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Sunday Morning Talk Show Thread 6 May 2012
Various driveby media television networks ^ | 6 May 2012 | Various Self-Serving Politicians and Big Media Screaming Faces

Posted on 05/06/2012 4:51:31 AM PDT by Alas Babylon!

The Talk Shows

May 6th, 2012

Guests to be interviewed today on major television talk shows:

FOX NEWS SUNDAY (Fox Network): Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla.

MEET THE PRESS (NBC): Vice President Joe Biden; Sen. Kelly Ayotte, R-N.H.

FACE THE NATION (CBS): Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich; Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn.; Sen. Chuck U. Schumer, D-N.Y.; former Gov. Howard Dean, D-Vt.

THIS WEEK (ABC): Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz.; David Assholerod, adviser to President Barack Obama’s re-election campaign.

STATE OF THE UNION (CNN): Gingrich; Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif.; Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Mich.; former Rep. Tom Davis, R-Va.; former Gov. Ted Strickland, D-Ohio.

TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: guests; lineup; sunday; talkshows
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To: kabar

Thanks for the graphs. Nothing brings it home like this stuff does.

151 posted on 05/06/2012 12:15:00 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: kabar

Go easy on her today she’s “in love”.

152 posted on 05/06/2012 12:16:17 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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I readily admit Marco is not a NBC.He was born here but parents were not. For that matter zero is an illegal alien. I am tired of the double standard,if they can break rules we can as well.

153 posted on 05/06/2012 12:18:02 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: Fishtalk
We already have a third party of sorts.

Its the Tea Party. They are smart enough not to run against the Republicans where the country will get hurt but whenever they can take out a rino or liberal dem they are right there. One day It may well change from within. Will it be tomorrow? Hardly. But it could and may happen.

154 posted on 05/06/2012 12:26:48 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: y'all
if they can break rules we can as well.

Yeah...screw the Constitution.

155 posted on 05/06/2012 12:32:04 PM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate Republicans Freed the Slaves Month.)
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To: altura

I never understood the hatred of all the candidates on FR. They all had their positives and negatives and to pretend otherwise was not honest. I would easily prefer Perry over Romney but he won the primary so he is the nominee.

It is now a choice between him and Ocommie and anything else ignores reality. We still see thread after thread trashing Romney just like we did against the other candidates. National suicide is not the answer.

Pray for America

156 posted on 05/06/2012 12:37:41 PM PDT by bray (Power to We the People)
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To: bray

Words of wisdom as usual. To not support Romney is basically to support the other side which makes no sense whatsoever.

157 posted on 05/06/2012 12:40:53 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: Alas Babylon!

Crowley was really flying her DNC flag as she continually tried to interrupt Newt and repeated fake poll after poll. She wouldn’t mention any of the polls showing his problem with women over 30 or dropping minority votes.

With over 40% unemployment does he really expect an enthusiastic Black vote?

158 posted on 05/06/2012 12:41:28 PM PDT by bray (Power to We the People)
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To: bray
I have been here a long time, Second sign on. FR gets nutty during election run ups so I kind of stay out of the way. Remember that the State Elections are as important as the FEDERAL, Vote Conservative for Sen And Rep and those down the list and stay on their ass that way we win.

For Pres vote for the one that is going to hurt you the least.

159 posted on 05/06/2012 12:58:21 PM PDT by Little Bill (Sorry)
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To: kabar

If I’m ‘beyond salvation’ kindly stop posting to me.

And I’m gonna speak with God at once to see if he has a different opinion.

160 posted on 05/06/2012 1:08:53 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: Alas Babylon!

I had high hopes for that thread and am glad that Jim has at least agreed not to ban Romney supporters.

But the thread itself was really depressing.

Too many people living in a dream world and basically on the path to elect Obama.

161 posted on 05/06/2012 1:12:22 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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I could be wrong but I remember reading Rubio’s parents had applied but were not naturalized at the time of is birth. Of course, since the media has given a pass to 0 it would be hard for them to complain about it, but they will.

162 posted on 05/06/2012 1:12:36 PM PDT by Morgan in Denver (Democrats: the law of unintended consequences in action.)
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To: bray

Amen, bray. Thank you for the essays you post here every Sunday. And thank you for being a good person, never nasty.

It’s really appreciated here.

163 posted on 05/06/2012 1:16:41 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: altura

“We could use a woman like her” AMEN!!

164 posted on 05/06/2012 1:16:53 PM PDT by mtnwmn (Liberalism leads to Socialism)
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To: Miss Marple

Thanks for common sense and a rational point of view.

A poster here who shall not be named loves to come up with horrific facts and figures but proposes no solutions.

Other posters say the borders can’t be closed.

The borders can be closed and I agree with you about self-deportation. In fact, we may all be tempted to self deport if Obama gets back in.

There are solutions to the illegal problem. We just need leadership to do it and arguing about it won’t solve it.

165 posted on 05/06/2012 1:21:51 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: Son House

They are too afraid of not being re-elected! That’s more important than the country.

166 posted on 05/06/2012 1:28:09 PM PDT by mtnwmn (Liberalism leads to Socialism)
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To: All

Wow! Sarkozy lost in France. They’ve elected a pure socialist. A little while, and France will be the new Greece. Austerity (and reality) throw in the towel! Germany cannot save Europe, then.

167 posted on 05/06/2012 1:35:55 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!

France has a huge Communist party. The French people have been down the socialist road before (when times were easier) and I am sure they think that electing a socialist will bring back the good times.

Well, are they in for a surprise. Germany won’t work with them if they insist on their stupid spending, and pretty soon the money will stop flowing their way. It would not surprise me to find out that Sarkozy was a target of Soros.

All I can tell you is that I am going to England at the end of the month, but I am NOT going to France. And it is time to stop buying French wine again.

168 posted on 05/06/2012 2:13:49 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Miss Marple
I meant exactly what I said. Local talk radio was full of people complaining about bi-lingual signs in the drugstores, hearing Spanish being spoken in laundromats, complaints about Hispanics opening businesses. It was flat-out anti-Hispanic crap and it was tolerated by our local talk radio host. People like Malkin were so hateful in their comments that it gave license to people to make comments like this.

Besides the fact that Hispanic was an artifically contrived classification that was developed for a number of reasons, including creating another victim class that could have benefits conferred on them such as affirmative action and minority business set asides, we are having a real problem in assimilation in this country. Language is one of the factors that can affect how well an immigrant assimilates into this culture.

Professor Huntington of Harvard wrote a great article in Foreign Affairs (2004), The Hispanic Challenge that is well worth the read even today. His point about language is on the mark. It is pertinent because Hispanics comprise 16% of the population today, up from 1% in 1970 and they will be a third of the US population by 2050 according the Bureau of the Census. Immigrantion and birthrates will ensure that result.

"The persistent inflow of Hispanic immigrants threatens to divide the United States into two peoples, two cultures, and two languages. Unlike past immigrant groups, Mexicans and other Latinos have not assimilated into mainstream U.S. culture, forming instead their own political and linguistic enclaves—from Los Angeles to Miami—and rejecting the Anglo-Protestant values that built the American dream. The United States ignores this challenge at its peril."

"The size, persistence, and concentration of Hispanic immigration tends to perpetuate the use of Spanish through successive generations. The evidence on English acquisition and Spanish retention among immigrants is limited and ambiguous. In 2000, however, more than 28 million people in the United States spoke Spanish at home (10.5 percent of all people over age five), and almost 13.8 million of these spoke English worse than “very well,” a 66 percent increase since 1990. According to a U.S. Census Bureau report, in 1990 about 95 percent of Mexican-born immigrants spoke Spanish at home; 73.6 percent of these did not speak English very well; and 43 percent of the Mexican foreign-born were “linguistically isolated.” An earlier study in Los Angeles found different results for the U.S.-born second generation. Just 11.6 percent spoke only Spanish or more Spanish than English, 25.6 percent spoke both languages equally, 32.7 percent more English than Spanish, and 30.1 percent only English. In the same study, more than 90 percent of the U.S.-born people of Mexican origin spoke English fluently. Nonetheless, in 1999, some 753,505 presumably second-generation students in Southern California schools who spoke Spanish at home were not proficient in English."

"Spanish retention is also bolstered by the overwhelming majorities (between 66 percent and 85 percent) of Mexican immigrants and Hispanics who emphasize the need for their children to be fluent in Spanish. These attitudes contrast with those of other immigrant groups. The New Jersey-based Educational Testing Service finds “a cultural difference between the Asian and Hispanic parents with respect to having their children maintain their native language.” In part, this difference undoubtedly stems from the size of Hispanic communities, which creates incentives for fluency in the ancestral language. Although second- and third-generation Mexican Americans and other Hispanics acquire competence in English, they also appear to deviate from the usual pattern by maintaining their competence in Spanish. Second- or third-generation Mexican Americans who were brought up speaking only English have learned Spanish as adults and are encouraging their children to become fluent in it. Spanish-language competence, University of New Mexico professor F. Chris Garcia has stated, is “the one thing every Hispanic takes pride in, wants to protect and promote.”

Perhaps equally important, business groups seeking to corner the Hispanic market support bilingualism as well. Indeed, the orientation of U.S. businesses to Hispanic customers means they increasingly need bilingual employees; therefore, bilingualism is affecting earnings. Bilingual police officers and firefighters in southwestern cities such as Phoenix and Las Vegas are paid more than those who only speak English. In Miami, one study found, families that spoke only Spanish had average incomes of $18,000; English-only families had average incomes of $32,000; and bilingual families averaged more than $50,000. For the first time in U.S. history, increasing numbers of Americans (particularly black Americans) will not be able to receive the jobs or the pay they would otherwise receive because they can speak to their fellow citizens only in English.

"In the debates over language policy, the late California Republican Senator S.I. Hayakawa once highlighted the unique role of Hispanics in opposing English. “Why is it that no Filipinos, no Koreans object to making English the official language? No Japanese have done so. And certainly not the Vietnamese, who are so damn happy to be here. They're learning English as fast as they can and winning spelling bees all across the country. But the Hispanics alone have maintained there is a problem. There [has been] considerable movement to make Spanish the second official language.”

"If the spread of Spanish as the United States' second language continues, it could, in due course, have significant consequences in politics and government. In many states, those aspiring to political office might have to be fluent in both languages. Bilingual candidates for president and elected federal positions would have an advantage over English-only speakers. If dual-language education becomes prevalent in elementary and secondary schools, teachers will increasingly be expected to be bilingual. Government documents and forms could routinely be published in both languages. The use of both languages could become acceptable in congressional hearings and debates and in the general conduct of government business. Because most of those whose first language is Spanish will also probably have some fluency in English, English speakers lacking fluency in Spanish are likely to be and feel at a disadvantage in the competition for jobs, promotions, and contracts."

Now, it may be that you and others here are not anti-Hispanic, but don’t tell me there aren’t a portion of people who ARE, and they are on both sides of the aisle. We just had police called in to a gang fight at one of the high schools between blacks and Hispanics.

The Left has been very successful in making anti-illgal immigrant into anti Hispanic and then blurring the line between legal and illegal immigrant. Blacks and Hispanics have been at odds with another because they are competing for the same jobs and political position. They share many common characteristics that don't bode well for the formation of a permanent underclass. Hispanics have an out of wedlock birthrate of 50% topped only by the black rate of 71%. Hispanics have school drop out rates of over 50% with blacks coming in second as a group this is the social pathology for failure in our society. The unemployment rate (BLS for April) for blacks is 13% and for Hispanics 10.1%.

Educational attainment among Hispanics remains very low. Just 10% of foreign-born and 13.5% of native Latinos have finished college, placing the group's completion rate at about a third of the national average.

If people really were serious about this issue then why didn’t the GOP accept the guest worker program President Bush put forth? This issue has been hijacked by people who are not interested in a solution and are simply stirring the bad feeling.

First, we already have a large guest worker program that has close to two million people here on temporary work visas. Here is a list of all the various work visas permitted for entry into the US.

Second, do we really need more guest workers at a time when 22 million Americans are looking for full time employment? Is There a Shortage of Skilled Foreign Workers?

Third, we bring in 1.2 million legal immigrants a year. 25% of the adults lack even a high school education. Do we need more high school dropouts in this country. We just had the biggest number of immigrants in the decade ending in 2010, yet the decade experienced a net loss of jobs. Our immigration policy is not bringing in the kinds of immigrants we want or in the numbers we want.

Finally, we are bringing in 125,000 legal foreign workers a month now that includes permanent immigrants and those here on temporary work permits. We created 119,000 jobs last month.

125,000 brand new foreign workers with work permits each month -- HERE'S THE PROOF

The rest could become permanent legal residents without citizenship privileges.

What kind of message does that send to the 3 million intending legal immigrants waiting their turn to enter overseas? They have completed the required paperwork, background checks, and physicals.

Do you really believe we could create a permanent legal class of residents of this country who could never become citizens despite paying taxes, SS, serving in the military, etc. It would never pass constitutional muster. And why should we reward illegality?

Conservatives are fond of saying the liberals are the ones who make decisions on emotions, but I haven’t seen evidence of much rationality on the conservative side over the last 6 years. Either the premise is wrong, or we have a lot of people who are not conservatives here. Take your choice.

What I am truly amazed at is how ill-informed most Americans are about the immigration issue, which I believe is the defining issue of our time.

Immigration, legal and illegal, has had and will continue to have a major and far-reaching impact across a broad spectrum of existential challenges that confront this nation, e.g., national security, the economy/global competitiveness, jobs, health care, taxes, energy independence, education, entitlement reform, law enforcement, social welfare programs, physical infrastructure, the environment, civil liberties, and a continued sense of national identity/shared sense of endeavor. Immigration policy is the defining issue of our time with enormous implications for the future of this nation and the preservation of our patrimony. Changes to our existing immigration policies should be an integral part of the solutions to our problems. Yet, rarely will you read or hear immigration policy linked to these challenges by the political and media elites. Instead, legal immigration has become the third rail of American politics—for Republicans only.

Malkin wrote a book on immigration some time ago. She understands the issue far better than most conservatives as does Pat Buchanan who has taken plenty of heat for this views. Those of us who are actively involved in the issue are used to being called nativists, racists, and bigots. But facts are facts. Unless we have an immigration policy that serves the interests of this nation, we will continue to be transformed into a far different nation, which no longer shares the vision and values of our Founders.

The U.S. adds one international migrant (net) every 36 seconds. Immigrants account for one in 8 U.S. residents, the highest level in more than 90 years. In 1970 it was one in 21; in 1980 it was one in 16; and in 1990 it was one in 13. In a decade, it will be one in 7, the highest it has been in our history. And by 2050, one in 5 residents of the U.S. will be foreign-born.

Currently, 1.6 million legal and illegal immigrants settle in the country each year; 350,000 immigrants leave each year, resulting in a net immigration of 1.25 million. Since 1970, the U.S. population has increased from 203 million to 310 million, i.e., over 100 million. In the next 40 years, the population will increase by an additional 130 million to 440 million. Three-quarters of the increase in our population since 1970 and the projected increase will be the result of immigration. The U.S., the world’s third most populous nation, has the highest annual rate of population growth of any developed country in the world, i.e., 0.963% (2011 estimate,) principally due to immigration.

The nation’s immigrant population (legal and illegal) reached 40 million in 2010, the highest number in our history. The U.S. immigrant population has doubled since 1990, nearly tripled since 1980, and quadrupled since 1970, when it stood at 9.7 million. Of the 40 million immigrants in the country in 2010, 13.9 million arrived in 2000 or later making it the highest decade of immigration in American history, even though there was a net loss of jobs during the decade. Growth in the immigrant population has primarily been driven by high levels of legal immigration. Roughly three-fourths of immigrants in the country are here legally. With nearly 12 million immigrants, Mexico was by far the top immigrant-sending country, accounting for 29 percent of all immigrants and 29 percent of growth in the immigrant population from 2000 to 2010.

87 percent of the 1.2 million legal immigrants entering annually are minorities as defined by the U.S. Government and almost all of the illegal aliens are minorities. By 2019 half of the children 18 and under in the U.S. will be classified as minorities and by 2039, half of the residents of this country will be minorities. Generally, immigrants and minorities vote predominantly for the Democrat Party. Hence, Democrats view immigration as a never-ending source of voters that will make them the permanent majority party.

57% of immigrant headed households with children use at least one major welfare program. Milton Friedman said that, “You cannot simultaneously have free immigration and a welfare state.” We have both.

Republicans must take the lead on the initiation of a dialogue with the American people on immigration. The status quo is not an option because the demographic changes wrought by immigration will slowly strangle the Republican Party and an amnesty will just hasten the process putting the final nail in the coffin of this country and the GOP. Americans should have an opportunity to decide whether our immigration policies are to serve the long-term interests of all Americans or the short-term interests of corporate and special (often political, religious and ethnic) interest groups. Legal immigration is a controllable variable that can be adjusted in the national interest if we have the political will to do so. And illegal immigration can be stopped and reversed if we as a nation make a resolute commitment to secure our borders and enforce our existing laws.

169 posted on 05/06/2012 3:01:43 PM PDT by kabar
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To: rodguy911

Agreed. Immigration to America is a privilege, not a right. And we must have an immigration policy that serves the interests of this country. We will never be able to absorb the billions of people who want to come here. We have to set limits and bring in those people who can best make this nation competitive in the global economy. We don’t need to import poverty and high school dropouts. We have plenty of both at home.

170 posted on 05/06/2012 3:08:18 PM PDT by kabar
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To: altura; Miss Marple
A poster here who shall not be named loves to come up with horrific facts and figures but proposes no solutions.

Advocate a pro-immigrant policy of low immigration.

Conservatives need to provide the American people with their own comprehensive immigration reform plan, i.e., give people a reason to vote FOR something rather than just attack the other side’s proposals. Such a plan should contain the following elements:

 Formulate a merit based immigration system that brings in the skills and talents to keep us competitive in the global economy;

 Reduce immigration levels based on need more closely approximating 300,000 a year vice the current 1.2 million;

 Eliminate extended chain migration, i.e., family reunification, limiting it to the nuclear family, and the Diversity Visa lottery program;

 Secure the border;

 Enforce existing immigration laws to reduce the current illegal alien population and limit future illegal immigration, i.e., attrition thru enforcement. Enforcement would include: (1) ending the job magnet; (2) increasing coordination at the federal level by eliminating barriers to information sharing among agencies; (3) leveraging state and local enforcement resources; (4) fully implementing the US-VISIT Program to track and deport visa overstays; and (5) make mandatory and improve such programs as E-Verify and 287 [g] authority to assist employers and law enforcement in identifying illegal aliens;

 Eliminate birthright citizenship;

 Ensure that anyone who enters this nation illegally is not rewarded by being permitted to stay and work here; i.e., no amnesty;

 Streamline the processing and adjudication of immigration cases;

 Promote pro-immigrant measures that help newcomers assimilate and embrace the values and principles of our Founders and the Constitution.

171 posted on 05/06/2012 3:15:53 PM PDT by kabar
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To: Alas Babylon!
Yep. I fear the same thing will happen here. The public has become so dependent upon government and a feeling of entitlement that they will not want to go thru the necessary pain to get us out of this mess. You can't spend your way out of the problem with borrowed money.

Politicians who speak the truth and recommend tough solutions will be defeated.

172 posted on 05/06/2012 3:19:51 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

Well, thank you for posting that extremely long and condescending reply.

I really am not getting into a huge discussion with you. Since you used to work for the State Department you have access to a wealth of statistics that I do not.

But regardless of whether Michelle Malkin is an expert or not (and you REALLY want to bring up Pat Buchanan?) I will tell you that she is becoming increasingly vitriolic on television and she DID encourage the anti-Mexican/Peruvian/Honduran/Brazilian/ Colombian/ Venezuelan/Dominican/Chilean etc. faction to make racist comments locally, and our idiotic local talk-show host never stopped it and in fact encouraged it. (Sorry for listing all of the countries. I didn’t want to use that “contrived” word - Hispanic.)

So basically, your advice is to have a DIALOGUE. Wow. That’s some solution! Let’s all just TALK about it for another 10 years.

Pfft. I may not be some super-sophisticated State Department veteran, but we need action, not talk.

Adios, amigo! (That there is Spanish, or “Hispanic” talk.)

173 posted on 05/06/2012 3:22:31 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Miss Marple
I meant exactly what I said.

Well good on you. Many of us are anti-immigrant even though the vast majority of us sprung from immigrants. Just type it out and boom, it becomes truth. Of course it couldn't be you meant the majority of us were anti-ILLEGAL immigrants, perish the thought.

Fine. You have the last word.

Have a nice evening.

174 posted on 05/06/2012 3:25:23 PM PDT by Fishtalk (
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To: Miss Marple

The French are like the hard left here they expect to siphon everything they need off the producers who are capitalists yet they embrace socialism. Go figure.

175 posted on 05/06/2012 3:32:42 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: kabar
What scares me is you just cited stats that assert we are getting over a million per year in new immigrants. A paper I read by a semi religious org.cant recall who it was that did a real in-depth study suggested that the correct number is really more like 150-200 k per year and for the next few years "0" since we have had such a huge influx. There is no way we can continue to pay for this kind of immigration of people who were not chosen to be here but sneaked in.There are several billion people around the world who would chose to come here if they could.

Not to have a competition to get only the best of those people who would immigrate here is insane.

176 posted on 05/06/2012 3:47:00 PM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: kabar

Okay, you have a plan and a good one.

But is anybody working for this?

And how likely is it that a plan like that could be effected when we can’t even keep illegals out now.

I was thinking more of a simple, doable plan.

But I guess high goals are good.

177 posted on 05/06/2012 3:47:10 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: Miss Marple
Well, thank you for posting that extremely long and condescending reply.

Fine if you want to take it that way. I just find people who take this mantle of moral superiority on the issue of immigration to be uninformed and insulting. They are the ones who are truly condescending.

But regardless of whether Michelle Malkin is an expert or not (and you REALLY want to bring up Pat Buchanan?)

Have you read their books on the immigration issue? Pat Buchanan has been particularly prescient going back over many years. Demography is destiny. Immigration is part of the Dems electoral strategy to make they the permanent majority party. They are well on their way. California has the demographics that the US will have in 2050. States like Colorado, Nevada, Arizona, NM, and eventually Texas will turn purple and then blue. I could provide links to various studies by Jim Gimple of the University of Maryland on the issue of the electoral consequences of immigration, but I doubt you would read them.

So basically, your advice is to have a DIALOGUE. Wow. That’s some solution! Let’s all just TALK about it for another 10 years.

Perhaps you didn't see my plan on how to deal with the immigration issue point by point. I addressed it to you and altura. It is far more than DIALOGUE. And it can be implemented immediately if we had someone receptive in the WH.

Adios, amigo! (That there is Spanish, or “Hispanic” talk.)

LOL. Actually groups like La Raza want to be known now as Latino. These ethnic groups have decided to change their name just as we went from Negroes, to blacks, to African-Americans. 53% of Latinos/Hispanics self-describe themselves as white. The Census Bureau set up the category of non-Hispanic whites to capture data. Hence we know have folks like George Zimmerman who the NYT describes as a white Hispanic. We are becoming like South Africa during apartheid. Theyad four main groups with a number of sub-groups and even “honorary whites.”

178 posted on 05/06/2012 3:47:35 PM PDT by kabar
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To: rodguy911

We have 1.2 million LEGAL IMMIGRANTS a year. Even if we were to reduce the number of illegal aliens, legal immigration would still have a major impact on this country. We don’t need that many, especially since 75% of them have a HS degree or less. 25% of the adults are high school dropouts. 50 to 61% of the illegal aliens are HS dropouts.

179 posted on 05/06/2012 3:52:49 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

You are passionate on this issue ... almost to the point of hysteria, and I agree with some of your ideas ... but is anybody in either party working for your goals?

And really long posts filled with charts and stuff are interesting but ... well, okay, I lie.

They are not interesting.

180 posted on 05/06/2012 3:55:37 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: kabar; Miss Marple; altura; Fishtalk

From my perspective, it appears you are all basically on the same track!

I don’t think ANYONE here is in favor of unbridled immigration, and everyone is opposed to ILLEGAL immigration.

The fact is, as was pointed out while 2/3rds of illegals are from Latin America, a significant 3rd is from China and India.

I spend many years overseas representing our country’s military. I encountered people who hated Americans, and me for being there. Still, I tried to be good representative. I learned the local language (as best I could), tried not to dress to obstrusively (many Americans where easy to spot in their baseball caps, blue jeans and white sneakers) and be polite and accepting.

There’s no doubt in my mind that if we all refused to do the above the locals would not be happy. Why should we let Latin Americans do so here? If you’re going to settle in the United States, I believe you have a duty to:

1. Do it legally. No excuse, EVER, for illegal immigration.

2. Learn the language. No one’s asking you to become William F. Buckley, but at least learn some English.

3. Learn the history. The United States of America is UNIQUE in the world! We are not English, French, Spanish, German, Chinese, Italian, Irish, etc, etc. We are Americans, united through our political system of freedom and liberty. Our Constitution DOESN’T care where you come from; we are a nation of immigrants.

181 posted on 05/06/2012 4:04:01 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: altura
I am part of a grassroots organization that lobbies on the Hill and in Richmond on this issue. We have plenty of allies all across the country. NumbersUSA has over a million members who send faxes to Congress, the WH, and state legislators on this issue. We have Congressman like Steve King who is very active on the issue.

This is a doable plan. Arizona and Alabama have robust programs that have borne fruit. All we need to do is to start enforcing our existing laws.

And how likely is it that a plan like that could be effected when we can’t even keep illegals out now.

It is called attrition thru enforcement. It works. All you have to do is make life as miserable as you can for illegal aliens. No jobs, no benefits, and close cooperation between federal and local law enforcement to check immigration status on normal police stops.

Did you know that 11 states filed amicus curiae briefs joining with the USG opposing AZ SB 1070 at the Supreme Court? NEW YORK, CALIFORNIA, CONNECTICUT, HAWAII, ILLINOIS, IOWA, MARYLAND, MASSACHUSETTS, OREGON, RHODE ISLAND, AND VERMONT are on this roll of shame. And what was one of the reasons they sided with the USG? One of the reasons cited by these states to oppose SB 1070 is that the illegal aliens will self-deport from states, which adopt Arizona-type laws, and go into states that offer sanctuary like the 11 mentioned. My only comment is Duh!! Attrition thru enforcement works.

And finally, the Chutzpah award goes to the government of Mexico, which filed a brief opposing SB 1070 that was joined by sixteen other Latin American countries. I guess they like the current system where millions of their citizens invade the United States and send billions of dollars back to their home countries. In the believe or not category, nine state legislators from the Mexican state of Sonora traveled to Tucson to complain about the 2007 Arizona law, upheld by the Supreme Court last year, requiring employers to use E-verify. The problem: Too many Mexicans were returning home placing an unacceptable burden on local social services. They couldn’t handle the demand for housing, jobs, and schools. Again, attrition thru enforcement works. Since when do foreign governments believe that they can interfere in our internal affairs by filing amicus curiae briefs on Supreme Court cases?

What part of my plan don't you think is not doable? Parts of it are already in place and working like Secure Communities and 287 g. SCOTUS upheld the 2007 AZ law mandating E-verify for businesses. This is not pie in the sky stuff. Elinimating birthright citizenship would require the passage of legislation. Bills have already been drafted and have sponsors.

182 posted on 05/06/2012 4:10:02 PM PDT by kabar
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To: altura
... but is anybody in either party working for your goals?

Of course there is. There is an immigration caucus in Congress that is seized with these issues. Steve King, Bilbray, Lamar Simth, Sen Sessions, Sen Vitter, and Sen Demint are engaged and informed. Sens Vitter, Boozman, Rand Paul, Mike Lee have co-sponsored a bill S 723 to eliminate birthright citizenship. There are plenty of other bills. There are hundreds of pieces of legislation at the state level addressing illegal immigration.

Hysterical. No informed and engaged. I know that you prefer to deal with emotion rather than facts. You fit in quite well in that regard with the Left. And whether you are interested in the facts or not, you will be affected by immigration now and in the future. Demography is destiny. Europe is wrestling with similar problems today.

183 posted on 05/06/2012 4:22:17 PM PDT by kabar
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To: Alas Babylon!
In 1917, former U.S. President Theodore Roosevelt said: “We must have but one flag. We must also have but one language. That must be the language of the Declaration of Independence, of Washington's Farewell address, of Lincoln's Gettysburg speech and second inaugural.”

By contrast, in June 2000, U.S. president Bill Clinton said, “I hope very much that I'm the last president in American history who can't speak Spanish.” And in May 2001, President Bush celebrated Mexico's Cinco de Mayo national holiday by inaugurating the practice of broadcasting the weekly presidential radio address to the American people in both English and Spanish.

In September 2003, one of the first debates among the Democratic Party's presidential candidates also took place in both English and Spanish. Despite the opposition of large majorities of Americans, Spanish is joining the language of Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, the Roosevelts, and the Kennedys as the language of the United States. If this trend continues, the cultural division between Hispanics and Anglos could replace the racial division between blacks and whites as the most serious cleavage in U.S. society.

184 posted on 05/06/2012 4:28:04 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

I have asked Humana for a Dutch translater for my 91 year old dad, just to make a point. It IS ridiculous.

185 posted on 05/06/2012 4:36:00 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
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To: Fishtalk
Thank you Fishtalk. ; )
186 posted on 05/06/2012 4:38:01 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
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To: kabar
Here is a happy thought. If Obama gets reelected, the flow will reverse and we will be emigrating sending Pesos back here. /s

According to the LA Times there is a report claiming that border crossing are netting zero.

187 posted on 05/06/2012 4:48:05 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
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To: kabar; Fishtalk

kabar, I am not trying to argue policy. I don’t have all of the information and statistics.

All I was saying is that whatever her expertise, Michelle Malkin’s venom on this issue may play well with parts of the population, but it does encourage anti-Hispanic rhetoric from a chunk of the population. She needs to get consultation on how to present her argument.

Fishtalk, I apologize because I conflated “anti-immigrant” with “anti-Hispanic.” I was intending to talk about the latter. And there is zero doubt that at least in Indianapolis this anti-Hispanic vein has been ramped up. Sorry for confusing the two terms.

Of course we support LEGAL immigration and oppose ILLEGAL immigration. I agree 100% on that. My beef is with how this is presented.

188 posted on 05/06/2012 5:10:54 PM PDT by Miss Marple
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To: Chgogal
I seen those but also talked with BP agents and others who have visited the border. There appears to be a lot of juggling of figures and changing what is reported. And we still do no have operational control over most of the border per GAO reports. Most of us who have been dealing with this issue for years believe the true number of illegal aliens is closer to 20 million.

We do know that legal immigration continues at the same high levels with millions waiting overseas in line to enter.

189 posted on 05/06/2012 5:15:37 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

Okay, I have some advice for you.

One, TMI. Too much information. You flood people with charts and statistics and our eyes glaze.

I agree with you on more points than you would imagine, but you go about it the wrong way. Keep it simple. Decide the most important first step in achieving your goal and figure out a way to accomplish it.

Don’t lay out dozens of goals. Start somewhere.

Don’t insult people who question you or disagree with you.

You’ve insulted me twice now. For some strange reason that does not sit well with people or win supporters.

Mexicans are poor and a drain on our welfare system but not because they don’t work. Most Mexican families have at least one worker, sometimes two. But they work at menial jobs which leave them with low enough incomes to get benefits, which under your plan they wouldn’t get, but like social security, this has to be phased out slowly.

The largest segment of society, the segment with the highest unemployment and which seems okay with that is the population we imported a couple of hundred years ago.

Not much we can do about that now, is there?

I do not prefer to deal with emotion. I am mean as a snake but I do prefer to deal with reality and what’s possible and what’s not.

I hope the Senators you mentioned are successful and I hope they are more tactful in presenting their ideas than you are.

Just a little help, if you want it.

190 posted on 05/06/2012 7:28:27 PM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: altura
Listen, I tried to educate you on a subject I know much more about than you do. Some advice for you. Read and comprehend what I send you and answer the questions I pose to you.

It is TMI because you really don't want to know something that conflicts with your feelings or emotion on the subject. And I suggest you review your posts to me again to see who is insulting whom. You would rather wallow in your ignorance rather than learn something.

I would save my sympathy for the American people who are hurt the most by illegal immigration.

The largest segment of society, the segment with the highest unemployment and which seems okay with that is the population we imported a couple of hundred years ago.

What utter nonsense. Except for their so-called leaders, blacks are the most upset about immigration, legal and illegal. They are the ones losing jobs. My organization commissioned a poll that demonstrated that conclusively. In fact, blacks are more upset and opposed to illegal immigration than whites. And I know from personal interviews we conducted with blacks in DC in an effort to support a black mayoral candidate that they are losing jobs and suffering depressed wages due to the influx of illegals into the workforce. They are not OK with that.

When you make such remarks, you expose your inability to reason and make logical conclusions. No substance, just your feelings on an issue. You really have no concept of objective reality with the remarks you have made. Where in Texas do you live?

191 posted on 05/06/2012 9:36:31 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

Are you kidding me. After that dismissive crap you just posted you want to know where I live?


About comprehension and reading skills ... I gave you some good advice which you just crumpled up into a little blob and ignored.

And Miss Marple was right. You are condescending. It’s not attractive.

192 posted on 05/07/2012 6:26:55 AM PDT by altura (Looking for sanity in all the wrong places.)
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To: rodguy911


193 posted on 05/07/2012 6:53:47 AM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!!)
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TEA Party On!

Donate here!

We have some elections to win!

194 posted on 05/07/2012 7:43:53 AM PDT by RedMDer (
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To: altura
LOL. Good advice? You seem to have a very inflated opinion of yourself. You are the only one who seems to think that I provide too much information.

I deal in the real world where I have to go head to head with the other side that lies about the facts and puts all kinds of obstacles in our way to prevent us from learning the true costs of immigration, legal and illegal. The FACTS are the only way we can educate the American people on the real costs to them and the Republic. The other side uses emotion and plays upon the romanticized version of immigration to fool and deceive. You are a prime example of how effective they have been.

Condescension? I am trying to educate you. You resent it because you are much more comfortable in your fantasy world.

I asked where in Texas you were from to figure out exactly how you have developed such notions about immigration. We work with the True the Vote folks out of Harris County. Immigration and voter fraud are very much connected. And the Bureau of the Census counts all people (including illegal immigrants and the 15 million Green Card holders who are not citizens), which influences the allocation of Congressional Districts among the states and where federal monies go. The 2010 Census changed the electoral map for 2012 shifting Congressional seats from one state to another. Immigration affects those changes.

195 posted on 05/07/2012 8:44:43 AM PDT by kabar
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To: rodguy911

I don’t dislike Rubio. But he does not have the credentials, experience, or leadership skills of Palin.

He’s being groomed by the GOP. Therefore, if the media starts attacking Rubio the GOP will attack back. That’s my only point.

Palin did not get the same benefit. And still doesn’t. Sarah Palin self identifies as a freedom loving American who will fight for whats right, true, and good. And she will fight for every man and every woman who does not have access to the power structures in government. Find me another politician who does that. They are few and far between. In my perfect world this election would be Sarah Palin and Paul Ryan against Obama and Biden.

But I’ll vote for Romney. Because it’s not a perfect world and I don’t have a choice.

196 posted on 05/07/2012 9:21:39 AM PDT by carmody
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To: Miss Marple; rodguy911; Fishtalk
Miss Marple. Since you are from Indiana, I thought you might be interested in this report. No rhetoric, just facts.

Fraudulent Illegal Alien tax returns

197 posted on 05/07/2012 10:18:01 AM PDT by kabar
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To: carmody

I totally agree with you on Palin. She is the best of the best.Sad she won’t be the candidate. She will however get loads of pubbies elected all over the country like she did before.I am truly a proud Palinista.

198 posted on 05/07/2012 10:36:14 AM PDT by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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