Skip to comments.Looking at Child Porn Is Totally Legal in New York State
Posted on 05/09/2012 7:38:26 PM PDT by neverdem
Logic takes us strange places sometimes, like when a judge found herself writing this little gem: "The purposeful viewing of child pornography on the internet is now legal in New York." That's a sentence you'd want to wash your hands after committing to paper (heck, or wash your eyes after reading), but it comes at the end of a line of reasoning in an appeals court decision that makes sense even if it appears to provide a loophole for kiddie porn lovers.
Essentially, the court ruled on Tuesday, you can't be held responsible for things you just see online, even kiddie porn, the viewing of which isn't actually illegal under New York law. As MSNBC.com's M. Alex Johnson reports, the majority opinion by New York Court of Appeals Senior Judge Carmen Ciparik:
"Rather, some affirmative act is required (printing, saving, downloading, etc.) to show that defendant in fact exercised dominion and control over the images that were on his screen," Ciparick wrote. "To hold otherwise, would extend the reach of (state law) to conduct — viewing — that our Legislature has not deemed criminal."
It's true: Under article 263 of New York's penal code, it's illegal to create, possess, distribute, promote, or facilitate child pornography, but it's not illegal simply to view it...
(Excerpt) Read more at theatlanticwire.com ...
There are two threads about this. The other one is (or was yesterday, haven’t looked yet) very contentious. The number of people tacitly supporting that just “looking” at child porn should not be illegal makes me want to vomit and leave FR.
Some made the excuse that people can get loaded up with child porn accidentally but to me that is just an excuse. As you noted, there is a gulf of difference between accident and purposeful intent.
Ah, but if they are under the age of consent it is not their decision as to what is being done to their bodies, therefore what is being done is being done by or at the behest of an adult, who is another person, and therefore is culpable under the law.
Sexual acts, in and of themselves, are not illegal (obviously - people would become very scarce if that were true). Giving people money is not illegal (obviously - charities would be out of business if that were the case). If a woman has sex with a total stranger, then sure, I would class that as an immoral act with very dire consequences, but it isn't illegal, because she has free will under the law to have sex with whomever she wants to (assuming everyone involved is a consenting adult of course). And if a sexual partner gives her money, that is very suspicious, but again not illegal. I'm married. I have a sexual relationship with my wife and I give her money all the time. How can you, legally speaking, separate that from what a prostitute does?
All I'm trying to make clear is that solicitation (by whoever) is what makes prostitution illegal. In other words, if a prostitute or a third party (a pimp) asks for money for sexual favors, or offers her body on the understanding she will receive payment. A sexual encounter, no matter how casual, may be very unwise for all the reasons you list, but it is not illegal. It is the selling of sex that is illegal.
I have an issue with going after someone unless you can prove they deliberately sought child porn. People do end up in a lot of websites they wouldn’t have chosen. Having an image or two in the chache is far from proof of intent to seeking child porn.
I don’t think FR people are wanting to allowed people to view child porn, so much as they are concerned with going after people who didn’t seeking child porn but ended up finding a picture by accident.
That said, claims of a virus downloading child porn into a computer are suspect at best. I have never heard of that happening. I’ve had more viruses than an african brothal, (I’m very risky online), but never one that started downloading files.
If you can't see the difference, I doubt anything I'm going to say can make much difference, but here goes anyway....
There is no sense in bringing marriage into it as an example. Marriage is a commitment between a man and woman to be husband and wife. It's his obligation to support her, sex notwithstanding, based on the marriage contract and his obligation as a husband. The fact that the coincidentally happen to have sex some times and he gives her money sometimes, is irrelevant because he is not buying sexual favors from her in a business transaction as prostitution does.
The very definition of prostitution involves selling the sex, not just having it.
Any female who just gives herself away is not a prostitute. A tramp, yes, but not a prostitute.
Prostitution, selling sex for money or favors, is NOT a victimless crime. Often the prostitutes are controlled to the point of slavery, by pimps. They can and do spread disease which can be passed onto others by either partner.
Just because there are not immediate and dire consequences to prostitution does not mean it's a victimless crime.
Now that anal sex is considered “normal”, this will be the next perversion to demand acceptance.
How is it you extrapolated this from my posts? When making a comment that gets this serious, can you at least reference a sentence, or part of a sentence that you are referring to?
"saved child porn onto another persons computer" The answer is no, your quip had to do with him letting a friend have access to his computer, so then, why this leap to an extreme?
“type christian into a search and see what you get. Youll likely get a really shock.”
I guess your assuming this is my first tricycle trip around the block?
“I dont know about you, but should someone hack my computer and put kiddie porn on it......and the hacker just happened to put kiddie porn on my hard drive.”
You repeat yourself....but, I digress.
“That a picture in the cache only means that they REACHED a website with child porn”
Can a person clear their cache? If so, are there not “shredder” software that will make useless all deleted files?
If I felt the internet was getting corrupt enough that security measures were no longer able to keep me from malicious intrusion......I would simplify what I do and get rid of the internet. Having it wouldn't be worth any implication with this darkness.
It should be illegal of course.
He’s been trying.....
anybody that try's to defend that is a sick twist
I thought I posted a reply, but it isn’t showing. If this is a repeat, sorry.
So is incompetence or carelessness in IT security now a crime in your eyes?
How is it you extrapolated this from my posts? When making a comment that gets this serious, can you at least reference a sentence, or part of a sentence that you are referring to?”
I would have referenced the sentence, but my phone has no cut and past ability. It also tends to make me sound ghetto because of the auto correct.
The ‘crime in your eyes?” comment was because your entire post 43 suggested you felt that way. Apologies if I was wrong.
Um,I’ve looked over my posts and I didn’t say anything about another person’s computer. I think you got that from someone else. I don’t personally buy into the “A virus did it,” or, “My computer was hacked.” While technically possible, viruses are more designed for stealing data or taking you to a sales site. I’ve never seen a virus take me to a kiddy porn site.
I guess your assuming this is my first tricycle trip around the block?”
You sounded like you didn’t believe people can reach bad sites by accident.
You repeat yourself....but, I digress.
Again, you’re responding to someone else. This isn’t my post and I don’t buy the hacker or virus argument.
Can a person clear their cache? If so, are there not shredder software that will make useless all deleted files?
Most people don’t even know what cache is, and even IT pros don’t exactly go around emptying it all the time. As for shredders, I don’t personally have anything I’m trying to protect that needs shredded, and shredders look guilty as hell to authorities.
If you can and choose to do without the net, that’s your choice. Most of us in the modern world don’t get a choice. The internet is a part of daily life, whether we want it or not. You can’t even job hunt effectively without the internet anymore.
Nor is internet security really the issue. I have fairly good security. I don’t think I’ve ever actually been sent to a child porn site, and I’m fairly careless on the internet. Siteadvisor by McAfee is great. But most people end up in bad sites simply from doing web searches.
“i know... and it’s NOT child sex, it’s child SEXUAL ABUSE and CHILD RAPE!!!
anybody that try’s to defend that is a sick twist “
I’ve heard some duzzies of ways to defend child sex.
I didn’t think anything was worse that what went on on Dateline: To Catch a Predator
Then I talk with guys at work. They scared the hell out of me with their excuses for why it isn’t so bad.
As for finding myself somewhere that is odious.....in the almost 30 years on the internet, I may have stumbled into them only a couple of times.
Then again, you have to understand, I can bore people to death with what I consider “reading material”.
It's usually technical or educational.
People I meet might ask me what I like to read....they get bored just hearing about it.
Geology, physics, general science.....etc., of which, I have minors in all disciplines.
When there is no doubt to a pedophiles crime of a real life sexual nature, I'm more harsh than you.....incarceration is not good enough.
That is an example of how boring I am.
“When there is no doubt to a pedophiles crime of a real life sexual nature, I’m more harsh than you.....incarceration is not good enough. “
It is if they get life with Bubba. Then again, another freeper earlier commented that it isn’t right to hope someone gets raped. But I have a hard time wishing for the safety of any sex predator.
We’ve had a incident of a predator in my own family, and the guy was turned back out onto the streets. It didn’t take a prophet to predict he would have another victim. A teen girl wouldn’t have been harmed by him had society done the right thing and kept him behind bars or killed him.
“As for finding myself somewhere that is odious.....in the almost 30 years on the internet, I may have stumbled into them only a couple of times.”
You started early in the net, didn’t you? Didn’t DARPA still run it back then? It depends on what you’re looking up. I’ve spent a lot of time in games, which is a favorite target for those on the internet seeking victims. Even some of the research I’ve done for books has gotten some bad results, and most of that is technical stuff for science fiction books. So far, no kiddy stuff.
Well.....I wish you continued good surfing......DAKINE!!!
Thanks for the ping!
Metmom, I’m agreeing with you. I’m just setting out the legal position, which is what the thread is about.
I’m not justifying anything. I’m agreeing with you.
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