Posted on 10/13/2009 6:22:31 PM PDT by CitizenM
Jim Clausen was "shocked" when the manager of the Oaks Apartments in Albany told him he could face eviction if he did not remove the American flags that fly from his Jeep and motorcycle when they are parked at the complex.
Barb Holcomb, who manages the Oaks Apartments at 1440 Geary Circle S.E. for owner Stan Keller, said Clausen is correct.
She is requiring that tenants take off any flag that flies from their vehicles, and that includes the Mexican flag and college team flags.
Political and religous signs at a tenant's unit also are not permitted.
"I'm trying to avoid any conflict," Holcomb said. "I have a problem when tenants' rights to free speech come into contact with other tenants' rights of peaceful enjoyment. This policy is not a violation of anyone's civil rights.
"We're a diverse community here, and we've had previous problems with this sort of thing," she said.
Jann Carson, the associate director of the ACLU of Oregon, agreed that Clausen and other tenants' civil rights are not being violated under the new policy
SNIP
Holcomb said she wanted to implement the flag policy earlier but the previous manager would not say anything to the tenants.
"We have a new manager who is taking care of this," she said. "It's a small housekeeping problem we want to take care of."
(Excerpt) Read more at democratherald.com ...
This is America. We have the right to put our AMERICAN flag on our own property. The country is certainly going mad allowing a few tell us not to fly our own country's flag. I am so angry I am seeing STARS AND STRIPES!
Does she also make people remove bumper stickers from their cars? And if not, I’d put the biggest American flag sticker that I could find on there....or lots of little ones!
Well isn't she just plain vanilla. Never mind the whole free speech thingy in the constitution.
C’mon guys the ACLU said civil rights were not being violated. They would never lie or only pursue cases that help their Socialist Progressive agenda.
/sarc
>>Political and religous signs at a tenant’s unit also are not permitted.
American flags are now considered a “political sign”?? I guess they’re right. 48% of America lives under the Stars and Stripes, and 52% live under the big “O” flag.
I would have 2 things to say. The first, why don’t you come on over and take it. The second, see you in court.
That must be somewhere in a sub paragraph of the 1st ammendment just before the 'right not to be offended'. I'm not sure where that is. Maybe I should ask a Muslim.
” “We’re a diverse community here, and we’ve had previous problems with this sort of thing,” she said. “
Just realized this must be one of those “10 illegals live in a 1 bedroom” apartments.
I think I would hire one of those airplane banner guys to fly a huge flag around in circles over that place for a few days... see how they like that!
I’d really be tempted to paint my car with the flag.
My drapes would be flags. My clothes would be flags my shower curtains would be also..
Why doesnt Miss Holcomb, try minding her own friggin business.
You could project a waving flag onto the clouds overhead at night!
My view here is simple. It’s the owners property, the owner makes the rules. If I lived there I’d move. If it was my property and somebody was flying a commie flag they’d move. Quickly.
It would be different if it didn't include the American flag!
I'm sick of and offended by people who are offended!
The previous manager didn’t enforce this. Now she comes along and does. I’m curious what the owner has to say about it.
Civil rights? If she gets any gubmint money, it might be a violation of Constitutional rights.
What? Where's the "right of peaceful enjoyment"? If it exists, the Obozo is violating mine by destroying the country which I peacefully enjoy.
“he could face eviction if he did not remove the American flags”
I work in the industry, and though state laws vary, I seriously doubt he could be evicted for breaching this rule if it wasn’t specified in his lease. They can choose not to renew his lease, or make him sign on to the new rule at renewal time, and evict him then, but I can’t imagine any judge would side with the landlord in this case, even in the most pro-landlord jurisdictions in the country.
“It’s the owners property, the owner makes the rules.”
Yes, that is true. However, if the owner has entered into a signed lease agreement with the tenant, then the owner can’t simply evict a tenant for breaching some new rule they just made up. If the rules weren’t part of the signed lease, then the owner won’t be able to use the courts to enforce them on that particular tenant.
Right on, right on.
Can you say, “Class action law suit!”
From the response all over the net, this rule will be changed quite quickly.
As someone pointed out in the comments of one of the original stories, Oregon’s veteran’s license plate has an American flag on it. Is the owner of a car with veteran’s plates supposed to remove them?
Here’s the management company contact info:
I feel a “Levin surge” of calls coming on...
Oaks Apartments
(Keller Development Company*, Oaks Apartments*)
1440 Geary Cir SE
Albany, OR 97322-6823
Phone: (541) 967-1284
Please give them a call: (541) 967-1284.
Then I'd get some inside window tint/screen such as http://www.monstermarketplace.com/Automotive/Landing1936a631.html
Bumper stickers? You bet... Maybe paint the entire car red white and blue.
Then I'd start inundating them with complaints about other people's promoting foreign, un-American cars. Every Honda, Toyoda, BMW, etc. that had a visible company logo... I'd write/email a complaint. If they can't see my flag, I don't want to see their foreign support.
She'll quickly see that what she is trying to do is pointless and doomed to failure.
Diverse community here. Oh, in other words, full of faggots.
Translation: We’ve got ourselves a buttload of illegal aliens living here and they are bound to make trouble.
“48% of America lives under the Stars and Stripes, and 52% live under the big “O” flag.”
43% live under the American flag, 45% live under the Mexican flag, leaving 12% under Obama.
The Lessee has property rights that can’t be violated outside of the contract. Also there is a first amendment issue.
Sounds like this woman needs a lesson taught to her.
Property rights are being lost left and right in this country. See Kelo.
My property is my property, you can exercise your rights on public property or your own. When you're on my property I make the rules.
Anything else is more collectivist crap sweeping the nation from left to right. My property isn't your castle. You fly my castles flag or you leave.
Some great reviews of the Oaks Apartments here...
Particularly like the one comparing the place to a gulag.
http://www.apartmentreviews.net/ratings/Oregon/albany/Oaks-Apartments.htm
Normally I’m against flag burning but.... :-)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350246215053&_trksid=p2759.l1259#ht_1056wt_665
I just gave them a piece of my mind. The owners of that aapartment complex is Stankorp at 541-926-5062. I left a message among other things telling them that that b**ch of a manager should be fired.
Your view is also a bit inaccurate. Just because you own something that others rent, does not give you the ability to enact tenant rules that violate state and federal laws, much their the state and federal constitutions. They aren’t lords and their properties aren’t fiefdoms. They can make up regulations in contracts but they can’t make up anything they want and take away people’s rights and liberties that are protected. The flag is a political symbol and is an expression of protected speech.
She will be sued for this and she will lose big time.
What about one of those car wraps? lol
Yep, sue their asses off! It’s all they understand.
My thoughts exactly. What happens if someone is offended?What are they afraid will happen? I would love to see how they detail the 'legal grounds' for the "right" of peaceful enjoyment. Also, how would an apartment lease cover items (flags, stickers) that are on your vehicle? (Your car cannot be red, white or blue in color, and meet the owner's non-offensive model standard....? Huh?)
Oh and the massive flag flying happened because of 9/11. Has that manager forgotten?
Evictions used to be for non payment of rent or damages. Serious stuff. Being evicted for flying a flag is stupid.
Makes one wonder what types of people dwell in that place who are upset with any flag.
Hardly. My view is based on freedom and property rights. Your view is that of a typical statist who can regulate and legislate my private property rights out of existence.
And people wonder why the Obamas of the world keep gaining traction? The answer is right here on this thread.
Heck, give Barb a call:
Barb Holcomb
(518) 761-1000
And I want to emphasize that I am all for landlords being able to be in control of their properties. When you have other people involved, they have constitutionally protected rights at the federal and state levels, and even though you own a building doesn’t give them the magical power to deny/violate those other peoples’ rights.
Restricting political speech ain’t a power a landlord has. Noise problems, yes. Garbage on the lawn? Yes. Ability to have pets? Yes. Having people staying there not on the lease? Yes.
The problem here is that it’s easy to deal with things when you own the property and you’re the only one on it. It’s another thing when other people are in what you own. You are bound by law to deal with people a certain way and it prevents you from doing things you’d like to do because it’s YOUR property. It’s why I am NOT a landlord.
But for example, you can’t legally not rent to people because you don’t like their skin color. Or their sexual orientation, if you are made aware of it. Or their religion. You could not refuse to rent to them if their politics were different than yours. You may not be able to rent to them based on their criminal history.
Conversely you can decide to not rent to them if their credit rating has problems, they don’t have a job (no income to pay rent), they have pets and you don’t allow pets in your building, etc.
Landlords don’t have omnipotent powers and I know this as I have extremely close friends who own properties and rent to others. I am amazed at what they have to deal with. They know the law and write up very favorable contracts for themselves and they are also legal (they know the laws and what they can and cannot put in a contract) and not allowing people to fly the American flag on their car isn’t something they can tell them NOT to do because they are renters.
Now in this particular story and situation, something else might be going on in the complex, such as mexican and american groups of renters getting charged up over amnesty/immigration or something but if that is the case, they still don’t have the right to force people to take those flags off their vehicles, and if they think that one little thing is going to fix or stabilize what’s going on with those people they are nuts.
I micturate on this diversity, though I will never peaon on it..
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