Posted on 05/25/2009 7:06:02 AM PDT by La Lydia
...but it will be up to the Supreme Court to make a final determination as to whether a 7-foot cross remains standing in a California desert to memorialize war veterans. The cross was first erected in 1934 in what is now the federally protected Mojave Desert Preserve by a group of veterans...
w Veterans today say this war memorial and others like it across the country that use religious symbols are under attack by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU)...>p>
But the civil liberties group says the cross is offensive to Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim and other non-Christian veterans....
"If the plaintiff is so offended that he might possibly come across this cross someday, will the plaintiff be offended when he drives by Arlington Cemetery?"said Jim Sims, senior vice president of the Military Order of the Purple Heart.....
Today, the cross remains standing, but is encased in a plywood box, hidden from view in the vast desert....
The veterans groups and their lawyers say such a decision would go beyond that, and would have repercussions not just on war memorials, but on roadside memorials that dot highways to mark fatal car crashes around the nation...
According to the National Clergy Council, which plans to file an amicus brief on behalf of the veterans, as many as 140,000 memorials marked by the cross could be affected nationwide - a figure at which the ACLU spokesman scoffed...
"It amazes me that veterans groups that fought shoulder to shoulder with Jews and Buddhists and Muslims, for them to think something is appropriate to recognize as the common sacrifice of every religion by choosing a symbol that Jesus is the Son of God, is very selfish or oblivious," Mr. Eliasberg said.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
As confirmed communists, it is part of their manifesto to eliminate all religion. Statists cannot have the populace putting their faith in anything/anyone but the State. The people must look to Big Brother for everything, even and especially...
hope.
Buddhists?
And, yes, you make a good point.
The ACLU should not be able to bring such a case unless there is an actual plaintiff. When/if such a plaintiff is found, then it can go to court, where a judge should say, displaying the cross is a free exercise of religion. No, you can't take the Cross down. Yes, you can also display the religious symbols of other religions so that their adherents will not be offended.
THAT is how the 1st Amendment SHOULD work (”shall pass no law abridging...”).
If they desecrate one heroes grave then there should be blood in the streets.
Their blood, our streets.
Anyone who challenges things like this is nothing more than a hater, pure and simple. There’s no other explanation. It’s not about the Constitution, that’s just a means to cover the hate.
This land was stolen from California by illegal act of congress and must be returned forthwith. Holding breath.
Is it possible to get these lawyers disbarred?
The NRA seems to have drawn liberal blood...blood that they remember.... The faithful must do the same.
OK, hold off on the brickbats for a minute:
If this is a federally protected desert/wilderness area, why should anyone be allowed to build any monument there? Isn’t the idea to protect nature from the encroachments of man?
Seems to me the issue shouldn’t be Christianity vs. whatever else, but rather nature vs. pollution.
I’m a devout Christian, but I don’t need to see crosses everywhere to remind me of that or to keep my faith strong. Sometimes we get too caught up in external, physical symbols, but we fail to model the teachings of the One they are supposed to represent.
And building a box around the monument is just plain stupid.
I think this is a case where everybody is wrong.
Offended?Nothing more than a communist organization.Pure and simple.
Hear,hear.
I do believe the cross was there before the land became federally protected.
The cross was put up long before the preserve was created. In 2002, Congress designated the cross a “national memorial commemorating United States participation in World War I and honoring American veterans of that war.
*****Today, the cross remains standing, but is encased in a plywood box, hidden from view in the vast desert*****
The height of ignorance.
How stupid is this.
Mr. Eliasberg says that “It amazes me that veterans groups that fought shoulder to shoulder with Jews and Buddhists and Muslims, for them to think something is appropriate to recognize as the common sacrifice of every religion by choosing a symbol that Jesus is the Son of God, is very selfish or oblivious,”
What amazes me is that Mr. Eliasberg a man who has evidently fought alongside no one should be the judge of what was appropriate in 1934 for these men to have placed in the desert. Why should anyone be offended by a cross in the desert? Anyone offended by it is obviously an idiot.
Why should a cross in the desert offend anyone any more that a cross on a church. If I came upon a Star of David in the desert it would not offend me. This guy and anyone like him who is offended is a sick bigot, who needs a mental adjustment .
ACLU should be listed as a terrorist organisation.
Are you kidding? Have you ever tried to get a lawyer away from the BAR? Oh.. you meant a different kind of bar.
In which case, it should be given historical status and maintained as-is.
Remove the cover,if replaced, remove again, repeat...
Just imagine how unsettling must be those rows of crosses in the WW2 cemeteries in Europe and the Pacific to the buddhist veterans ....
sarc
This is a historical landmark, erected in 1934. As with all historical landmarks it is better left as is. People are giving way too much value to symbols, especially the left.
If they want true “Seperation of Church and State”, the courts should stay out of it. The ACLU should be outlawed for attempting to step on the rights of Americans.
I wonder if Eliasberg ever wonders why no one like him. Because I guarantee, everyone who knows him thinks he’s a jerk.
The ACLU is the FIFTH COLUMN in this country...they will NOT be satisfied until God and especially JESUS is thrown out of this country. They are ANTI-CHRISTIANS LOVE US...ACLU is NOTHING but ANTI-CHRISTIANS!
Ping!
I have lived in a Buddhist country for over 17 years (Thailand) and currently live in one of the main historical sources of Buddhism (China) and I can say without reservation that there are no practicing Buddhists who would be offended by a cross or any other religious symbol.
It is the liberals who are offended and no one else (with the exception of some silly Muslims). It just ain’t so and someone should get in touch with one of the many Buddhist organizations in the States to get involved in this ridiculous charade. This is an insult to Buddhist and Buddhism worldwide.
Judas H priest, what a waste of time
Man is pollution, in a pristine state the planet began pure and sterile but soon began to harbor parasites; once afflicted, there was no turning back.
Now in its final hour the planet groans under its load and its plaintive cry can be heard across the universe and the sun grows quiet in protest.
The die is cast and the icy winds of entombment have begun to blow.
This is the same ACLU guy who “tracks crosses nationally,” and is involved in getting them removed from state, county and municipal official seals. Wonder what he think about Las Cruces, New Mexico. Probably drives him nuts.
The cross was there long before it was federally protected land. The only subsequent pollution has been those that built the box around the cross to hide it.
And I’ll laugh at a.c.l.u. lawyers who’ve been tied in the town squares for all to throw rotten crap at.
Is this Mt. Soledad that they are talking about? I thought we finally had this thing settled???
http://www.cnsnews.com/Public/Content/Article.aspx?rsrcid=33604
Mt. Soledad Cross is Safe for Now
Tuesday, August 05, 2008
[snip]When a California state judge ordered the city to remove it from Mt. Soledad in 2006, Congress passed a measure, sponsored by Rep. Duncan Hunter (R-Calif.), taking the land by eminent domain and giving it to the Defense Department. In July, the monument was placed in the hands of the U.S. Navy. It is maintained by the Mt. Soledad Memorial Association.
“The transfer is a done-deal,” Kellogg said. “It will remain a federal monument, no matter what happens to the cross, so the issue now really centers on whether a federal monument can contain a cross as one of its elements honoring veterans.”
Rep. Hunter remains a supporter of the cross at the memorial.
“The Mount Soledad Veterans Memorial remains a proud fixture within the San Diego community,” Hunter’s communications director, Joe Kasper, told CNSNews.com. “It stands to represent the service and sacrifice of our nation’s veterans and the recent court ruling reaffirms this fact.”
I am an atheist.
I am not at all offended by a cross erected as a memorial to honor veterans. I am quite offended, however, by this and other lawsuits claiming a constitutional right not to be offended by religious symbols.
What is next? Will all of the cross and star of David symbols have to be removed from Arlington Cemetery?
I am offended by the ACLU. Can I sue them to go away?
To the hateful and mean-spirited ACLU: Please produce these "offended veterans" and let them speak in front of their fellow veterans in their own words what specifically offends them about the crosses, and why they have been silent all these years, AND why they went to ACLU to represent them (I find it doubtful that a group of veterans would go to such an anti-American group as the ACLU for help - maybe as a last resort, but, really . . . ).
The offended person on whose behalf the suit was brought is a park service employee who lives in Oregon.
I wonder how far are they willing to go? I suggest the ACLU go to court to tare down the good Rev King's house...
old professor: “Man is pollution”
Nevadan: Speak for yourself. Your post sounds like wacko-enironmentalism.
Uncover the cross. Let the ACLU come to take it down. The Civil War has to start somewhere.
Mount Soledad is in San Diego. This is a different attack on a different cross.
Maybe people will start to get the picture of ACLU now as I find it interesting that they choose such a day as today to (or close to today) to pull this stunt (for maximum effectiveness, or to hurt American pride?
“Mount Soledad is in San Diego. This is a different attack on a different cross.”
Ah, geeze....it never stops with the ACLU. Too bad they don’t have something productive to do!
And is the ACLU claiming this person is a Jewish, Buddhist AND Muslim veteran as stated in the article, LOL?
The article states "veterans" - plural. I want them to produce these individuals so they can be confronted by their fellow veterans as to why they find the cross offensive, why they waited all these years (did they just find out about the cross? Who told them - the ACLU?)? And why they don't just request to put up a marker of their own, instead of being so confrontational to their fellow vets.
ACLU - nothing but marxists
I completely agree with post #17. Well done.
As to Jews and Muslims - here's a clue. You are a minority now and always have been in America. The USA was not founded or built by you. This also goes for serving in our Military, from our founding to today. Your numbers were and are minuscule compared to all Christian faiths.
And contrary to pc bullshit, there's no Right in the US Constitution not to be offended. Yes, you have rights, BUT so does the Christian Majority in America and we are not ruled by 'the tyranny of the minority'. So if you are offended by this Cross or ANY Cross, deal with it and STFU. You could also leave and go to your home country where your religion will be the majority and you won't be so offended.
I'm sick of your 'I'm Offended' whining. Planes leave on the hour. Be on one.
/rant
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