DING DING DING! What do we have for him, Johnny?
Posted on 08/28/2009 1:31:53 PM PDT by RKV
In August 1979, I took my last drink. It was about four o'clock on a Saturday afternoon, the hot sun streaming through the windows of my little carriage house on Dickens. I put a glass of scotch and soda down on the living room table, went to bed, and pulled the blankets over my head. I couldn't take it any more.
On Monday I went to visit wise old Dr. Jakob Schlichter. I had been seeing him for a year, telling him I thought I might be drinking too much. He agreed, and advised me to go to "A.A.A," which is what he called it. Sounded like a place where they taught you to drink and drive. I said I didn't need to go to any meetings. I would stop drinking on my own. He told me to go ahead and try, and check back with him every month.
The problem with using will power, for me, was that it lasted only until my will persuaded me I could take another drink. ...
A.A. believes there is an enormous difference between bring dry and being sober. It is not enough to simply abstain. You need to heal and repair the damage to yourself and others. We talk about "white-knuckle sobriety," which might mean, "I'm sober as long as I hold onto the arms of this chair." People who are dry but not sober are on a "dry drunk."
...
(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.suntimes.com ...
In Ebert's case I'll make an exception, mainly because the man has no class, even after being off booze for years. I reread his article on "Public prayer fanatics borrow page from enemy's script" from the March 2003 Sun-Times where he criticizes Bush and Ashcroft and as much as calls them equivalent to the Taliban. Not. Even. Close. Roger.
I'll tell you what Roger Ebert is, at least as far as remote diagnosis can tell - he's the dry drunk. Oh, he's not on the bottle anymore, he just ain't sober yet. And after all these years.
Key symptoms - grandiosity, judgmentalism, intolerance , impulsivity, and indecisiveness which leads to mood swings, self absorption, detachment and escapism.
After all the cr@p that GWB had to put up with from lefties calling him a dry drunk, I think it is fair to return the favor. Glad you're off the bottle, Roger, now see if you can disagree with your political opponents without name-calling, OK? You can talk about being a dry drunk, but can you recognize the symptoms in your own rhetoric? You may or may not agree what's best on any given issue, Rog old boy, but your fellow Americans of the conservative persuasion, are NOT the Talib. Remember that. If we were, you'd already have been publicly humiliated by being dragged around a mosque, with a flogging thrown in for good measure.
In what way?
Actually...if a person follows the AA program, right from the book.. after living the program for a while.. they have a tendency to turn conservative.
Those who use it to just stop drinking, and leave the rest of the program alone... tend to go liberal.
Where did you ever get that from? I know plenty of people in CT who have been sober for years and are liberals.
Are you a member of AA?
Is this the Roger from “American Dad”? Now THAT Roger, I could understand and even have some sympathy for. That creature is flawed and knows it, while this guy from the Sun-Times, well, he has yet to declare his humanity.
The AA model wasn’t for me. I went with a self challenge model for me and I did it on my own.
I knew I was never going to escape from contact with alcohol so I forced myself to be around it without drinking. I even carried an unopened beer around with me for several months. Its been nearly a decade since I last drank.
AA Ping
Nope, but I got that list from their site. They use the term. I am NOT an MD, either, I’m just a conservative/libertarian who know a few alcoholics, and has seen them dry, sober AND dry drunk (if I understand the definition correctly, and I think I do).
Sober since 8/4/87.
Or as I am often fond of saying, sober since the Reagan Era.
All I can add to Roger's story is that he claims that he still does not believe in God, but rather just the higher power found in other people. Fine. That's a good start. But after 30 years, I would expect that he would have developed a deeper understanding of God. That's what the 11th step is all about. It sounds as though his spirituality ended at step 2.
God bless him for quitting. I'm sure his life is much improved. But as I tell newcomers, when you work it the way it's written, it gets even better than you could have imagined.
What..wake up every morning and know that you are never going to feel any better?
I will learn to live without scotch, but never without the vino.
You'd actually be better off not trying to analyze/define something you know nothing about. Just know drunks, dry or sober or active, does not qualify you to judge.
While I may not agree with Ebert's politics I would not use his politics to judge his sobriety.
Having been sober for over twenty years I have learned that sobriety is not something that's judged - just lived.
I’ll judge who I please thank you, whether you approve or not.
DING DING DING! What do we have for him, Johnny?
I never liked the term "dry drunk". I seems to imply that the AA way is the only way. If you are able to use another method or even just decide that you've been drinking too much and need to stop that you are no better off than before, and may in some ways be worse off.
Sobriety date, October 26, 1975
**AA Ping**
????? Really ... sign me up!
Well, then you are completely missing the point of AA and the words you quoted. You tried to use AA's words to justify your own judgementalism. Kind of ironic.
I think that you realized that sobriety was only going to be temporary if it depended upon being away from alcohol. More booze is as close as the nearest store.
My last drink was over thirty-two years ago. I left half of a margarita in a restaurant. I had been recognizing that my drinking was affecting my life in negative ways. That is the definition of being an alcoholic. I decided that I would quit right in the middle of that drink.
“Key symptoms - grandiosity, judgmentalism, intolerance, impulsivity, and indecisiveness which leads to mood swings, self absorption, detachment and escapism.”
Does sound like a liberal
I knew I was never going to escape from contact with alcohol so I forced myself to be around it without drinking. I even carried an unopened beer around with me for several months. Its been nearly a decade since I last drank.
It doesn't really matter what method is used, as long as it works!
Good for you. My husband is a recovered alcoholic/addict. He started going down hill after two spinal surgeries in two years. Yep. Followed in Brett Favre’s footsteps down ‘The Old Vicadin Mine-Strewn Path.’
Yee-Gawds. I’m glad I stuck it out, but what a nightmarish hell it was for the year it took him to get it together again! (Ten years ago.)
I went to a few Al-Anon meetings (for families) and what a bunch of enabling whiners! I couldn’t take it, so I did some one-on-one therapy with a psychiatric nurse who is also a dear friend of mine, and I did a lot of reading and research on my own. A lot. We went through couples therapy, too.
I thank God he chose me and the boys over alcohol and drugs. Al-Anon/AA is NOT for everyone, but it sure helps many.
**But as I tell newcomers, when you work it the way it’s written, it gets even better than you could have imagined.**
Sober since 10/10/1979
“Key symptoms - grandiosity, judgmentalism, intolerance , impulsivity, and indecisiveness which leads to mood swings, self absorption, detachment and escapism. “ Pot calling kettle black
As far as I can tell once an alkie always an alkie ( even though we have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body)
What I don’t like about Ebert is that at a level of the press he has violated the traditions and not remained anonymous. There is a reason for that tradition.
Very well said. I’m so sick and tired of these hypocrites who take the rest of us for granted.
And what poor business judgment these loudmouths have. I barely turn my TV on any more. I’m sure their sponsors really appreciate it.
Good for you Roger that you’ve beaten an addiction. Now work on your immaturity.
“I went to a few Al-Anon meetings (for families) and what a bunch of enabling whiners!”
And that’s not to say that I hadn’t obviuosly been one, too. But enough was enough. I was waaaaaay past mad and ready to split with the kids and they were still in the ‘poor me’ phase. Me! Me! Me! Blech!
A lot of my life long friends are heavy drinkers. I wanted to give up the alcohol but not the friends.
AA doesn't like the idea that some can stop w/o AA and some can. I'm not a dry-drunk, I'm a nondrinker. Seven years since my last sip is all the proof I need.
Or, some self-righteous "conservatives"...? (not you)
What makes you think that people in AA don’t have ‘contact with alcohol’?
You really never gave AA a chance. I don’t care one or the other. Good for you that you aren’t drinking. We have no corner on the market.
Just wanted to set the record straight. For example a friend of mine is in a band that will be playing at a local watering hole this weekend. me and some of my friends will be there dancing and drinking (iced tea -— not LI—and sodas) and having a grand old time. Nothing prevents me from doing this. There will be drinking and drunks and other folks there. that is part of life.
No you truly don’t. But that’s okay continue to spout
Sorry to hear that. It is in direct contradiction to what is taught in the Big Book. Congratulations. I hope your life is happy jouyous and free
Taking responsibility for your own wrongs is an important part of the AA program.
That aspect is “conservative” but I admit I see liberals and conservatives both having experience with the program.
By the way, the programs specifically for non-using family members are also very helpful -- Al Anon for wives or husbands, ACOA (Adult Children of Alcoholics) for those whose parents or grandparents had issues with alcohol. There are also the NarAnon (drug abuse) and Overeaters Anonymous programs.
I just ran through the checklist linked at the bottom of the article, and it appears I have a computer addiction; and my "drug of choice" is FR.
Actually the definition ( at least in AA since that is what started this) is as follows “We are men and women who have lost the ability to control our drinking.”
Certainly The Doctor’s Opinion does a better job of giving detail and a Vision for You tells our stories well.
Glad that you are not drinking today
Just so you know, it's not the "official" opinion that people cannot stop without AA. If anyone says that, it really is their personal opinion.
My philosophy is that you should do whatever works. And for me, I am very comfortable with the 12 steps and the 3 legacies.
WHOA! to you. That has been my experience aswell. Just a baby ——9/18/1996
You are absolutely 100% wrong. Some folks in AA may have that attitude but the program found in the book says otherwise. Since that has been the successful model, I follow that ——and it says we do not have a corner on the market
"That's a good start. But after 30 years, I would expect that he would have developed a deeper understanding of God. That's what the 11th step is all about. It sounds as though his spirituality ended at step 2."I know people with as much sobriety as Ebert who still have a problem with the whole God concept. They have as good a sobriety as anyone I have ever met in the program.
But as I tell newcomers, when you work it the way it's written, it gets even better than you could have imagined."Amen to that!!!!!! It has been my personal experience and I wouldn't trade my sobriety for anyone else's. God works in a myriad of ways in peoples' lives. I'll take my own experience "warts and all."
A "dry drunk" is someone who is an admitted alcoholic, does not go to meeting after having been exposed to AA, then goes on to live life without a drink and does NOT work the AA program.
In other words, they have quit drinking but have done nothing to change the person they were while drinking. It can be something obvious (anger, depression, etc) or something less obvious.
A "dry drunk" is not easy to quantify unless you have had a lot of experience with the person and know the person personally.
And I hope the 12 traditions as well
You’re an old-timer:
01/19/03
Actually the book refers to it in another manner. It talks about the nature of the alcholic mind. The story of the man on a business trip who decides it is a good idea to have a whiskey with milk in it, the director who insists that everyone do things his way and only his way.
I have seen dry drunks who go to meetings and are still so grandiose that they must bring their’posse’ with them wherever they go. They always having a ‘burning desire’ to talk and when asked to limit their comments to X number of minutes they most always go 2.5X.
Did George Bush admit to being an “alcoholic”? Or did he just say he drank too much at one period of his life?
I think AA just wants to keep their membership up so they invented this term.
You too. Staying sober today is the only key. Was told early on that all I had to do to become an old timer was 1) don’t drink and 2)don’t die
Congrats to you. It is a big friggin deal
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