 05/21/2012 7:33:28 AM PDT by Seizethecarp

CARROLLTON, Ark. — On the wildflower-studded slopes of the Ozarks, where memories run long and family ties run thick, a little-known and long-ago chapter of history still simmers.

On Sept. 11, 1857, a wagon train from this part of Arkansas met with a gruesome fate in Utah, where most of the travelers were slaughtered by a Mormon militia in an episode known as the Mountain Meadows Massacre. Hundreds of the victims’ descendants still populate these hills and commemorate the killings, which they have come to call “the first 9/11.”

Many of the locals grew up hearing denunciations of Mormonism from the pulpit on Sundays, and tales of the massacre from older relatives who considered Mormons “evil.”

“There have been Fancher family reunions for 150 years, and the massacre comes up at every one of them,” said Scott Fancher, 58, who traces his lineage back to 26 members of the wagon train, which was known as the Fancher-Baker party. “The more whiskey we drunk, the more resentful we got.”

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Politics/Elections; US: Arkansas
KEYWORDS: mormonism; mountainmeadows; romney
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The interent, with its instant dissemination of validated historical narratives at odds with Mormon orthodoxy, is not kind to this uniguely American religion, and not helpful to any boost in Mormon membership that has been fearfully anticipated by some to result from a Romney presidency,IMO.
1 posted on 05/21/2012 7:33:38 AM PDT by Seizethecarp
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To: Seizethecarp
Expect hundreds of stories on TV and in newspapers about Mormonism between now and November. No, their release will have absolutely nothing to do with Romney - they'll just be something that people now need to know in 2012 which they didn't need to know in 2011.
2 posted on 05/21/2012 7:40:40 AM PDT by KarlInOhio (You only have three billion heartbeats in a lifetime.How many does the government claim as its own?)
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To: Seizethecarp
.


They're just warming up ...

This is still the "Methodist Ladies Christmas Tea" stage ...



.
3 posted on 05/21/2012 7:41:26 AM PDT by Patton@Bastogne (Newt Gingrich and Sarah Palin will DEFEAT the Obama-Romney Socialist Gay-Marriage Axis of Evil)
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To: KarlInOhio

mormonism does have to do with Romney. Romney’s position in the corporation is significant.
His position is held because he adheres to the belief structure.
Romney is who he is because of his mormonism not in spite of it.


4 posted on 05/21/2012 7:47:11 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: KarlInOhio
Expect hundreds of stories on TV and in newspapers about Mormonism between now and November.

Proving, once again, that the Washington Post (and others) are nothing more than the media arm of the DNC.

The desperation of using an event that is over 150 years old is quite telling.

5 posted on 05/21/2012 7:47:35 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (When religions have to beg the gov't for a waiver, we are already under socialism.)
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To: Seizethecarp

not helpful to any boost in Mormon membership
____________________________________________

Its the Mormon doctrines and tenets that are not acceptable to many...

Mormons are leaving the religion in droves as they find out more of the beliefs...

Mormonism doesnt line up with the Bible for a reason...

Joey Smith the inventor of Mormonism hated Christians and Christianity...

He deliberately chose to include beliefs that were opposite and blasphemeous to the Ten Commandments and the teachings of the LORD Jesus Christ...

Leaders of Mormonism who followed him built on Smith’s errors by adding further heresies..

Joey Smith was a lazy good-for-nothing and occultist..

He wanted wine, women and song and wealth and easy street and power over others...

He found that religion and superstition was one of the fastest ways to seperate suckers from their money and property and to seduce young girls to give into his sexual lusts....

Most new converts and even Mormon born into the cult dont know about the evil history of the early days..

Until they died several proprets and leaders of Mormonism were still living in sin as polygamists right up to the mid 20th Century..

They were still “marrying” more “wives” up till at least 1920+

Decades after Utah became a state..

The 1890 “proclamation” meant nothing to them..

The Fancher party were not the only Christians that Brigham Young murdered..

Salt Lake City was a Gulug a theocratic prison during Youngs reign...

Anyone who wanted to leave Utah was hunted down and murdered...men women and children...

Even now skeletons are dug up in old backyards of SLC of whole families..

Murdered for disobeying Young or wanting to leave..


6 posted on 05/21/2012 7:50:59 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Seizethecarp

So?

Did everyone—or anyone—expect a slew of glowing reports about Mormons in the MSM?

Everyone knew this was coming.


7 posted on 05/21/2012 7:51:41 AM PDT by moonhawk (Rush, Mark, Sean: Conservative talkers. Sarah, Newt: Conservative DOers. Mitt: Conservative faker)
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To: Seizethecarp

Mountain Meadows,, mormon atrocity. Ok,,fair enough. Barack is a muslim who follows Marx as much as he can.

Will we be treated to Muslim and Socialist mass murder stories that occurred since the 1840s?

Interesting too,,,we can discuss mountain meadows, which nothing but a goober would walk around personally outraged about in 2012. But, we cant talk about Islamic atrocities happening in the last decade, or even the last year.


8 posted on 05/21/2012 7:55:16 AM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: Seizethecarp
And yet, there is scant evidence that Romney’s religion is making much difference in how voters here are thinking about the presidential election and whether they are willing to back the former Massachusetts governor.

That's because this is a fallen nation where Christianity is headed out the door. The utopian/secularism is becoming the religion of choice now a days.

9 posted on 05/21/2012 7:55:31 AM PDT by dragonblustar (Allah Ain't So Akbar!)
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To: Seizethecarp
Looks like the WashPost's "religious background research department" is working again.

It seems to be broken for all with a "D" after their name.

10 posted on 05/21/2012 7:57:55 AM PDT by Izzy Dunne (Hello, I'm a TAGLINE virus. Please help me spread by copying me into YOUR tag line.)
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To: Izzy Dunne

It seems to be broken for all with a “D” after their name.
_______________________________________

No

Harry Reids religion is right here...


11 posted on 05/21/2012 7:59:07 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: All

It wouldn’t surprise me in the least that these WaPo writers among others are being fed this stuff from Axelrod. This is how the Obama campaign will say that religion is off limits and they won’t attack Romney’s religion knowing full well these news outlets will be negative stories concerning the history of Mormonism.


12 posted on 05/21/2012 8:00:49 AM PDT by PizzaTheHut
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To: greyfoxx39

HEY !!!

Wheres my Oh SNAP award ???

:)


13 posted on 05/21/2012 8:00:49 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: PizzaTheHut

It wouldn’t surprise me in the least that these WaPo writers among others are being fed this stuff from Axelrod
_______________________________________________

AH No

They get it from Smith...


14 posted on 05/21/2012 8:02:07 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Seizethecarp

Washington Post is really going all out for this Prez


15 posted on 05/21/2012 8:05:53 AM PDT by CPT Clay (Pick up your weapon and follow me.)
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To: moonhawk
So? Did everyone—or anyone—expect a slew of glowing reports about Mormons in the MSM? Everyone knew this was coming.

Yep - expect the Obama side to replace Islam with Mormonism as the greatest threat the world has ever seen...

16 posted on 05/21/2012 8:07:27 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: PizzaTheHut

This info does not have to come from Axerod, it can come from mormon historical documents, internet searches, history books, their “religious” writings..........the internet has made it easy to expose mormonism for what it is.
The information is all there.


17 posted on 05/21/2012 8:08:15 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: DesertRhino

Mountain Meadows,, mormon atrocity. Ok,,fair enough. Barack is a muslim
_____________________________________________

Actually youre right...

Obama does belong here in this story...

Hes the 1st Mormon president...

His Momma Stanley Ann Dunham was dead dunked into Mormonism in June 2008..

Then she was “endowed” with full temple honors and “sealed” to her children making them full temple Mormons too...

According to the Mormons and their doctrines they now have their first Mormon president...

Oh and theres no way to undunk the dead dunked...

or unseal the dead errr sealed...

Oh SNAP

(This is turning into one big SNAPpy thread...)


18 posted on 05/21/2012 8:08:29 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Tennessee Nana
Harry Reids religion is right here...

Funny, Harry Reid is mentioned nowhere in the article. I wonder why?

19 posted on 05/21/2012 8:09:39 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: dirtboy

Nor is Obama mentioned but it didnt stop your cohorts...

I dont wonder why...


20 posted on 05/21/2012 8:11:33 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Tennessee Nana

“Anyone who wanted to leave Utah was hunted down and murdered...men women and children...

Even now skeletons are dug up in old backyards of SLC of whole families..

Murdered for disobeying Young or wanting to leave..”

I agree with all other things you listed, but please cite these three items if you can.. I would like to read up on it. Thanks.


21 posted on 05/21/2012 8:11:57 AM PDT by Bruinator ("For socialism is not merely the labour question, it is before all things an atheistic question")
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To: Erik Latranyi
Proving, once again, that the Washington Post (and others) are nothing more than the media arm of the DNC.

You have it backwards. The DNC is the political arm of the Media/Marxist/Higher Ed Axis.

22 posted on 05/21/2012 8:14:45 AM PDT by abb ("What ISN'T in the news is often more important than what IS." Ed Biersmith, 1942 -)
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To: Tennessee Nana
Nor is Obama mentioned but it didnt stop your cohorts...

First of all, they do manage to mention Obama. And my cohorts? I'm not the one running with a Wash Post hit piece here. And I am no Mitt supporter. I just don't like using MSM hit pieces on FR to further a particular agenda.

I dont wonder why...

I wonder why anyone on FR would do anything but trash this steaming pantload from the Wash Post.

23 posted on 05/21/2012 8:15:07 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: dirtboy; Izzy Dunne

Funny, Harry Reid is mentioned nowhere in the article. I wonder why?
__________________________________________

#10 from Izzy Dunne

“Looks like the WashPost’s “religious background research department” is working again.
It seems to be broken for all with a “D” after their name.”

and so I said

“Harry Reids religion is right here...”

Cause Harry has the required “D” and his religion is being mentioned

Oh SNAParoo


24 posted on 05/21/2012 8:15:36 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Seizethecarp

Us southerners don’t cotton to them thar mormon yankees. It’s ok to marry you sister - but not boof of ‘em! /sarc


25 posted on 05/21/2012 8:15:50 AM PDT by BO Stinkss
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To: Tennessee Nana

Harry Reid is not mentioned in this article. Mitt Romney is in the headline. It’s pretty clear to most folks what the agenda is here. I would hope folks could trash an obvious MSM hit piece without making apologies for it like you are attempting to do here with Reid.


26 posted on 05/21/2012 8:17:41 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: dirtboy

You want someone tellin gthe truth about Willard’s religion to be trashed ???

How are you on truth about Obama ???


27 posted on 05/21/2012 8:17:48 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: svcw

“mormonism does have to do with Romney. Romney’s position in the corporation is significant.”

Exactly. Mormonism defines his very existence. He’s no run-of-the-mill Mormon. He is a direct descendant of some of the earliest Mormon leaders. His family has been prominent in Mormonism from its inception. The Apostle Paul said of himself that he was a “Hebrew of Hebrews.” Well, in much the same way, Romney is a Mormon of Mormons. Many of us were called bigots (likely at the behest of Romney’s campaign) for saying this would be an issue for Romney.

I’m hooked on the horns of a dilemma. I want Obama out of the Oval Office with every fiber of my being, but my conscience tells me I cannot support a man whose presidency would certainly lead to further spread of his soul-damning heretical religion. Mormons are lost sinners trusting in a false gospel and I want nothing to do with any efforts to norm a stoneage cult.


28 posted on 05/21/2012 8:19:36 AM PDT by .45 Long Colt
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To: dirtboy

again Obama is not mentioned in the article either...

But that didnt stop the RomneyBots...

What are you lot ???

Comic relief for us poor abused Conservatives ???


29 posted on 05/21/2012 8:19:39 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Tennessee Nana
Uh, please point out where I have EVER said anything positive about Obama - to the contrary, I despite what he is and stands for.

Man, you really are pathetic here. You are attempting to trash me for daring to point out the obvious - that this is clearly an MSM hit piece. I see the MSM/DNC axis as a much more serious threat to this country than Romney. Granted, Romney can be pretty bad and still be less of a threat than the MSM - which is the case - but I still save my largest-caliber fire towards the bastards in the MSM who have no problem with lying by omission - and they omitted Reid's name from this article.

30 posted on 05/21/2012 8:21:46 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: KarlInOhio
"hundreds of stories on TV and in the newspapers."

This subject has been covered by history books and TV documentaries.

Go to YouTube where there are numerous clips.

31 posted on 05/21/2012 8:21:54 AM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: dirtboy

. I would hope folks could trash an obvious MSM hit piece without making apologies for it
__________________________________________________

Likewise I would hope folks could trash an obvious Mormon hit piece on Christians without making apologies for it


32 posted on 05/21/2012 8:22:20 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Tennessee Nana
again Obama is not mentioned in the article either...

Yes, he is. Try reading the whole thing, if that isn't too much of a distraction from your efforts to slime me.

33 posted on 05/21/2012 8:22:41 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: Tennessee Nana
Likewise I would hope folks could trash an obvious Mormon hit piece on Christians without making apologies for it

Uh, please point out in this article where it is such. Assuming, of course, that you could be bothered to read it.

34 posted on 05/21/2012 8:24:06 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: dirtboy

Kid youre forgeting...

It was you who dumped on me...

I never posted to you first...

Now if you dont want me to further have to defend myself against your RomneyBot attacks, leave off...

For every one of your unflattering posts to me going back for years, I have answered with distain..

I dont think Ive ever told a FReeper not to post to me...

I just wont put up with abuse...

Post away to your hearts content..

Just not defensive lies about your boy Willard..

and dont go sending me any FReepMail..


35 posted on 05/21/2012 8:28:39 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: dirtboy

your efforts to slime me.
_________________________________

LOL

Kid is that even possible....


36 posted on 05/21/2012 8:30:24 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Seizethecarp

Obama’s religion of “Liberation Theology” sprinkled with Islam and Marxism is off the table, according to Romney. Hard to understand why he would take such a step knowing that Mormanism was going to be a major attack point on him (Romney).


37 posted on 05/21/2012 8:32:52 AM PDT by flyover
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To: dirtboy

Likewise I would hope folks could trash an obvious Mormon hit piece on Christians without making apologies for it
Uh, please point out in this article where it is such. Assuming, of course, that you could be bothered to read it.
___________________________________________

“On Sept. 11, 1857, a wagon train from this part of Arkansas met with a gruesome fate in Utah, where most of the travelers were slaughtered by a Mormon militia in an episode known as the Mountain Meadows Massacre.”


38 posted on 05/21/2012 8:33:41 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Tennessee Nana
Now if you dont want me to further have to defend myself against your RomneyBot attacks, leave off..

Romneybot attacks? Cripes, you really are more pathetic with each passing post.

I simply pointed out that Reid was not mentioned in the article and you have turned that into a claim that I dumped on you. If the truth is dumping, then you really have a problem. And I am NO Romneybot. You will never find me posting anything favorable about Romney. I just see the MSM/DNC axis as the greatest danger to this country's core values. The GOP-E and the Romney campaign aren't far behind, but the MSM goons have been doing this long before Romney came on the scene and they will continue to keep up their propaganda until they are driven into the ground by counterattacks. You may like their attacks on Romney, but it never stops there - ask Sarah Palin. I am NOT trying to defend Romney, just instead standing off the MSM slime machine which will be turned on a conservative tomorrow.

So go ahead. Run with their spin. It apparently is making you dizzy.

39 posted on 05/21/2012 8:34:19 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: Tennessee Nana

Please explain to me how that sentence of historical fac t represents a Mormon hit piece on Christians. I’m waiting.


40 posted on 05/21/2012 8:38:34 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: .45 Long Colt

Well stated, Colt.


41 posted on 05/21/2012 8:42:39 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Tennessee Nana

YYYAAAAWWWWWWNNNNNNNN!

Obama loves a political system and philosophy which resulted in the starvation of nearly 20,000,000 people in the Ukraine.

Romney just needs to claim to “not have listened” for the past 40 years in Church like Obama.


42 posted on 05/21/2012 8:44:11 AM PDT by LeonardFMason
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To: dirtboy

Why is this “trash hit piece”, all it is doing to exposing mormonism and Romney.
Name something that is incorrect about the information.


43 posted on 05/21/2012 8:44:40 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: svcw
I'm sorry, but it clearly a DNC-planted article.

I don't like Romney either. But I'll be damned if I give this kind of crap any credence or legitimacy by running with it. Because tomorrow the sights of the same weapon will be turned on the likes of Scott Walker or Sarah Palin or some other conservative that the MSM/DNC views as the enemy.

44 posted on 05/21/2012 8:50:08 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: svcw

It’s not a trash hit piece. Romney’s cult should be fully exposed for what it is just as Obama’s black liberation cult should be exposed. Shine the light of truth on both.


45 posted on 05/21/2012 9:03:57 AM PDT by .45 Long Colt
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To: svcw

Actually the article is pro-Mormons...

If one bothers to read it all, one finds that the author thinks that the poor Mormons were the “persecuted” lot..

“The massacre was an anomaly for the church, because it was Mormons who were more likely to be targeted in the early days of their religion, which was founded in the 1830s and 1840s.

Mormons had been attacked by mobs and forcibly ejected from states. They were viewed as a political threat and targeted for their now-abandoned practice of polygamy.”

and

“Their journey took them through Utah, where a skittish Mormon population had sought refuge from persecution”

and other spots...

and Parley Pratt ???

Why he was an innocent Mormon who was “murdered” and for apparantly no reason...

“Parley Pratt, an ancestor of Romney’s and an esteemed figure in the Mormon Church, was murdered in Arkansas shortly before the Mountain Meadows Massacre. Historians have speculated that anger over this killing may have played a part in the massacre.”

No mention there all all that he was a polygamist who was killed by a very upset husband of the woman he had stolen for a 40th or so extra “wife”..

So this is no “trashy hit piece” ...

this is a very nice piece about the nice wee friendly fuzzy misunderstood and persecuted Mormons...

While the descendants of the murdered Fancher wagon train are made to look nasty and vengengeful...


46 posted on 05/21/2012 9:06:40 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Seizethecarp

Dingy Harry Reid is a Mormon, but nobody ever brings that up!..............


47 posted on 05/21/2012 9:08:31 AM PDT by Red Badger (Think logically. Act normally.................)
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To: Erik Latranyi
.

The desperation of using an event that is over 150 years old is quite telling.


Your above "Romney Spin Line" will last about 0.000001 nanoseconds in the Presidential Campaign ...



Perhaps the "silver-lining" message that The Washington Post is (stupidly, as an Obama Propaganda Rag) sending everyone ...

is that by the time Mittens has to apologoze for the galactic laundry list of Mormon racism, cult status, murderous ways ... and Planet Kolob (it's in the constellation Cancer, doncha know) ...

Obama-Axelrod will be able to win the election by simply staying at home watching Three Stooges Movies ...



The "fact" is that EVEN IF Mittens was willing to apologize for all these items ...

he's so (miserablely) inarticulate that Romney would even blotch the apologies ...

even if they were broadcast on Fox News ... and Rush Limbaugh and Shawn Hannity were doing the voice-overs ...



Romey's campaign will make Juan McCain's 2008 run look like Patton's Third Army taking Messina ... or the Marines raising the U.S. Flag on Iwo Jima ...

Hint: See my tagline ...



Bonus Question for you, Erik ...

How does Mittens answer this question in the Presidential Debates, as presented by George Stephanopoulos ...

"Govenor Romney, given that NO ONE one in your family for SEVEN generations has ever served in the U.S. Military ...

and the the Mormon Cult activiely pursued Succession so that they could own Black Slaves and have their Men could have Multiple Wives ...

what gives you the "moral authority" to either serve as Commander in Chief ...

or defend the idea that "Marriage is between one Man and and (only) ONE Woman ...."




.
48 posted on 05/21/2012 9:11:22 AM PDT by Patton@Bastogne (Newt Gingrich and Sarah Palin will DEFEAT the Obama-Romney Socialist Gay-Marriage Axis of Evil)
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To: Patton@Bastogne
.

"Ouch", in advance, Erik ...

Just trying to be sympathetic to your pro-Romney sentiments ...


.
49 posted on 05/21/2012 9:14:49 AM PDT by Patton@Bastogne (Newt Gingrich and Sarah Palin will DEFEAT the Obama-Romney Socialist Gay-Marriage Axis of Evil)
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To: Seizethecarp

Sandhya Somashekhar
@sandhyawp
Unlikely National Politics reporter for @WashingtonPost.
Email me at sandhya@washpost.com.

Washington, DC · http://www.washingtonpost.com

http://twitter.com/#!/sandhyawp

50 posted on 05/21/2012 9:34:02 AM PDT by kcvl
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