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Gun that killed Florida teen was fired once not twice by crime watch volunteer
bostonherald.com ^ | 20 March, 2012 | Rene Stutzman and Bianca Prieto

Posted on 03/20/2012 7:08:27 PM PDT by marktwain

Edited on 03/20/2012 7:21:16 PM PDT by Sidebar Moderator. [history]

SANFORD, Fla. — The handgun that killed Trayvon Martin, an unarmed black 17-year-old, was fired once — not twice — by a neighborhood crime watch volunteer, according to new information obtained by the Orlando Sentinel.

Police found a single shell casing at the scene, and when they seized George Zimmerman’s handgun, a Kel Tel 9 mm, its magazine was full, according to a source close to the investigation. The only bullet missing was the one in the chamber, the source said.


(Excerpt) Read more at news.bostonherald.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: banglist; fl; florida; georgezimmerman; martin; trayvonmartin; zimmerman
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Very interesting. I do not see any reason presented for the police to create a conspiracy to protect Zimmerman.
1 posted on 03/20/2012 7:08:36 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain
The above is an excerpt. I did not initially see the additonal pages.
2 posted on 03/20/2012 7:10:38 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

How much do you have to shoot a kid in Florida before you run afoul of the law?


3 posted on 03/20/2012 7:12:35 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (No wonder this administration favors abortion; everything they have done is an abortion)
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To: marktwain
"That contradicts the graphic interpretation that lawyers..."

You really can't take lawyers very seriously these days.

4 posted on 03/20/2012 7:13:04 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (The first lesson you learn as a pollster is that people are stupid. - Dem pollster, Tom Jensen)
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To: marktwain

I’ve been watching this and I’m thinking this may have been a “good” shoot at least from the legal standpoint. On the 911 tape you can hear yells and a single shot.

Sounds to me like the kid was warned and kept coming.


5 posted on 03/20/2012 7:13:43 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: marktwain

Bad reporting.

How could the magazine be full? If the trigger was pulled and the round fired, the slide would have cycled another round into the chamber. Thus, the magazine would have one less round and the chamber would be loaded again.

Leftist reporters have no brains.


6 posted on 03/20/2012 7:14:30 PM PDT by OldMissileer (Atlas, Titan, Minuteman, PK. Winners of the Cold War)
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To: marktwain

Sounds like Zimmerman was trigger happy and I denounce that. Now will these same people trying to inflame public reaction also publicly denounce the black boys who pour gasoline on Allen Goin and set him on fire? Oh, that’s right. It was black on white crime and that is so common that it doesn’t even generate a second look.

The zimmerman case is unique because white on black crime is rare.


7 posted on 03/20/2012 7:15:51 PM PDT by Josa
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To: muir_redwoods
That depends on whether it is east of I-95 or west of I-95.

-PJ

8 posted on 03/20/2012 7:17:45 PM PDT by Political Junkie Too (If you can vote for President, then your children can run for President.)
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To: OldMissileer
Bad reporting. How could the magazine be full? If the trigger was pulled and the round fired, the slide would have cycled another round into the chamber. Thus, the magazine would have one less round and the chamber would be loaded again. Leftist reporters have no brains.

Yes, I saw that too. But they say they only found one casing at the scene.

A pretty nasty situation all the way around.

We are getting lots of speculation and info from the Martin side, almost no reporting on info from the Zimmerman side.

This could either be the police not willing to release Zimmerman's statements as they do an investigation, or the MSM simply not willing to give out Zimmerman's side, or there just being way more resources being focused to come up with alternate scenarios than what Zimmerman said.

I see almost no reporting of what Zimmerman said happened.

9 posted on 03/20/2012 7:20:51 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: OldMissileer

My question too. Cannot be right as described. Reports of the guy having a broken nose and scalp cuts requiring stitches indicate a righteous shoot but I’m not yet convinced.

The involvement of the civil rights community makes a fair trial pretty darn hard. How come they get unfettered access to the press while the defendant (to be) gets no such accomodation? Strikes me as racist. Tawana Brawley (sp?) anyone...


10 posted on 03/20/2012 7:21:07 PM PDT by ProfoundMan (Time to finish the Reagan Revolution! - RightyPics.com)
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To: marktwain

WTF is a Kel Tel 9 mm a typo or sloppy reporting ?


11 posted on 03/20/2012 7:21:58 PM PDT by al baby (Hi Mom)
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To: marktwain

Stirring up the mob.
Inciting race hatred.
Get the outrage flowing.

They don’t really need the practice, but they want to make sure they’ve got all the moves down as we get closer to November.


12 posted on 03/20/2012 7:22:43 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy ("And the public gets what the public wants" -- The Jam)
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To: marktwain

I thought I heard today on the radio that the Justice Department was getting involved in the investigation. No surprise there.


13 posted on 03/20/2012 7:23:20 PM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: Josa

he’s not white. he’s hispanic.


14 posted on 03/20/2012 7:23:20 PM PDT by Hiro Protaginast
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To: al baby

That must be one of those “As-Seen-On-TV” guns (K-Tel).


15 posted on 03/20/2012 7:24:48 PM PDT by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: cripplecreek

on his (Zimmerman’s) call to the dispatcher he said he was ‘following’ the kid and the dispatcher told him NOT to. He did it anyhow. He was the threatening one by skulking after the kid.

Zimmerman is a wannabe stud hero. He needs to prosecuted to the full extent of the law.


16 posted on 03/20/2012 7:26:17 PM PDT by Dudoight
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To: Moonman62

Funny that was my first thought my second was how do i get that song one tin solider rides again song out of my head


17 posted on 03/20/2012 7:26:34 PM PDT by al baby (Hi Mom)
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To: muir_redwoods
How much do you have to shoot a kid in Florida before you run afoul of the law?

You would have to shoot him after he is no longer a threat to you.

The media is assuming that because Trayvon Martin was 17 and had no obvious weapon, that he could not have been a threat.

That Zimmerman was bleeding from the face and the back of the head shows that Trayvon was a threat.

What is being debated is who started the physical altercation?

Both Martin and Zimmerman had a legal right to be where the altercation took place.

18 posted on 03/20/2012 7:26:52 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: OldMissileer
If the trigger was pulled and the round fired, the slide would have cycled another round into the chamber.

That would be with a Kel Tec semi-auto. However, per the article, the handgun was "a Kel Tel 9 mm." Such a rare breed may be a lever action, for all I know :-)

In this case, however, the shooter had to make his weapon safe after the incident. This calls for unloading. This results in one extra round that is ejected. Where are you likely to put it if the round and the magazine are both on the ground in front of you?

19 posted on 03/20/2012 7:27:57 PM PDT by Greysard
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To: marktwain
I see almost no reporting of what Zimmerman said happened.

I have little doubt Zimmerman has a lawyer who - - correctly - - told Zimmerman to keep his mouth shut. The teen's family lawyer is angling for a jackpot, and for the Zimmerman side to offer any statements or information at all at this point would be stupid.

20 posted on 03/20/2012 7:30:45 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: marktwain

Tonight on the local news after this story was mentioned they release a video of black man in a hotel. It is in a nearby Florida city. The released video was to help catch the black man who kidnapped and rapped a white women. He beat her so badly (for several hours) that they don’t know if she will live. It was stated that she will have years of reconstructive surgery if she survives. Where is the moral outrage of the race pimps?

As far as this story goes more will come out and it won’t be so clear. I heard that the hooded black boy attacked the Hispanic man before the shot was fired. There is physical evidence that it was self defense. I don’t know what is true and we may never know since the story changes every minute.


21 posted on 03/20/2012 7:31:00 PM PDT by BushCountry (I hope the Mayans are wrong!)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; ColdOne; Convert from ECUSA; ...

Thanks marktwain.
Police found a single shell casing at the scene, and... [suspect] George Zimmerman's... Kel Tel 9 mm... only bullet missing was the one in the chamber
To be an editing busybody, the only bullet missing was the one no longer in the chamber.


22 posted on 03/20/2012 7:31:31 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (I come to bury Caesar, not to praise him)
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To: Josa

I had heard that Zimmerman was hispanic


23 posted on 03/20/2012 7:32:11 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: marktwain
In Texas anyway, as I understand it, unless he witnessed the kid committing a felony, and IMH, beating a young or elderly person to death, he had no reason to exit his vehicle in the first place.
24 posted on 03/20/2012 7:32:35 PM PDT by Envisioning ( Call me a racist................, one more time......................)
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To: Josa
Zimmerman looks to be Hispanic. He also has quite visible earrings, so he may well not be straight.

Martin looks like a clean-cut kid. No tattoos, no earrings, no nose plugs, carrying just a bag of Skittles and some iced tea ~ maybe even Rush' favorite ~ Snapple?

This is adult Hispanic thug on young black teenager crime.

If you want to call it white on black crime you need to find a social counselor to set you straight on the current categorizations.

25 posted on 03/20/2012 7:32:47 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: marktwain
I'm sure his attorney has insisted on radio silence from Zimmerman. So far, all we have is static from the victim's attorney and the inevitable race pimps, gathering like flies to a corpse.

We shall see, give it time for information to develop.

26 posted on 03/20/2012 7:33:27 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: BushCountry
The released video was to help catch the black man who kidnapped and rapped a white women.


27 posted on 03/20/2012 7:34:07 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: Dudoight; All
“on his (Zimmerman’s) call to the dispatcher he said he was ‘following’ the kid and the dispatcher told him NOT to. He did it anyhow. He was the threatening one by skulking after the kid.”

Here is what the dispatcher said:

Dispatcher: Are you following him?

Zimmerman: Yeah

Dispatcher: Ok, we don't need you to do that.

That is a *long* way from the dispatcher telling him not to do it. Zimmerman had as much right to be in that public space as Martin did.

28 posted on 03/20/2012 7:35:00 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: BushCountry
Here's the way it went down ~ no story change in any of it. Hispanic adult armed with a pistol sees black teenager returning from 7-11.

Hispanic follows black teenager.

Hispanic shoots black teenager.

The crime started when the Hispanic fellow began following the teenager who was quite obviously peaceably going about his business returning home with the Skittles and iced tea he had purchased.

29 posted on 03/20/2012 7:36:04 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Envisioning
bah......IMH=IMHO
30 posted on 03/20/2012 7:36:27 PM PDT by Envisioning ( Call me a racist................, one more time......................)
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To: marktwain; All
If a semi-auto pistol has a full magazine inserted and one in the chamber, when it is fired even once it will no longer have a full magazine. Every time.

The article cannot be accurate.

31 posted on 03/20/2012 7:38:15 PM PDT by Mariner (War Criminal #18)
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To: marktwain

But the media feeding frenzy over this particular story – one out of the thousands of homicides in this country – in apparent response to a left-wing campaign to keep it in the national news, reflects at best a loss of perspective and at worst a cynical effort to inflame racial division in an election year.

Politico, in a story on pressure by the Congressional Black Caucus on the case, notes the scale of the campaign to nationalize the story:

http://www.redstate.com/dan_mclaughlin/2012/03/20/trayvon-martin-and-perspective/


32 posted on 03/20/2012 7:38:36 PM PDT by kcvl
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To: OldMissileer

I caught that too.


33 posted on 03/20/2012 7:38:36 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the sociopath.)
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To: marktwain

That’s physically impossible. You cannot fire a round from a semi-automatic pistol and still have a full magazine.


34 posted on 03/20/2012 7:41:48 PM PDT by Melas (u)
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To: OldMissileer

Isn’t it possible to chamber one round then insert a full magazine? Does this particular 9mm have a hair trigger? Could have been an accident but it sounds like he was in ‘hunter’s mode’.


35 posted on 03/20/2012 7:41:51 PM PDT by FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs
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To: muawiyah

Crump said “she hears another voice, ‘What are you doing around here?’ Trayvon says, ‘Why are you following me?’ “ At that point, according to the girl, Travyon is pushed and his voice changes (we really don’t know if the boy was pushed. How could she tell over the phone?)

“She hears an ALTERCATION, suddenly, someone just hit the phone, because that’s the last she hears,” Crump said. She did not hear the shooting. There was a fight before the shot and we don’t know who attacked first. Also, the boy was wearing a hood and racing from the store (the Hispanic man did not know why?)


36 posted on 03/20/2012 7:43:11 PM PDT by BushCountry (I hope the Mayans are wrong!)
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To: BushCountry
Where is the moral outrage of the race pimps?

*SIGH* You're really not getting this are you? I'm here to help:

The overwhelmingly vast multitudes of white people who are hurt or killed by the small minority of black people are not important. Their lives don't count for as much.

The overwhelmingly tiny minority of black people who are somehow hurt/killed by white people - those are the special people. Their lives are important. They have black skin.

Is this starting to make sense now?

You're welcome.

37 posted on 03/20/2012 7:45:15 PM PDT by AAABEST (Et lux in tenebris lucet: et tenebrae eam non comprehenderunt)
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To: Hiro Protaginast
he’s not white. he’s hispanic.

He was the shooter, so he's white. Had he been shot, he would be hispanic.

That sounds tongue-in-cheek, but it's not.

38 posted on 03/20/2012 7:46:10 PM PDT by Ken H (Austerity is the irresistible force. Entitlements are the immovable object.)
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To: FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs
Isn’t it possible to chamber one round then insert a full magazine? Does this particular 9mm have a hair trigger? Could have been an accident but it sounds like he was in ‘hunter’s mode’

Yep, that's how many carry. However, when you fire the round in the chamber, the slide is always going to pull one out of the magazine to replace it. The only way to fire a semi-automatic pistol and have a full magazine is to chamber a round, and hold the magazine in your opposite hand as you fire.

39 posted on 03/20/2012 7:46:40 PM PDT by Melas (u)
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To: marktwain

Writing only about the gun:

Kel Tek makes at least 3 models of 9mm semi-auto.

It’s perfectly plausible to have fired 1 round and have “a full magazine” if one was still in the chamber and that counted.

Load magazine, chamber round, remove magazine, add 1 round, reinsert magazine.

This means it is nearly impossible he shot 2X.


40 posted on 03/20/2012 7:47:43 PM PDT by IYAAYAS (Live free or die trying)
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To: marktwain

Eric Holder’s involvement in a Hispanic shooting someone ,suggests that gun may be part of the Fast And Furious cache.


41 posted on 03/20/2012 7:47:43 PM PDT by NoLibZone (Obama proved in Texas- that health care ,like all fed programs, is a political compliance weapon.)
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To: BushCountry

Zimmerman’s call to 911 made clear he was watching Trayvon for a while before the shooting.

“Hey, we’ve had some break-ins in my neighborhood and there’s a real suspicious guy.... This guy looks like he’s up to no good or he’s on drugs or something,” Zimmerman told the 911 operator.

“He’s just staring ... looking at all the houses,” Zimmerman said in between answering questions from the operator about his location and the appearance of the person he was watching. “Now he’s coming toward me ... something’s wrong with him. Yep, he’s coming to check me out. He’s got something in his hands. I don’t know what his deal is.”


42 posted on 03/20/2012 7:48:13 PM PDT by BushCountry (I hope the Mayans are wrong!)
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To: Melas

If the slide didn’t cycle back far enough, maybe it didn’t chamber another round.


43 posted on 03/20/2012 7:51:16 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: BushCountry
There is physical evidence that it was self defense.

I don't see the self-defense argument holding water when he was pursuing this kid around the neighborhood. That's not 'standing your ground'. My guess is that when Zimmerman followed Trayvon, then got out of the car, he decided to try and grab him to detain him. That's when the kid hit him, and Zimmerman shot the kid.

Zimmerman initiated the confrontation, and this wannabe cop killed a kid. He should have listened to the dispatcher.

44 posted on 03/20/2012 7:51:39 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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To: marktwain
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1377840/James-Cooper-James-Kouzaris-gunned-Florida-holiday-lifetime.html

Did Eric Holder ever investigate the murder of these 2 WHITE British men by Shawn Tyson, a BLACK 16 year old released from prison only 10 hours earlier?

How come it's never 'RACISM' when it's BLACK ON WHITE?   WASSUP WIT DAT?

45 posted on 03/20/2012 7:52:22 PM PDT by FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs
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Comment #46 Removed by Moderator

To: FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs

It was a Kel-Tec so the slide may have over ran the top one in the magazine without moving it. I have no personal experience but have heard they were not reliable.

One thing which does bother me a bit was the neighborhood watch had phoned 911. That leads me to think the kid was doing something to merit that much concern.


47 posted on 03/20/2012 7:53:53 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: FedsRStealingOurCountryFromUs
Isn’t it possible to chamber one round then insert a full magazine? Does this particular 9mm have a hair trigger? Could have been an accident but it sounds like he was in ‘hunter’s mode’.

It is possible, even a common practice, to chamber a round, then insert another round into the magazine to have the pistol loaded to full capacity.

When the first round would be fired, the pistol, if operating properly, would still take another round from the magazine and place it in the chamber, thus leaving the magazine with one round less than full capacity.

As this story was from an unnamed source, I think it likely that the reporter or the source simply garbled it a bit.

The useful evidence seems to be that they only found one casing at the scene. Even that does not mean much.

Legally, you are justified in continuing to shoot until you are no longer under a deadly threat.

48 posted on 03/20/2012 7:54:29 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: Envisioning

He had as much of a right to be on the street as the kid. I guess the Kid had a problem with him and tried to beat the crap out of him. The only problem is that he was armed.


49 posted on 03/20/2012 7:56:01 PM PDT by BOBWADE (RINOs suck)
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To: GeronL
I had heard that Zimmerman was hispanic

White is a race, Hispanic is an ethnicity in the white race. At least according to the U.S. Census.

50 posted on 03/20/2012 7:57:22 PM PDT by Gunslingr3
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