You can never have too much ammo.
Posted on 08/31/2009 6:52:11 PM PDT by Greystoke
East Alton, IL – -(AmmoLand.com)- Winchester® Ammunition was recently awarded a contract by the Immigration, Customs and Enforcement (ICE) division of the Department of Homeland Security to supply a maximum of 200 million, 40 cal. rounds over the next five years.
(Excerpt) Read more at ammoland.com ...
banglist
ping
Depends on their mission...
How many rounds is that per federale?
Too bad the contract wasn’t for the Border Patrol...but then, they aren’t really allowed to use their ammunition anyway.
What would that be, exactly?
Wonder if they’ll have any excess capacity after providing this?
Trying to stock up to combat citizens in revolution, I guess...or hoping to scare people, or both.
Most of it will be used for training/familiarization with handguns.
Great... There’s another that will be tough to be, along with Lake City 5.56.
Semi-auto pistol ammo. Many of the govt agencies use H and K, or Berretta pistols. 40 million rounds per year sounds enormous.??
Someone has to buy it for the felons, as they aren’t allowed to have guns.
But law enforcement, outside of special units, really don't do all that much firearms training. And ICE only has 18K employees TOTAL.
So either every file clerk and secretary in ICE is getting a lot of range time, or they are doing something strange.
Bigger than a .38, smaller than a .45
;)
You just knew that was coming...
Standard semiautomatic handgun caliber used by many police forces. More powerful than a 9mm and less powerful than a .45 ACP. Was designed in the late 1980s at the request of the FBI to remedy the perceived lack of stopping power of a 9mm and excessive recoil of a 10mm which the FBI used for a short period of time.
Looking at the article, the requisition is in fact for the Border Patrol. That's still a lot of ammo for a 50K-person dept.
.40 S&W, the preferred round of law enforcement agencies all over the country.
I gather that Homeland Security is planning to standardize their firearm of choice as a .40 Glock, which is already preferred by the FBI, I believe.
Bureaucrats love standardization, because it makes procurement easier. But truth be told, 200 million rounds is not that much, if you calculate annual training.
However, it is still a good idea that individual States be encouraged to create laws providing for State production and use of ammunition, that is, to make it easy for ammo makers to produce non-federally regulated ammo just for use within that State.
That’s 20,000 rounds per 8 hour shift, minus weekends and vacations, for five years...
How many people does this supply? There are 200,000 people in DHS now that they’ve consolidated INS, so that’s one round per TEN shifts, not a reasonable estimate. Let’s guess that 25% of them are in “gun toting” jobs, .4 rounds per week or just under 2 rounds per month.
Yeah, I think you are correct, that’s a reasonable amount of ammo for training over five years.
It would be nice if it increased the supply to us citizens, eh?
Sorry, didn’t equate that with “Border Patrol”. Still...what do they need the ammunition for? If they use it, they’ll get imprisoned.
Some felons in Pennsylvania are able to use black powder after filing legal requests. I just heard about this last week on our local talk radio station.
Hey, I got it. The . was missing so what it is exactly is hugh & series.
You can never have too much ammo.
“Doesn’t that seem like a lot of ammo for a law enforcement agency?”
Given that the average LEO can’t hit a barn he is inside of, not too much at all. Since they are the point of the spear in dealing with the upcoming terrorist attacks, they need range time and ammo.
As far as the tyranny aspect, it is of note that the citizens bought well over 700 million rounds of all sorts of ammo in the time since Obama was elected.
Somehow, when the public out buys the police by something like 15 to one, I don’t think the citizen need fear the police purchase of ammo.
As a comparison, the US military bought 1,000 million rounds for last year.
What the citizens should fear is goobers in all levels of gooberment agencies that have closed ranges needed by both cops and citizens.
Actually the law enforcement community in general burns through a LOT of ammo just in range practice. I don’t have a big problem with that.
“...designed for the office... “
What do they use for outside work then? =)
It could have been worse. They could have called it a 40MM.
That's 25 rds a week. That's less than 2 magazines on a Saturday morning. Most people I know burn through 4 times that every weekend. Do you really want LEs that get that little practice??
I was thinking the same thing.
On the other hand, since Winchester is unlikely to use Federal primers, maybe the supply situation will improve a bit. Wish I'd bought a million Federal 205Ms two years ago. They've appreciated better than gold.
>>Many of the govt agencies use H and K, or Berretta pistols.<<
Actually, almost all of them use either Glock (FBI) or Sig Sauer (Sec. Service), with, I’d guess, about a 40 vs. 60 percent (rough) respective share between the two. While there may be some other brands (S&W comes to mind), I’m personally not aware of any federal LE agency that uses either H&K (postal guys maybe??) or Beretta handguns as issued weapons. There may be one here or there and there also may be agents or officers that use these themselves as duty or off-duty weapons.
Anyone have any more recent info that shows this wrong?
The favorite round of the LEO "spray and pray" crowd.
Glock food.
The round that is eventually dislodged from the body part of the LEO or LEO-proximate after the negligent discharge of the Glock.
I thought I should have typed that decimal point right after I hit post.
Cool picture. Just think, if the Second Amendment actually meant something, Those would be sold at Sears. Solid projectiles would be great for home defense.
200 million rounds is far, far more than range practice every day for every DHS employee including weekends and holidays for the entirety of their careers.
200 million is insane.
A lot of police officers do less than 100 rounds per year. They shoot their yearly qualifier and that's it. My range hosts police qualifiers. They are not impressive.
Just as home owners in the Northeast buying heating oil, they enter a multiyear contract to lock in a bearable price. Considering the last year’s ammo market, that’s not insane. How a many employees fall under DHS??
I just looked it up on wiki - 200,000. Which, I'll admit, made me blink.
But only a small fraction of them (please God) are armed.
Even still, it's only one agency of the feds, and 200 million rounds for five years is still staggering to me. That's army-level BLOAT.
It’s Chinese so I think Harbor Freight or Walmart.
Wait a minute, new reply. It wasn't an order for DHS, it was an order for ICE, a department of DHS.
ICE has 15,000 employees.
Let's assume a third are armed (rough guess).
That's 40,000 rounds per armed employee, at 8,000 rounds per year for 5 years.
That's a LOT of live firearms training every year for every employee.
Wow! That is 1 1/2 rounds for every moderate and conservative in America.
Yeah, but considering the talent pool they collect from, they need all the practice they can get. I’m no proponent of the feds but if you pack hardware as your job, burning through a hundred rounds a day to stay proficient, I don’t have a problem. It’s better than giving the money to some yahoo that’s been unemployed for years milking the system. I wish I could afford that practice luxury. But I’m just a working class stiff. We’re tight as a drum when it comes to money in my house. I’m sitting here watching grocery prices steadily rise but the media doen’t see inflation yet?? Baffling...
You mean the government actually awarded an American company a contract and was wondering the same thing; why all the ammo?
Good to hear that. I prefer the Win 175 grain Silvertip myself. Hope to still be able to get it. Then there is the 165 grain for 40S&W, and 180 grain for 10mm. so they can have the 135 grainers. Remington makes the Golden Saber and JHP's that work well, so we should still be good to go.
That’s roughly 2 boxes per week. Again, considering the talent pool, that’s not that bad. It’s a drop in the bucket for this Admin. Considering they’re up against the Mexican Army at an alarming rate I hope they can hit their target!
This probably means I won’t be able to find Winchester white box ammo on the shelves for another 5 years.
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