Cutaway of a Collins class boat
Posted on 10/20/2009 10:53:55 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
Engine problems cripple Collins-class submarines
THE navy's $6 billion Collins-class submarines face serious operational restrictions after being hit by a run of crippling mechanical problems and troubling maintenance issues.
Some senior engineering experts now contend that the Swedish-supplied Hedemora diesel engines may have to be replaced - a major design and engineering job that could cost hundreds of millions of dollars and take years to complete.
So serious are the problems that the Defence Materiel Organisation has put the Collins boats at the top of its list of "projects of concern" - the key equipment issues troubling Australia's Defence leaders.
The Australian understands that in recent times only a single Collins-class boat has been available for operational duties but it is unclear whether this involves more than extended training missions.
Senior Defence leaders are also vitally concerned about the productivity and efficiency of ASC, the Adelaide-based wholly government-owned builder and maintainer of the Collins class.
One senior Defence source characterises the level of concern in senior government ranks about the availability of the Collins submarines as "extreme".
In the recent defence white paper, Kevin Rudd announced that the government would double the size of the RAN's submarine fleet from six to 12 when it came to replacing the Collins-class boats from 2025.
"If you can't do this right, how do you do the next one," observed one senior Defence source last night.
"We spend a lot of money on this core defence capability and they aren't working properly."
Defence Minister John Faulkner and Defence Materiel Minister Greg Combet have now demanded monthly updates from the navy and Defence about the operational state of the Collins-class vessels.
ASC, the Adelaide-based builder and maintainer of the Collins class,
(Excerpt) Read more at theaustralian.news.com.au ...
Cutaway of a Collins class boat
Bahhhh, just open the hood and yank it out. Sheesh, sounds simple enough.
Engines for subs need to meet some unusual requirements. You need to start them while snorkeling with something like 50ft. of water pressure against the exhaust. Then you must meet the shock requirment etc. It isn’t easy to get an engine to do all this.
At least they didn’t get the doors from Poland.....
(rim shot for bad Polish joke.)
I’m not going to get into trouble for saying that am I?
guess they should have bought some german u-boats.
I guess that’s why we like to split atoms up here in America.
Well, they did get the screen doors from Poland.
Reporting for duty.
You gots some serious splainin’ to do here.
"You lost another submarine?"
I don’t know, those Swedish Stirling engine subs are apparently quite capable and hard to find.
These don’t have sterling engines.
Those huge holes in the side are clearly a problem.
Quite obviously, I was referring to the HMS Gotland.
That’s why I’m not a comedian. It’s a bit sad when I deliver a simple joke and leave out the actual punch line that the submarine doors are “screen doors.”
All of our nuclear boats have diesel engines and cannot go to sea without the diesel in working order.
I went on wikipedia and looked this thing up. Apparently it’s a complete disaster. Almost the entire article is about how what a crap it is.
More accurately would be that they can, but they're just not permitted. That's like saying they can't go out to sea without at least two welders and four torpedoes. It's just policy.
And what are the purposes of the diesel engines?? Not primary propulsion out in the deep blue sea.
There is only one diesel engine on a nuclear sub, and it drives a generator. It can only be operated while surfaced or at periscope depth with the snorkle raised. It is not used for propulsion directly. If the reactor shuts down, the sub runs off of batteries. Propulsion is provided by one of two electric motors. One is connected to the same shaft that the steam turbines drive. The other is a drop down outboard unit. The sub can operate for long periods of time on the battery, but eventually will need to be charged by the emergency diesel generator.
They’d probably need them to bootstrap the reactor if it had a scram.
They might also be able to provide limp-home propulsion.
Yeah, that is quite a bit more accurate.
Yeah, that is quite a bit more accurate.
Stupid intarweb hiccup.
Modern D-E subs are the quietest ocean going vessel today (more than any nuclear sub), and are the most lethal threat facing the USN. Manned by a capable crew and with the latest ASMs, a modern D-E AIP submarine along littoral waters is the most dangerous naval combatant. No wonder the US has been leasing D-E subs from other nations to practice against, and why those D-E subs have managed to 'sink' USN ships in training exercises.
Nuclear submarines are perfect for long-range blue-water operations, but for littoral duties (and denial of sea-lanes in those waters) a modern D-E AIP (e.g. the German U 212/214) is a perfect weapon if any such weapon ever existed.
Or the HMS Gotland that was able to “sink” the USS Ronald Reagan during a training exercise in 2005 or 2006.
Yes, that was what I was getting at. Diesel is used for emergency situations, not primary propulsion, so the situation you were talking about, having to exhaust gas at depth, is not relevant to our subs. Though I once exhausted gas from a depth of about 2 feet in a hot tub once. There was no significant engineering obstacles to be overcome there.
Well, much like your theory-to-practice experience in the hot tub, the emergency diesel generator does not have to overcome any significant engineering obstacle to exhaust gas while submerged. It actually comes out the top of the sail below water to mask IR signature. The ship’s snorkel is for air induction. Try your experiment again submerged while inhaling through a straw.
Who doesn’t like applied physics???
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