Posted on 12/09/2009 10:57:23 PM PST by neverdem
Thanks for the ping. Good article.
I would say 90 percent of the people now holding office under the R label nationwide down to the lowest of offices are phony and political people.
They have zero convictions and no desire to limit government or cut spending.
I’m not here to be angry, but I have to honest to myself and God.
The situation is critical and how it gets resolved could come through primaries or third party candidates.
I often share the Canadian experience where people got fed up with the “Progressive Conservative Party” as it was known in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s.
They started the Reform Party and got their 60 or so seats out of 300 in the House of Commons. The PC Party got wiped out into a handful of seats.
The Liberal Party dominated Canada for a decade until the money people and bigwigs brought the factions together under the new “Conservative Party” label and then the new party won a few elections to form minority governments.
I could support either option in this nation right now.
Conservatives in primaries and third party conservatives as candidates if the first option fails.
We need primary challengers with third party people ready to go if RINO’s win primaries. Two candidates ready to take the RINO’s out.
The presidential race in 2012 should be run the same way.
The GOP either accepts a genuine conservative or faces one as a third party.
Freedom erodes and government enlarges regardless of which party is in power. The spending and taxes keep on coming.
Give us liberty GOP or we will give you political death.
Given the incumbency reelection rate, I’m not going to argue with your guessitmate’s 90%.
What happened in Canada will stay in Canada, just like their health care system should. You’re falling prey to a much smaller province, hardly a valid comparison to the US. Again, third parties have been tried here in every election and to date, without success.
We have two major parties. One loses, one wins the majority and the majority rules. This is true in state houses and in houses of congress, which is why ‘blue dogs’ must be defeated. Each blue dog votes for the majority when it comes to electing the speaker, should the democrats retain control of the House.
The problem I have with your use of the word RINO, is that your RINO might not be my RINO. My RINOS are more than likely, but not limited to INCUMBENTS.
I’ve already addressed my concerns for the nominating process in the presidential election 2012 in an earlier post. The Grand Old Party needs a full slate of conservative candidates from which its voters can choose that is not short circuited after the first of the front-loaded primaries.
The fact of the matter, is that the genius of Richard Viguerie was responsible for so much of the conservative gotv and fundraising success of the Reagan era. He pioneered the use of computerized and segmented donor lists for political direct mail. He supported Reagan, despite their early differences, and played no small part in his success, the success of conservatism, and the now apparently parasitic continuation of the modern Republican apparatus, which has no claim whatsoever to the Reagan mantle. This he seeks to rectify.
Viguerie compelled Reagan rightward. Direct mail testing of fundraising appeals compelled this, for him and for many others, who were met with electoral success as a result. The party did not learn, however, and is now in the doldrums, with a very large decline in contributions. Why is that? They've become arrogant and have completely lost touch, that's why. You see it every single day here on FR, and it's devolving rather than improving.
And you attack the messenger, who was a key architect of the modern conservative resurgence.
Talk about eating your own, as far as fellow conservatives. Trouble is, your perception of your own seems to be the party establishment, rather than a set of ideals. What Viguerie advocates is sound. Elect conservatives. Forget political party, if the Republicans refuse to field conservative candidates. Create a conservative candidacy in the absence of one in any given contest, via third parties if necessary. Or, even a conservative Democrat, all other options failing. This moves the discourse steadily rightward, much along the lines of the steady infiltration of the Republican Party by the left, that has steadily moved the discourse leftward. Turn the tables.
That is the way out of this mess. He sees it, has seen it for a very long time, and your attempting to smear him does a disservice to us all.
Truly it is written:
Proverbs 30:27
The locusts have no king, yet go they forth all of them by bands;
May God of Heaven help us...
I most wholeheartedly agree. Unfortunately, the death grip both major "political party's" have on the electorate is beyond stunning. One can witness the result daily even here on FreeRepublic.com. Regardless of how often the site owner declares this is not a GOP forum the "party" faithful continue their march towards the cliff!
But I digress. The past is the past and I am all about moving forward. Trouble is, Viguerie is a third party guy, who fails to recognize that a lot of the Tea Partyers are both current and former conservative Republicans, who think of themselves as “Tea Party Republicans.”
Incumbency is the primary problem. Not one incumbent is irreplaceable. If nothing else, the Tea Parties have shined the spot light on the incumbents, complete with their mega-million campaign funds, so this time around in 2010, their conservative challengers should have an energetic base of volunteers ready work in their campaigns to get out the vote.
Primaries should be robust, with challengers for every incumbent.
Should the decades long incumbent win the GOP primary, then s/he will still be open to a third party challenger but this time that challenger might make more of a dent.
America's big bloated government is King George, oppressive taxation and regulation are being felt by ordinary people, and they will respond to a real leader (not any of the current crop).
Popularity and issues-oriented chatter won't do it. Solid, sound principles and ideas will. Couple that with a credentialed and knowledgeable patriot who understands the nature and history of our enemies, as well as the counterfeit ideas of the Left in America, and in 2012, the current President will be limited to one term.
Lt. Col. Allen West deserves close examination by those who recognize the military threats, as well as the ideological threats America faces. His bio is on his web site, and a recent blog posting can be found here.
There are videos contain his challenging speeches, as well as a recent interview in Israel, where he was a keynote speaker on terrorism.
“Forget political party, if the Republicans refuse to field conservative candidates.”
What is this “if the Republicans refuse to field conservative candidates”?
Refuse?
Heretofore, I thought decisions to seek public office were made by individuals interested in holding a particular office.
I got that, too.
It's obvious he's hiding his true intentions when he says the Republican leaders "distain the Tea Parties". I haven't seen or heard a single negative statement about the TP attributed to any Republican.
Viguerie, a long time friend of the Democrats with his
Third Party, all or nothing mentality.
So many on FR who think the Third Party candidate who will always receive 2% to 8% of the vote at most will beat
the Republican or Democrat who will receive at least 48% of the vote.
Lets see, 6% 3rd P vs. 48% R or D
Do these people on FR know 3rd grade math.
There has been in recent years Republican Congressmen and Senators lose by small amounts due to 3rd Party loons.
So many on FR are too lazy to work within the Republican party to work for Conservative Republicans.
Instead, these third party yahoos stand around waving their pom poms with their pre packaged comments looking at the world through a straw.
The three of us see through him and I'm certain we have a lot of company. "Disdain" is precisely what Viguerie has for the GOP.
Richard Viguerie is the owner/publisher of THIRD PARTY WATCH, and it wasn't too long ago that Bob Barr and Viguerie were trying to takeover the Libertarian Party so that Barr could run under its banner. I don't recall if Viguerie succeeded, but Barr did mount a run.
Oh wait, I found an article. Here's the money paragraph:
"If they succeed, the Libertarian Party will become just one more mouthpiece for malcontent Republicans." LOL.
Yes, I remember the Barr presidential effort and his strange alliance with the ACLU. It was very discouraging to learn that Barr and Viguerie weren’t really on the side of true conservatism.
Well, you know where I stand on third parties. Right alongside you, Mark Levin and Rush Limbaugh. Third parties are fine and dandy for the Left side, and the Right already has several. We hardly need added others.
Your concern is both touching and disturbing, simultaneously.
But I digress.
Yes, you've demonstrated a penchant for digression.
The past is the past and I am all about moving forward.
That's funny, I get the impression you've got old scores to settle, with those who dare to buck the (R) establishment.
a lot of the Tea Partyers are both current and former conservative Republicans, who think of themselves as “Tea Party Republicans.”
That's funny, I get the impression that they're by and large conservatives, of every political affiliation or none at all. Republicans seeking to co-opt the movement, who don't have conservative, Constitutionalist bonafides are wasting their time.
Incumbency is the primary problem. Not one incumbent is irreplaceable. If nothing else, the Tea Parties have shined the spot light on the incumbents, complete with their mega-million campaign funds, so this time around in 2010, their conservative challengers should have an energetic base of volunteers ready work in their campaigns to get out the vote. Primaries should be robust, with challengers for every incumbent. Should the decades long incumbent win the GOP primary, then s/he will still be open to a third party challenger but this time that challenger might make more of a dent.
Well my goodness, all that barking at conservative icon Richard Viguerie, just to turn right around and agree with him.
Now, just what was it, that you were going on about, lol?
Well then let us be honest about the history of third party movements. Any third party that won more than 1% of the vote required the backing of millionaires, not just for campaign cash but for obtaining media access and to counteract vote rigging.
Sometimes millionaires use a third party just to prevent election of a less-favored major party candidate. Teddy Roosevelt's Bull-Moose party caused the defeat of Republican Taft and the election of Wilson. Under Wilson we got the income tax, Federal Reserve, and entry into WWI. Kooky Ross Perot was essential for the election of Bill Clinton.
Sara Palin must combine her people power with backing from a few "good" millionaires to overrun the Republican party. If she can win the Republican primaries, she will be ready for the general elections.
With more and more conservatiuves realizing the GOP has failed them and willing to join a different party, the GOP will BE the third party and eventually become insignificant. You have to start sometime and place with somebody, and this is the time and place. The somebodies are already in place.
Vig’s history is not digression, even though it offers some uncomfortable truths for you. Even his recent history, does not bode well for Richard’s claim that he wants to ELECT conservatives; i.e. backing the “presidential” candidacy of Ron Paul, who is not a conservative I would support, unless he were running for a state house office.
It is interesting, is it not, that Ron Paul the Libertarian, chooses to run under the Republican banner?
Please do not confuse “making a dent” with WINNING. Nothing beats winning.
Which democrats ran under the philosophy of the Tea Party?
An interesting scenario that could play out is if Sarah Palin ran as a Tea Party candidate, but I think she'll stay with the GOP.
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