Posted on 05/03/2012 12:51:07 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
The Greenies are gonna get delirious with anger at Obama....for letting this happen.
Now we just need a process to convert methane to butanol
With gas from methane hydrates added to shale and natural gas, ....thousand years ...supply?
I’m gonna guess that this will require a new pipeline (and hence the wedge for the greenies)?
The environmentalists have a hatred of man call into question the value of economic progress in the first place.
Better yet, diesel and kerosene.
Proven technology, at least two large (commercial) sized facilities. It is only a matter of economics and regulations, not a theoretical technology.
Shell: world’s biggest gas-to-liquids plant to start soon
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2731066/posts
Jun 7, 2011
That plant is now up and running and shipping tankers to Europe.
http://www.shell.com/home/content/aboutshell/our_strategy/major_projects_2/pearl/
That needs some explanation....if you could,
Haha like this will fly! The Enviros will find something that lives around there and then say how it will go extinct if we try to mine around there. Just like they said that caribou would die in ANWR because they didn’t think the caribou could walk over a couple feet of dirt mounds to cross over the pipes.
U.S. Geological Survey
Marine and Coastal Geology Program
Gas (Methane) Hydrates — A New Frontier
Methane trapped in marine sediments as a hydrate represents such an immense carbon reservoir that it must be considered a dominant factor in estimating unconventional energy resources; the role of methane as a ‘greenhouse’ gas also must be carefully assessed.
Dr. William Dillon,
U.S. Geological Survey
Hydrates store immense amounts of methane, with major implications for energy resources and climate, but the natural controls on hydrates and their impacts on the environment are very poorly understood.
Gas hydrates occur abundantly in nature, both in Arctic regions and in marine sediments. Gas hydrate is a crystalline solid consisting of gas molecules, usually methane, each surrounded by a cage of water molecules. It looks very much like water ice. Methane hydrate is stable in ocean floor sediments at water depths greater than 300 meters, and where it occurs, it is known to cement loose sediments in a surface layer several hundred meters thick.
The worldwide amounts of carbon bound in gas hydrates is conservatively estimated to total twice the amount of carbon to be found in all known fossil fuels on Earth.
...
http://marine.usgs.gov/fact-sheets/gas-hydrates/title.html
Is there a simple explanation as to why the plant was so expensive?
It’s technologically feasible to convert Methane into any hydrocarbon. My off the cuff vote would be for 2,2,4 Trimethylpentane, otherwise known as isooctane. Why bother with alcohols? the Oxygen atom decreases their energy storage capacity, and all alcohols are hydrophilic.
Japan may be where it goes into production...see the text.
I have long written that we are almost literally AWASH in hydrocarbons that can be converted into suitable liquid fuels. The ONLY issue was that of total cost.
We do not burn crude oil in our vehicles and aircraft. We burn a technical product that is made, or more properly, constructed, by taking a feedstock of molecules and atoms that are taken apart and reassembled to make the fuel we want. The ONLY issue is the cost of the fuel, for the instant that a new feedstock comes along that is less expensive than the existing one, it will be used.
People who claim “peak oil” are ignorant of economics just as much as the useful idiots who claim there is a shortage of water.
Think I’ll bookmark your two last posts regarding natural gas extraction.
Forget the electic/whatever hybrid car.
Bring back the CNG car/truck technology developed decades ago.
Propane is good too.
Watts wrong with butanol?
Because it is big and complex?
There is a lot to the facility. There are multi-stages to the process. The construction site used 40,000 people and was the size of Central Park. It is one of the world's largest "single" facility.
But given the price of Natural Gas in Qatar, it makes economic sense to spend this much and essentially export very high grade crude (gasoil) versus spending less but still significant capital to export lower value LNG.
Pearl will process about 3 billion barrels-of-oil-equivalent over its lifetime. The return on investment will work. I don't think we will see the lasting return of $20 oil that would make it uneconomic.
I should have added. Most likely the mid-east countries such as Saudi Arabia must be wondering how long their fortunes can hold out. OPEC may find itself on the back door looking in.
Yeah, I saw that... but still... all of this is happening on the North Slope, right? It sounded to me that the Japanese were interested in getting this into production quickly on our soil - and thus would need a delivery means to get the product from there to a port for their boats. I may be misreading it, but that was my interpretation.
I really don’t give a damn what happens to them. Let them eat “F”ing sand.
While significantly better than ethanol (except in octane rating) I don't see it as good as diesel. Shell's Pearl GTL plant also produces Naphtha with is part of the feedstock to gasoline.
I haven't seen anyone successfully make the economics work for Butanol. Shell's process in now in commercial use at their second facility. I expect we will soon see more of them.
OK,...thanks.
Little bammy will be ordering “Global Methane Hydrates Safety Oversight and Management Committees” within the week.
He will appoint the current Chairperson of the U.S. Government Department of Diversity and Inclusion to manage it due to their strong qualifications in the fields of Community Organizing and memberships in GLBT Office of Affairs, Aztlan, Raza, MEChA and The Communist Party USA.
.
See the map,...Japan has hydrates along it's coast according to the map.
Could this be used on the methane from cow f*rts? haha
Oh great - Japan, China, India, Pakistan could all have claims in those areas. What could go wrong?
Well they sure have enough silica handy to keep their hunger pangs down to a minimum.
I’ve read that there are an estimated 1,000 years supply, based on current demand, of methyl hydrates.
Sounds like the biggest issue is finding a large supply of carbon dioxide. Maybe they should scrap up all the tundra and burn it?
I love diesels.I'm driving my second one now and will *never* again drive anything else.Thanks to its outstanding fuel economy I firmly believe that diesel can be a big part of the short term solution,maybe even medium term.But if the reports I've read about *our* supply of natural gas are true I think that *it* is the answer...long term.
As you may,or may not,know about half of the passenger cars on the road in Europe today are diesels.In fact I've heard it suggested that Europe and the US have it exactly wrong,given their particular transportation needs...Europe should be driving gasoline cars and we should be driving diesels.Go figure!
Time to Chu this and lock it down.
So then......Large domes placed on the floor of the Gulf of Mexico with pipes to the shore, to a methane to Natural Gas facility and viola!!!!!!!!!!!!
It’s simple Jim.........
The amount of methane gassing away at the bottom of the Gulf is enormous.
*
pretty incredible,, all that energy just lying around, waiting to be exploited, maybe they’ll find dilithium crystals too if they keep looking.. but then the sierra club and nrdc and epa will sue ‘em to block development. ;-)
I keep 12 months of usage in reserve.
It’s hopeful. It could bring about change. Therefore, it will cause global warming, and must be stopped./s
Mine it - use it up, else if the Earth warms enough all that hydrate will convert to gas turning the Earth back into a methane atmosphered planet. Oxyen will then become the new currency ... until the fresh water and food are used up.
Place weighted balloons up their a@#es. When they fart, the balloons fill up. When they defficate, the balloons are pushed out, but retain their content because the weights keep the methane inside. All the farmer has to do is collect the balloons, insert new ones, and wait for a pickup service for the full balloons. Global warming, stopped in its tracks. Farmers making money off of cow farts. Balloons put to good use. What’s not to like about this?
Just try to imagine what we could have done if we took all the money we spent on the “green energy” rathole and put it into LNG infrastructure. Grrr.
If nothing else, it is an alcohol, and is hydrophilic.
If nothing else, it is an alcohol, and is hydrophilic.
Apparently IsoOctane rocks.
Hate comes from envy which comes from vanity. The envi-mentalists want at least half of humanity to die off, thereby reducing their painful feelings of envy in half, or so their thinking goes. What doesn't make logical sense is why don't they want the mankind-killing climate apocalypse they tell us is coming? If all they believe is true, they get their wish. They should be rooting for it.
Message to envi-mentalists from the Joneses next door: "Try to keep up!"
I thought all you had to do was warm it up and it would de-crystallize into water vapor and methane. Something about weak covalent bonds holding it together...
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