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Legalize cannabis? Not so fast, say medics
Bermuda Sun ^ | June 22, 2011 | Raymond Hainey

Posted on 06/22/2011 11:34:42 PM PDT by AustralianConservative

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To: ansel12

So what? The government takes more than it should in taxes. You call me a liberal and you complain that there aren’t enough taxes?


151 posted on 06/23/2011 1:54:39 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: ansel12

Same argument was made against repeal of prohibition.

“There will be no tax windfall like the booze crowd tries to tell the naive, and the cost of social programs needed to deal with the further decay of the American people, will grow and law enforcement will have more to do, not less, because the drinking culture will grow.”

Wrong then and now.


152 posted on 06/23/2011 1:56:34 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: ansel12
The left always gets what they want, just this once why don't you libertarians eliminate the government subsidy FIRST, before we give another body blow to our culture and social structure? Just this once, end welfare before we pass out the dope and decay, or the gay marriage, or porn or whatever.

Fallacious logic!

"Perfect World" fallacy!

Yes, let's first cure cancer, get rid of nuclear arms, and achieve world peace before allowing individuals to make personal lifestyle choices (and suffer the consequences).

I, too, am an adamant critic of welfare, of the nanny state, of gun-restriction laws, etc. I am a dyed-in-the-wool Conservative. And that's why I abhor the nanny state interfering in our personal lives.

RE-legalize it!

Regards,

153 posted on 06/23/2011 1:57:16 AM PDT by alexander_busek
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To: Crim
No, simply “dope is liberal”

Prohibition and drug laws are two different things.

154 posted on 06/23/2011 1:57:47 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: freepersup

Greetings freepersup:

Water is essential to life, yet without proper treatment, most water is unsafe for human consumption. So alcohol, unlike marijuana, is responsible for the advancement and survival of western civilization.

Until the 19th century, before bacteria was determined as a cause of diseases, water was unsafe to drink. So alcohol containing beverages, mostly in the form of beer, would render water safe for human consumption. BTW, through natural selection, no humans are allergic to beer.

Cheers,
OLA


155 posted on 06/23/2011 2:00:44 AM PDT by OneLoyalAmerican (In God I trust, all others provide citations.)
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To: Puckster

“in what world does your imagination swim in thinking that when marijuana is legalized that the statistics won’t eventually catch up or surpass?”

In what world does your imagination swim where you dont realise that anyone who wants to do drugs...already is.

There...a direct answer.


156 posted on 06/23/2011 2:00:56 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: alexander_busek
No the logic is sound, the left has torn our culture apart in a short 50 years, and you want to accelerate their goals and settle for only their goals, because we never see the second half of your offer, ever.
157 posted on 06/23/2011 2:01:40 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: alexander_busek
I, too, am an adamant critic of welfare, of the nanny state, of gun-restriction laws, etc. I am a dyed-in-the-wool Conservative. And that's why I abhor the nanny state interfering in our personal lives.

Hear hear! I also abhor the violation of the Constitution by the Federal gov and the unending cascade of unintended consequences that brings. That does far more harm than all drug use ever could.

158 posted on 06/23/2011 2:04:17 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: Crim

That was childish and ridiculous.


159 posted on 06/23/2011 2:04:30 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: AustralianConservative
“No evidence is ever good enough for potheads: from brain scan imaging to potheads defecating in parks.”

You are posting to a 56 year old who brags of “40 years experience smoking pot.”

160 posted on 06/23/2011 2:05:35 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: ansel12
Prohibition and drug laws are two different things.

How so? Alcohol is a drug and it required a Constitutional amendment to prohibit it. Why isn't that required to prohibit other drugs. If you can't give a legal Constitutional answer then don't bother.

161 posted on 06/23/2011 2:06:10 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: TigersEye
Don't waste my time like that, the doper argument is huge windfall taxes, they are lying.
162 posted on 06/23/2011 2:06:41 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: ansel12

“Prohibition and drug laws are two different things.”

LMAO...only in your mind...

I love how conservatives who scream for the feds to stay out of their health care....

Turn around scream for the feds to stick their nose into everyones blood stream and urine.....

We now return you to the war on plants...


163 posted on 06/23/2011 2:08:32 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Berlin_Freeper
You're a liar who has been called on that BS already. I am not bragging I am answering anecdotes with my own anecdotes.

Now answer the question I asked you before or are you incapable of confronting the legal issues?

164 posted on 06/23/2011 2:09:28 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: Crim

So your saying there will be no increase in usage if it is legalized?

Really.


165 posted on 06/23/2011 2:10:08 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: ansel12

Don’t waste my time with your straw man of what the “doper argument” is. It’s a non-sequitur.


166 posted on 06/23/2011 2:10:43 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: ansel12

“That was childish and ridiculous.”

Why...because I used your own words to illustrate that your position is a illogical?


167 posted on 06/23/2011 2:11:10 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Puckster

Why would there be? Pot is available everywhere to anyone who wants it now.


168 posted on 06/23/2011 2:12:33 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: TigersEye
I'm going to bed in a few, so I don't have time to explain the thousands of years of Western Civilization being alcohol based, and all the reasons that trying to eliminate alcohol from western man and his culture, and his cities, was different from trying to deal with the sudden appearance of drug abuse, in our youth population as multiculturalism was growing.
169 posted on 06/23/2011 2:12:37 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: OneLoyalAmerican
BTW, through natural selection, no humans are allergic to beer.

So, for how many generations has natural selection been acting upon the beer-allergies of American Indians?

Sorry, forgot: "They ain't human."

Regards,

170 posted on 06/23/2011 2:13:43 AM PDT by alexander_busek
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To: OneLoyalAmerican
BTW, through natural selection, no humans are allergic to beer.

Sounds nice, but I'm afraid it's false. First, there is alcohol intolerance, which is nasty if not actually harmful. Skin flushes, mucous membranes go into overdrive, which causes itching, flushing, runny nose, leaky rear, and even more graphic and off-putting symptoms.

Since I know that you'll point out that isn't a histamine reaction, aka a true allergy, it should be noted that allergies to yeast are not uncommon, and yes Virginia the yeast in beer will cause a reaction. As will the much rarer allergies to graminea (barley), and humulus, hops.

171 posted on 06/23/2011 2:14:20 AM PDT by Melas (Sent via Galaxy Tab)
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To: ansel12

Marijuana use has been a part of human culture for thousands of years longer than alcohol. It was a part of American culture from the time the first ships arrived from Europe. In Colonial times it was a legal requirement to plant so many acres of hemp and the seed was provided by the government because of its vital importance.


172 posted on 06/23/2011 2:15:47 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: TigersEye
You specifically posted of your 40 years experience.

That is bragging.

173 posted on 06/23/2011 2:16:06 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Puckster
“So your saying there will be no increase in usage if it is legalized?

Really.”

I'm saying quite clearly that anyone who wants to use drugs...already is using drugs...The law doesnt stop anything...it only facilitates the black market.

The idea that masses of people are going to rush out and start using drugs is a strawman argument.

The same argument was used against the repeal of prohibition of booze...and it was proven to be wrong...

Alcohol use actually dropped after repeal.

174 posted on 06/23/2011 2:17:00 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Crim

No, because it was so illogical, think about it some more.


175 posted on 06/23/2011 2:17:31 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: Berlin_Freeper

No, it was an anecdote to counter the point that had been made to me. Your emotional problems that color your perceptions are not my problem but I won’t allow you to use that as an excuse to lie about me.


176 posted on 06/23/2011 2:18:07 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: TigersEye
Well, even though you just committed to your statement.....wow, very naive.

There are many people I've known over the years that the only reason they don't use it is because it's illegal.

Their family and jobs come first and they wouldn't jeopardize both by testing positive for a drug test.

I can stand by my original post then.

177 posted on 06/23/2011 2:18:22 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: Puckster
There are many people I've known over the years that the only reason they don't use it is because it's illegal.

Yeah, right. ROTFL

178 posted on 06/23/2011 2:19:48 AM PDT by TigersEye (Who crashed the markets on 9/15/08 and why?)
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To: TigersEye
Man, what a waste of time, you trying to confuse hemp, and pot as an intoxicant.

Pot was never used in the Western world as an intoxicant, we used alcohol, just as in America, hemp was hemp, and pot was not smoked. The Arab world and parts of India used hemp, but also smoked cannabis, it was their intoxicant instead of using alcohol, and it shows.

179 posted on 06/23/2011 2:23:27 AM PDT by ansel12 (America has close to India population of 1950s, India has 1,200,000,000 people now. Quality of Life?)
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To: Puckster

And your friends dont have the same 4th amendment rights as legislators who dont have to pee in a cup...

“Drug Testing Political Candidates Violates Fourth Amendment, Supreme Court Rules”

http://www.ndsn.org/mayjun97/georgia.html

“All animals are equal....some are just a little more equal...’

This fact ALONE should outrage any conservative...

Equal protection under the law?

Not for you prole...that’s only for the political class....piss in a cup or no job for you...

Of course....synthetic urine is legal to buy...

http://www.drug-testing-detox.com/products/quick-fix-urine.html

Drug tests only catch the stupid.

You’d be better off giving an IQ test...any stupid ass can pee in a cup on command.


180 posted on 06/23/2011 2:25:56 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: TigersEye
I did not lie.

Your 40 years experience of smoking pot has obviously wrecked whatever power of reasoning you once had - long, long, oh so very long ago.

181 posted on 06/23/2011 2:27:46 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: ansel12

Booze..pot...same thing...

Only your logic is situational.


182 posted on 06/23/2011 2:28:11 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Crim
Why are you going of on a tangent also.

I've no argument about equality under the law.

What does that have to do with my original post?

Stay on subject.

183 posted on 06/23/2011 2:28:11 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: Berlin_Freeper

So...what’s your excuse?


184 posted on 06/23/2011 2:28:50 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: alexander_busek

Amusing? NOT! Moron.


185 posted on 06/23/2011 2:33:52 AM PDT by OneLoyalAmerican (In God I trust, all others provide citations.)
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To: OneLoyalAmerican
Amusing? NOT! Moron.

The level of polite discourse here has reached a new high!

Was, perhaps, my sarcasm lost upon you?

Regards,

186 posted on 06/23/2011 2:36:59 AM PDT by alexander_busek
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To: Melas

Greetings Melas:

Anaphylaxis.

Cheers,
OLA


187 posted on 06/23/2011 2:37:38 AM PDT by OneLoyalAmerican (In God I trust, all others provide citations.)
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To: Berlin_Freeper

Thanks for making my case easier to convey.


188 posted on 06/23/2011 2:39:32 AM PDT by AustralianConservative
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To: Puckster

Well, even though you just committed to your statement.....wow, very naive.
There are many people I’ve known over the years that the only reason they don’t use it is because it’s illegal.

Their family and jobs come first and they wouldn’t jeopardize both by testing positive for a drug test.

I can stand by my original post then.


Why are you going of on a tangent also.
I’ve no argument about equality under the law.

What does that have to do with my original post?

Stay on subject.


You brought up your friends fear of the law as the only reason they dont smoke pot.

Fear of job loss.

I pointed out that your friends are second class citizens based upon what you advocate.

Law makers are exempt from drug testing under the 4th amendment...the 4th applies to them...but not to your friends...

Throwing the word tangent around repeatedly doesnt make it so...

It’s relative to the discussion at hand.

Enforcement requires testing....yet certain classes are exempt from testing as a 4th amendment voilation...

Therefore...enforcement is a joke played upon the lesser animals.

Have you ever read animal farm?


189 posted on 06/23/2011 2:42:57 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Crim
[...] any stupid ass can pee in a cup on command.

Actually, I've never been called upon to "perform" in that manner, but I suspect that I'd suffer an attack of "embarrassed bladder."

Sorry for the tangent! Your contributions to this thread are appreciated!

As I just told my wife, the "Liberalism-is-a-mental-disease" meme occasionally encountered here at Free Republic - and which I think definitly has some merit - should not blind us to the fact that some Conservatives have a seriously skewed faculty for reasoning when it comes to those drugs which the Federal Govt. - in contravention to the Constitution - illegalized in the 20th century.

Regards,

190 posted on 06/23/2011 2:43:37 AM PDT by alexander_busek
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To: Crim
“There are many people I’ve known “

“I pointed out that your friends are second class citizens based upon what you advocate.”

I said people I've known, right?????????

“It’s relative to the discussion at hand.”

Relevant to someones posting on this thread, but not mine.

“Have you ever read animal farm?”

Obviously in your postings.

“Of course alcohol has caused more deaths because it IS legal....and in what world does your imagination swim in thinking that when marijuana is legalized that the statistics won't eventually catch up or surpass?”

My original. And of course marijuana will never be completely legal.....or, do you want minors to use it. Just like alcohol isn't completely legal.

So, can you get off your tangent and get back to my original comment?

191 posted on 06/23/2011 2:55:51 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: alexander_busek

I’ve never been impressed by situational logic....it’s usually reserved for libtards...

When the topic of pot comes up on FR...”personal responsibilty” flies right out the frickin window for half of the freepers...

Talk about feeling instead of thinking.

We talk about failed federal policies all the time...and why such policies should be ended.

This policy has clearly failed.

It should be ended.

William F Buckley agrees with me....as does Gov Palin.


192 posted on 06/23/2011 2:59:58 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: stars & stripes forever

You are wrong.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19560900

Assessing the impact of cannabis use on trends in diagnosed schizophrenia in the United Kingdom from 1996 to 2005.

Department of Medicines Management, Keele University, Staffordshire, UK. m.frisher@keele.ac.uk

Abstract
A recent systematic review concluded that cannabis use increases risk of psychotic outcomes independently of confounding and transient intoxication effects. Furthermore, a model of the association between cannabis use and schizophrenia indicated that the incidence and prevalence of schizophrenia would increase from 1990 onwards.

The model is based on three factors: a) increased relative risk of psychotic outcomes for frequent cannabis users compared to those who have never used cannabis between 1.8 and 3.1, b) a substantial rise in UK cannabis use from the mid-1970s and c) elevated risk of 20 years from first use of cannabis. This paper investigates whether this has occurred in the UK by examining trends in the annual prevalence and incidence of schizophrenia and psychoses, as measured by diagnosed cases from 1996 to 2005.

Retrospective analysis of the General Practice Research Database (GPRD) was conducted for 183 practices in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. The study cohort comprised almost 600,000 patients each year, representing approximately 2.3% of the UK population aged 16 to 44. Between 1996 and 2005 the incidence and prevalence of schizophrenia and psychoses were either stable or declining.

Explanations other than a genuine stability or decline were considered, but appeared less plausible. In conclusion, this study did not find any evidence of increasing schizophrenia or psychoses in the general population from 1996 to 2005.


193 posted on 06/23/2011 3:06:03 AM PDT by KDD (When the government boot is on your neck, it matters not whether it is the right boot or the left.)
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To: Puckster

I addressed you original comment many posts ago...are you stoned or just stupid?

“Of course alcohol has caused more deaths because it IS legal....and in what world does your imagination swim in thinking that when marijuana is legalized that the statistics won’t eventually catch up or surpass?”

Addressed directly...TWICE.

“My original. And of course marijuana will never be completely legal.....or, do you want minors to use it. Just like alcohol isn’t completely legal.”

Strawman argument...we are of course talking about adult use...I also agree with buckley on this issue...get caught selling drugs to a minor...capital punishment...good enough?...or would you prefer we abuse the corpse as well?

By the same token....do minors use alcohol even though it is illegal to do so?

Yes?...No?


194 posted on 06/23/2011 3:06:44 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: KDD

The Brits are already psychotic...that ship has sailed.


195 posted on 06/23/2011 3:09:14 AM PDT by Crim (Palin / West '12)
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To: Crim

“1) “First, use of alcohol decreased significantly during Prohibition.104 This decrease in turn lead to a marked decrease in the incidence of cirrhosis of the liver.105 Finally, the suicide rate also decreased by 50%.107”

That statement is, at best, misleading. In truth, nobody really knows exactly how much alcohol consumption increased or decreased during Prohibition. The reason was simple enough — people like Al Capone didn’t pay taxes on their product and thereby report their production to the government.”

“I also agree with buckley on this issue...get caught selling drugs to a minor...capital punishment...good enough?...or would you prefer we abuse the corpse as well?

By the same token....do minors use alcohol even though it is illegal to do so?

Yes?...No?”

Seems like Buckley pretty much has your mind locked up.

Why the corpse?

So yes/no back to you, is your purpose to say you really do think that it should be legal because they can get and use illegal substances/alcohol? Illegal to them but not to me, if marijuana is legalized.

What is you point by throwing that in with the corpse?


196 posted on 06/23/2011 3:19:52 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: Crim
How many wasted decades do you have?

Best you take a good long look at Tigerseye before its much too late.

197 posted on 06/23/2011 3:22:10 AM PDT by Berlin_Freeper
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To: Crim

LOL, I run in to them everyday here in Kandahar.

The Aussie’s seem to be more level headed though.


198 posted on 06/23/2011 3:22:46 AM PDT by Puckster
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To: Crim
Simple point is that according to the NIH and other research organizations there is no evidence that cannabis causes mental health issues.

The dishonesty surrounding this subject has cost more loss of respect for our institutions then any other. Our police, Courts and our politicos are now looked upon by a large part of America as jackbooted thugs.

The drug war is the biggest factor into changing our justice system to nothing more then a legal system...justice be damned.

199 posted on 06/23/2011 3:28:34 AM PDT by KDD (When the government boot is on your neck, it matters not whether it is the right boot or the left.)
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To: Puckster
The leftist liars have for years, (make that decades) used the premeditated lie that People (including children) are more prone to do things if they are illegal. These are truly evil people who exchange evil for good.

They knew this was a lie and continued their original lie by say, if we could just make it legal, they would lose interest and stop doing it.

What a pack of mangy liars these people are and they knowingly told this lie for decades in order to undermine the moral resolve of traditional Americans in order to achieve their vile political outcomes desired by their anti-American social revolution.

If you are unaware of this liberal tactic employed by all liberal entertainment, talk shows, movies, lawyers, educators, politicians,etc. for decades then you need to stop all arguments until you wise up.

Liberals created the welfare state and the DRUG CULTURE which has groomed generations of people who do not know right from wrong and who would elect an anti-American Marxist liar.

200 posted on 06/23/2011 3:39:45 AM PDT by Old Landmarks (No fear of man, none!)
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