Obama on Homosexuality: ‘I Don’t Think It’s a Choice’.

Wall Street Journal ^ | 10/14/10 | Jonathan Weisman

[wtc911]

Interesting, you say that Aids is the number one killer of black men in America then to prove it you say that aids is the number one killer of black women.

Then you call me naive for citing CDC data that contradicts your assertions but, seemingly, miss the fact that the quote you provided uses the CDC as its basis.

And, btw, the CDC does not say that which your un-sourced quote says it does. The CDC numbers are very easy to find and very clear...heart disease and cancer are number one and two accounting for 50% of deaths by disease in both black men and women. AIDS doesn't appear in the top ten unless it is hidden under septicima at 3%.

But, please, don't let the facts get in the way of making whatever point you strove to make.

[scripter]

You are entitled to your opinion...as am I

Indeed! Still, everyone should try to have an informed opinion.

[scripter]

I don’t think anyone makes a conscious decision to be a homosexual.

If you mean you don't think anybody makes a conscious decision to have an attraction to the same sex, most would probably agree with you. Although for some reason there's a fringe group here: Queer by Choice.

[GSWarrior]

If I follow your reasoning, am I erroneous in assuming it is the act of engaging in activities with member of the same sex that defines one as a homosexual?

Let's assume that there are homosexuals who choose to be celibate, or who are so horribly ugly or disfigured that they can't get any action. Are they less deserving of our scorn or pity than sexually active ones? ARe they less of a sinner in the eyes of God?

[DJ MacWoW]

Interesting, you say that Aids is the number one killer of black men in America then to prove it you say that aids is the number one killer of black women.

We are urging minorities to get tested for HIV/AIDS and become educated about a disease that is the number one killer of black men and women ages 25-44,

the quote you provided uses the CDC as its basis.
the CDC does not say that which your un-sourced quote says it does.

Make up your mind. Either the CDC said or they didn't. Your logic is faulty. You buy what the government is selling. The rest of us know better.

Have a nice day.

[DJ MacWoW]

Let's assume that there are homosexuals who choose to be celibate, or who are so horribly ugly or disfigured that they can't get any action. Are they less deserving of our scorn or pity than sexually active ones? ARe they less of a sinner in the eyes of God?

If you refrain from sin, have you committed one? The Word also says that God looks at the heart. I can't answer for anyone's heart but my own.

[GSWarrior]

Responding to your Post 62:

I can only speak for myself, but my experience tells me that many Bible-believing, fundamentalist individuals who--since all things come from God--cannot conceive of a God who creates homosexuals. That would suggest that God is somehow imperfect.

My personal belief is that God doesn't have anything to do with it. Just like God doesn't cause earthquakes or cause lightning bolts to rain down onto those who fall out of His favor, God doesn't create homosexuals or heterosexuals. He creates people. People make their own choices. Some may be born gay. I don't think we will ever know for sure. But the so-called gay rights movement is predicated on the belief that people are born gay. Without that belief there is legal footing for a gay rights movement.

Those "anti-homosexual crusaders" who believe it is solely a choice seem to be motivated by a sense that they are acting in accordance with God's will, and that if they can stop even one person from choosing to be gay then God look upon them with favor. It's more for them then it is for homosexuals. This tactic invariably includes explicit descriptions of the often-disgusting nature of homosexual behaviors.

IMO, if people want to take it upon themselves to stop homosexuality from spreading they'd better served by illustrating how a homosexual will never experience the joy of having a child; experience the joys of youth that parents get to experience again through their own children; or how many homosexuals will end up alone with no familial support system in their old age.

All these graphic descriptions of gay sex make good copy, but they won't stop anyone from being a homosexual, IMO. They only serve to bring others who have the same brand of distaste for homosexuals into their own camp.

[GSWarrior]

Oops, paragraph two above should read:

"Without that belief there is NO legal footing for a gay rights movement."

[altura]

I didn’t read the thread, just saw your post on latest posts, but have to tell you, that was a thoughtful, excellent post.

[Joe 6-pack]

IMHO, another person's homosexuality is like my alcoholism. "Experts" can debate endlessly over whether they are genetic or behavioral, or some combination thereof, but even if that debate is ever definitively resolved, persons with either condition will find no relief. Speaking as a recovering alcoholic, if I became convinced that it was genetic, I would find it easy to fall back on the "I was born this way" excuse. If, on the other hand it was shown to be purely behavioral, I could convince myself that I could learn to "drink succesfully," by merely "unlearning" my self-destructive habits. In the nature vs. nurture debate, most people overlook a third dimension and that is the spiritual component. Both excessive, habitual drinking and homosexuality are "deviant" behaviors. I do not mean that with a negative connotation, but merely that they "deviate" from normative behaviors. Both behaviors exhibited by practicing alcoholics and practicing homosexuals are ultimately unhealthy, and even though the practitioners may be fully aware of this, they feel compelled to indulge themselves in the behavior.

Personally, I feel sorrow and pity for homosexuals as individuals. I found relief from my alcoholism by confronting it as a spiritual issue, and found that there is a tremendous amount of freedom in my abstinence; I suspect homosexuals would respond similarly. The difference is that homosexuals as a group have come to demand acceptance, if not celebration of their behavior. It would be akin to alcoholics demanding relief from public intoxication laws on the basis that they "were born that way," or simply, "that's what we do." Recovering alcoholics seek to re-integrate themselves into the normative behavior of their family, community and society at large. Activist homosexuals, on the other hand, demand that their families and society redefine their norms to accomodate their deviant behaviors.

[Joe 6-pack]

...and to round out my thoughts in #130...enablers of either behavior may believe they are doing the compassionate thing, but are in fact, contibuting to the individual’s continued downward slide.

[GSWarrior]

Well stated, Joe.

[Aria]

I think I agree with you. Bottom line is for the most part we don’t know whether we’re born this way or not and that’s why when I realized I liked boys from my earliest memories that I could understand people who said they always knew they were gay.

I once went to a bed and breakfast in Portland around Christmas time and it’s owned by 2 gay guys. I can tell you for sure there was a lot of love in that house. And I can tell you for sure not every hetero house is like that. I had a gay guy try to protect me in a way my ex-husband never did. Some people here seem to think nothing a gay person can do is good enough as long as they are gay. I guess I’m just not that rigid.

But, if I had school age children and I had reason to believe the militant gays were trying to influence their education I’d pull my kids out in a heartbeat.

[ClarenceThomasfan]

Bottom line on this: God created different orafices on our bodies. Some orafices are for input and other orafices are meant for output only (if you get my drift).

[wtc911]

You did not provide any links to any source. You quoted an un-sourced individual who said that the CDC said that AIDS is the number one killer of black Americans.

This will link you to the actual numbers...

http://www.cdc.gov/men/lcod/index.htm

Have a nice day yourself.

[DJ MacWoW]

I certainly did post a link. It was to The Peoples' Coalition For Justice And Humanity. Looked like a lefty site to me and if the PC crowd is saying it, it must be bad.

What you want is to argue. For some reason you didn't like my statement nor the link to to it. Tough.

[red irish]

please put me on the ping list for this.